Chas:
I have a vague recollection of reading somewhere that it’s SAAB who are pushing the boundaries of FWD & they’re the only manufacturer putting 350+hp thru the front wheels on production cars. The same article (IIRC) claimed there is a theoretical limit of around 400hp ?
Come on now mate just because thats a fact doesn’t mean its true! Some ■■■■ on a forum obviously knows more than Saab do about FWD 
Saab have always dared to be different.
Continued with 2 strokes when others had moved on, one of the first with a turbo production saloon, hand brake acting on the FRONT wheels, gear lever lock instead of steering column.
Who owns them now? Do they still make aeroplanes?
pete904ni:
Chas:
I have a vague recollection of reading somewhere that it’s SAAB who are pushing the boundaries of FWD & they’re the only manufacturer putting 350+hp thru the front wheels on production cars. The same article (IIRC) claimed there is a theoretical limit of around 400hp ?Come on now mate just because thats a fact doesn’t mean its true! Some [zb] on a forum obviously knows more than Saab do about FWD
400 BHP + (although torque output is the more relevant figure in this context) through the front wheels sounds to me like pushing the boundaries of insanity 
.But what do I care because I’m never going to be stupid enough to find myself driving one or lumbered with trying to sell one .
Driveroneuk:
Saab have always dared to be different.
Different yes.Better no.Which is why anyone who knows anything about cars would’nt rush out to buy a SAAB if they won the lottery. It’s more likely (rightly) that it will be something with a front engine and rear drive unless it’s a Veyron.
seem to remember saab being a very good rally tool , in fact i think they still do well in the historics.
glenman:
seem to remember saab being a very good rally tool , in fact i think they still do well in the historics.
Until you compare it with the rear drive escorts and the Audi Quattro.But don’t take my word for it you’ll have to ask Walter Rohrl what the torque bias was front to rear on the Quattro in rallying and why.
pete904ni:
scottie0011:
“This post was made by Carryfast who is currently on your ignore list. Display this post.”
Thank [zb] for that
How do you do that? The man turns most threads into a shambles would be easier to ignore, and not to take the bait
Click on his name and add him to your foes list
Carryfast:
glenman:
seem to remember saab being a very good rally tool , in fact i think they still do well in the historics.Until you compare it with the rear drive escorts and the Audi Quattro.But don’t take my word for it you’ll have to ask Walter Rohrl what the torque bias was front to rear on the Quattro in rallying and why.
minis always did well in rallies too. of course it could be how much the company can throw at it as well.
scottie0011:
pete904ni:
scottie0011:
That’s a good description of the what the mickey mouse front drive so called hot hatch boy racers talk most of the time.
torque only applies to low engine speed, SHP, is the higher end of engine speed. Torque gets you started and up grades, does not do much else. Why the hell do you think they put reduction gears on propeler aircraft 
glenman:
Carryfast:
glenman:
seem to remember saab being a very good rally tool , in fact i think they still do well in the historics.Until you compare it with the rear drive escorts and the Audi Quattro.But don’t take my word for it you’ll have to ask Walter Rohrl what the torque bias was front to rear on the Quattro in rallying and why.
minis always did well in rallies too. of course it could be how much the company can throw at it as well.
Does’nt matter how much money is thrown at it a Mini won’t often be able to beat a decent ■■■■■■ rally car which is why they’re still more valuable than Minis now for classic rallying.
i think red cars are always the fastest…(now for about 10 pages where the forums most pedantic man argues against red cars )
Brentanna:
torque only applies to low engine speed, SHP, is the higher end of engine speed. Torque gets you started and up grades, does not do much else. Why the hell do you think they put reduction gears on propeler aircraft
Yeah right.So go try a 426 Hemi fitted in a front wheel drive car and see how far it would get. BHP is actually just a measure of torque relative to revs if you know just the power output at a given rpm you can calculate the torque figure from just those figures alone and vice versa.In general torque at max power will only be around 10% less than at max torque but max torque can be at many different points in the rev range depending on engine design.Compare max torque revs with that Hemi with a V12 Ferrari engine for example.But it’s power that determines how fast it’ll go up grades because torque is the measure of how much work is being done and power is the measure of how fast it’s being done.But it is possible to have more torque at the wheels,in a lower gear,at higher revs,than where the engine is producing maximum torque at lower revs in a higher gear.
glenman:
i think red cars are always the fastest…(now for about 10 pages where the forums most pedantic man argues against red cars )
No a red Ferrari Daytona is no faster than a yellow one. 
Carryfast your tordue curve is direct opposition to your RPM curve at any given horsepower, The higher your RPM the lower your torque. Your BHP on any engine is at the higher end of your rmp before it drops off again, your torque will max out at the lower end. Dont know where you get this stuff but, you are one messed up cookie when it comes to physics.
Brentanna:
Carryfast your tordue curve is direct opposition to your RPM curve at any given horsepower, The higher your RPM the lower your torque. Your BHP on any engine is at the higher end of your rmp before it drops off again, your torque will max out at the lower end. Dont know where you get this stuff but, you are one messed up cookie when it comes to physics.
Not at all just learnt it all as a works test driver that’s all.So explain what you mean by ‘direct opposition’ on a car with a torque curve which peaks at 3,200 rpm for example and a power curve which peaks at 5200 rpm 
.We’ll deal with a typical truck engine curve when you’ve learnt with a smaller motor first.
Soldier z:
And i thought i had seen it all, some bird in a 1 Series hopelessly spinning her wheels with snow socks on the front wheels
Well I can see by your argument you are the type that thinks the faster a jet turbine spins the faster the plane will go. Cant beat a gas turbine for horsepower to weight ratio can you. I again take you back to the propeller aircraft engine why do you have a reduction gear if what you say is true. USING YOUR THOUGHT PATTERN YOU WOULDNT NEED ONE
Then again why are we using heavy water cooled diesel engine in trucks that max out at 700 to 800 hp Why not just find a R1820 slap it in with a supercharger and get 1600 hp. Would not weigh as much would not need to worry about checking coolet levels, heck wouldnt need a rad, or a transmission for that matter. 0 to 100% actually war power was 110% 
Brentanna:
Well I can see by your argument you are the type that thinks the faster a jet turbine spins the faster the plane will go. Cant beat a gas turbine for horsepower to weight ratio can you. I again take you back to the propeller aircraft engine why do you have a reduction gear if what you say is true. USING YOUR THOUGHT PATTERN YOU WOULDNT NEED ONE
It’s not a thought pattern it’s a fact.You also have reduction gearing in a car and a truck at the gearbox and the diff.The torque curve depends on engine design and it’s the torque curve that sets the horsepower figure.There’s no comparison between turbine engines and piston engines.But you seem to think that a car produces more torque at near idle than it does at peak torque which is usually at a lot higher revs than idle as in that 3,200 rpm example.There is actually no such thing as a seperate measure of bhp it’s an abstract figure which just gives the relationship between torque and engine speed to reflect the description of amount of work being done (torque) and the speed it’s being done at (bhp) all of those measures are at the flywheel not the prop or the wheels after gearing and losses through the drive train.
