ADR Board for trailer

[the_rustler]

If your company are pulling trailers ( only on UK work ) for another company, who don’t do any ADR work ( and don’t want ADR plate permanently fixed to their trl ) … is it LEGAL to just hang orange ADR plate on chains from the back-door handles, to do an ADR load

Had this question at work this week … I got told last year ( not MMTM - he was transport manager of another firm ) that the rules had changed and the plate MUST be “fixed” to the trl ?
Company I currently drive for say it is legal to hang the plate on chains … can any-one clarify

[switchlogic]

Id say that’s rubbish. The thing is to show it and for it to be clearly visible. In fact only yesterday I cable tied one to the trailer. Actually I always cable tie the one to the truck, I think they look rubbish screwed to the front

[damoq]

switchlogic:
Id say that’s rubbish. The thing is to show it and for it to be clearly visible. In fact only yesterday I cable tied one to the trailer. Actually I always cable tie the one to the truck, I think they look rubbish screwed to the front

Not sure the cable ties would be acceptable. I’m sure the marker board need to remain visible on the vehicle in the event of a fire. Cable ties would melt, probably causing the marker board to fall off. That’s why I’m sure the need a permanent fixing to attach them to a vehicle.

[silver_surfer]

Diesel Dave is the one to ask. He has his own little forum you could post this in, ask the experts I think. I don’t think it’s something I would be kicking off about, if the plate is there, that’s the main thing & the right way up! Amazing the number you see fixed the wrong way round, face palm time.

[dieseldave]

The Rustler:
If your company are pulling trailers ( only on UK work ) for another company, who don’t do any ADR work ( and don’t want ADR plate permanently fixed to their trl ) … is it LEGAL to just hang orange ADR plate on chains from the back-door handles, to do an ADR load

Had this question at work this week … I got told last year ( not MMTM - he was transport manager of another firm ) that the rules had changed and the plate MUST be “fixed” to the trl ?
Company I currently drive for say it is legal to hang the plate on chains … can any-one clarify

Hi The Rustler,

My opinion as a DGSA is that it’s illegal to hang the orange plates on chains or secure them with cable ties.

Here’s how I get to that opinion:

ADR 5.3.2.1.1 They [the orange coloured plates] shall be affixed one at the front and the other at the rear of the transport unit, both perpendicular to the longitudinal axis of the transport unit. They shall be clearly visible.

I think that takes care of those who prop their plates in the windscreen.

ADR 5.3.2.1.8 … If plates are covered, the covering shall be total and remain effective after 15 minutes’ engulfment in fire.

ADR 5.3.2.2.1 The plate shall not become detached from its mount in the event of 15 minutes’ engulfment in fire. It shall remain affixed irrespective of the orientation of the vehicle.

The blue sentence seems to me to take care of plastic cable ties, but I’d say that it might also have implications for properly mounted (Eg; riveted) plates attached to any plastic parts of the front of a cab such as a grille.

The red sentence specifically mentions the orientation of the vehicle.
Since the orientation is to be taken into account, the plate attached by chains IMHO might not remain showing the orange side if the vehicle were on its side or upside down.

It might seem a bit draconian and rather overly specified, but I’d say the intent of the lawgiver is quite clear.

It’s like most other legal points raised though… the law seems pretty clear, but none of us know how an enforcement officer (or court) will interpret it.

Just for completeness, you mention that it’s UK work.
UK Regs, [CDG 2009 (as amended) and ADTP ] don’t vary anything above.

[dieseldave]

Silver_Surfer:
Diesel Dave is the one to ask. He has his own little forum you could post this in, ask the experts I think. I don’t think it’s something I would be kicking off about, if the plate is there, that’s the main thing & the right way up! Amazing the number you see fixed the wrong way round, face palm time.

Hi Silver Surfer,

I too do a facepalm when I see the plates mounted in the incorrect orientation.

Here’s the bit about which way up the plates are to be affixed:

ADR 5.3.2.2.1 The orange-coloured plates shall be reflectorized and shall be of 40 cm base and of 30 cm high; they shall have a black border of 15 mm wide. …

TBH, I don’t see how that’s open to misinterpretation, so if a plate is incorrectly orientated it’s a slam-dunk even for a rookie enforcement officer.

[switchlogic]

Well fancy that…its ok though, my cable ties are asbestos. From the fifties

[switchlogic]

dieseldave:

Silver_Surfer:
Diesel Dave is the one to ask. He has his own little forum you could post this in, ask the experts I think. I don’t think it’s something I would be kicking off about, if the plate is there, that’s the main thing & the right way up! Amazing the number you see fixed the wrong way round, face palm time.

Hi Silver Surfer,

I too do a facepalm when I see the plates mounted in the incorrect orientation.

Here’s the bit about which way up the plates are to be affixed:

ADR 5.3.2.2.1 The orange-coloured plates shall be reflectorized and shall be of 40 cm base and of 30 cm high; they shall have a black border of 15 mm wide. …

TBH, I don’t see how that’s open to misinterpretation, so if a plate is incorrectly orientated it’s a slam-dunk even for a rookie enforcement officer.

To be fair though that would be a bit harsh to get a fine for. Do firemen at an incident see the plate the wrong way round and say ‘its ok lads, no hazardous, the sign doesn’t conform so there cant be’

[midnight_rambler]

You can actually buy steel cable ties
ebay.co.uk/bhp/stainless-steel-cable-ties

[dieseldave]

switchlogic:

dieseldave:

Silver_Surfer:
Diesel Dave is the one to ask. He has his own little forum you could post this in, ask the experts I think. I don’t think it’s something I would be kicking off about, if the plate is there, that’s the main thing & the right way up! Amazing the number you see fixed the wrong way round, face palm time.

Hi Silver Surfer,

I too do a facepalm when I see the plates mounted in the incorrect orientation.

Here’s the bit about which way up the plates are to be affixed:

ADR 5.3.2.2.1 The orange-coloured plates shall be reflectorized and shall be of 40 cm base and of 30 cm high; they shall have a black border of 15 mm wide. …

TBH, I don’t see how that’s open to misinterpretation, so if a plate is incorrectly orientated it’s a slam-dunk even for a rookie enforcement officer.

To be fair though that would be a bit harsh to get a fine for. Do firemen at an incident see the plate the wrong way round and say ‘its ok lads, no hazardous, the sign doesn’t conform so there cant be’

Luke,

I’m sure that you’re spot-on in your view, and I’d also agree with you.

It’s one of those situations where it’s possibly tempting fate to think it’s ok though, cos anybody could end up with a disgruntled (= pedantic) enforcement officer who is just looking to write somebody up for a ticket.

I’m sure that you’ve noticed incorrectly orientated orange plates whilst you’re out on the road (I’ve seen them too) and I guess that you’d agree that it does look odd enough to be noticeable. Now we’re back to the pedantic enforcement officer who has an itchy pen finger.

[dieseldave]

Midnight Rambler:
You can actually buy steel cable ties
ebay.co.uk/bhp/stainless-steel-cable-ties

They seem a good idea

I remembered that I’ve seen orange plates secured by metal wire too, so I think both of those methods would be acceptable under the 15mins in fire rule.

The ties in your link look like they’re to be used once only, so I guess the best kind would be re-useable ones if such a thing exists. I’m only wondering that because I’ve seen re-useable plastic ties.

[f-reds]

Why wouldn’t they just use the type that folds over to un-display the board??

[dieseldave]

F-reds:
Why wouldn’t they just use the type that folds over to un-display the board??

I think the point being made in the OP is that the company doesn’t want to permanently mount the plates, so even the foldable ones (although perfectly legal) aren’t an option. (This is a home match )

[f-reds]

Haha

At least you have a home match…

My home ground is…nothing!

[mikey_d]

I had to pick up a brand new flat trailer that had been loaded at the fertilizer factory . The 28 tonnes of fertilizer was an ADR load (oxidizing agent ) and the orange plate hadn’t yet been fitted .
I have an Orange plate with chains in my side locker , (for such an occasion I guess ) .i hung it on the trailer off the sheet covering the load .
I guess I should be locked up and the key thrown away then ! .
I’ll tell the boss next time he buys a new trailer to get it sorted before it’s loaded , it’s only a 50 mile detour after all

,

[dieseldave]

Mikey D:
I guess I should be locked up and the key thrown away then ! .

Hi Mikey D,

I guess you could argue that having the kind of thing you have is better than having nothing at all, but I really couldn’t guess at an enforcement officer’s reaction to that.

I like to stay on safe(ish) ground, so I’d say that the penalty will be somewhere in the area between a friendly word in your ear and having to spend several years hanging by your thumbs in the Tower of London.

[paulnowak]

I really hope some common sense is applied by the authorities in these cases.

My front board is attached by rivets (fold down job) but the front of my motor (bar the bumper that isn’t deep enough) is plastic. Can’t see it still being there after 15 minutes of full on inferno.

Is it the visibility of a board of that size that’s so important?

At the end of the day, they’re only flimsy bits of steel either painted or covered in sticky back plastic, which I doubt would last 60 seconds in a fire.

Might be a dumb question, but we didn’t cover any of the above on my ADR course.

Apparently ADR is a touchy subject at the moment at our place, we all “apparently” know what has happened, but no-one will ask the TM, as we don’t officially know anything about the “problem”

Let’s just say I had my boards down more last week than I have done in the past 12 months since passing the course.

I now have to sign out and in a bloody great folder before and after every run (as opposed to the 2 sheets of A4 I used to get) and a spill kit so big that I could use the bag for a weeks holiday. This is despite me apparently already having a full spill box on the back of my motor, which I check religiously, and a fully intact spill kit that I was issued with the day I joined the company (regularly checked and all items in date)

[jamiep1988]

I’ve seen magnetic ADR plates what about these ?

[paulnowak]

jamiep1988:
I’ve seen magnetic ADR plates what about these ?

Nothing ferrous big enough on the back of mine to stick one to.

As I recall, in a physics lesson many moons ago, I was told a good way to destroy a magnet was to throw it on a fire.

And certainly nothing for it to stick to on the front.

[jamiep1988]

PaulNowak:

jamiep1988:
I’ve seen magnetic ADR plates what about these ?

Nothing ferrous big enough on the back of mine to stick one to.

As I recall, in a physics lesson many moons ago, I was told a good way to destroy a magnet was to throw it on a fire.

And certainly nothing for it to stick to on the front.

The only place I’ve seen them is on the the side of my depot, I work on curtain sider (gonna be doing my ADR in a week) and the other side is al flat beds doing Generators and pump’s and such so they always have something big enough to stick it to, saying that I’ve only seen it once and that was a last resort as the lorry had been washed and the bottom half of the fold down plate on the rear tore off with the jet wash.