A step too far for me - "I need your keys, drive"

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
1

The encroachment of draconian H&S rules just leapt bravely into the absurd.

At a regular collection last night, I went through all the usual handing in keys malarky, and sitting in canteens, etc. When loaded I did the usual - picked up my keys, paperwork, and seal. But this time, an ‘■■■■■■’ picked my keys up, and when I stretched my hand out to take them off him, he told me he has to hold them until he’s escorted me back to my cab. I rolled my eyes, as did he, but couldn’t see any harm in it.

We got back to my cab, I started the engine, pulled forward to shut the doors, and jumped out of the cab to shut the back doors and put the seal on. “I need your keys” the ■■■■■■ said.

Me: “What?”
■■■■■■: “I need your keys”
Me: “So I’m between the back of my lorry and the bay, and you’ve got my keys?”
■■■■■■: “Yes, it’s new rules”
Me: “You definitely can’t have my keys”
■■■■■■: “I need them”
Me: “Mate, I’ve pulled off the bay, I’m legally responsible for, and in charge of the vehicle now. I assume you’ve not got a licence, and it’s against my company rules. Is this procedure on your trailer loading checklist?”
■■■■■■: checks checklist “no”
Me: “well there’s no way you’re having my keys then”.
continues like this for a minute or so.
He never got my keys :sunglasses:

I’m very uncomfortable with this, especially as this new ‘rule’ is not written down anywhere, and therefore not signed for. My problem is twofold. 1) They got pretty snotty and insisted I give them over on my next visit, so this will escalate. 2) I did not see any other driver challenging this, they all blindly handed them over without thought, so I think I’m on my own (again).

I really do think rules should be challenged sometimes, otherwise they can make anything up and run the risk of being more dangerous or risky than if they weren’t there. I think H&S has gone really mad at this company. How do I know I’m not giving my kets to some bearded jihadi that chooses that very moment to hijack a truck? Laughable, but it’s happened!

At the risk of the usual 5 page ■■■■ storm telling me to get over myself and get another job, what do others think of this issue? How would you approach it? What would you do and say?

EDIT: Obviously I’ll be raising this with my managers, but I’m sure they’ll side with the customer as they won’t want to rock the boat.

2

Get it written into your companys terms and conditions of haulage that the driver is responsible for the saftey and security of the vechile at all times and by hauling their product or being on their site they accept those conditions . That way if they let you on site they have acepted those terms and you can tell them where to go .
Other than that ask your boss what to do . If he tells you to give them the keys I’m sorry but thats what you do .

3

Aye it gets me boiling my pee every time I go near a security / booking in office.

I now refuse most requests (in the hope of getting barred) and last week went through the usual …
Hand over your lighters - not got one (I hadn’t)
Hand over your e-cig - not got one (I had)
Hand over your phone - not got one (I had) and this one got him puzzled. ‘You haven’t got a phone?’ he says.
‘Nope’
‘How do you get in touch with your company then?’
‘I don’t, they gave me a delivery and I’m here with it, managed it all on my own too.’
OK, I’m going to have to do a random search, are you OK with that?
Yup. What are you looking for?
A phone he says.

Not a lighter that I can use to set a fire, not an ecig that I can use to … well vape
but a phone. He didn’t find it but his face was a picture as I was driving back out and I putting it back on the screen mount.

Hopefully they won’t let me in next time.

4

Go on, name and shame…
What a crock, this last year of my working life is not going to go fast enough when you have to deal with places like this. It just seems to get worse everywhere you go… common sense has gone to hell in a handcart. :slight_smile:

5

Company is legally responsible for your Elf’n’Safety while on their premises, so I can understand them wanting to keep control of your keys/movement of your vehicle until you are on the way out the gate. Doubtless they’ve had a “near miss” (or worse!) due to someone moving the truck/releasing the brakes while the driver was closing the doors etc. Madness…

6

So the guy asks for the drivers keys while he’s closing the doors on the trailer.

Whats to stop him getting into a vehicle he has no licence for, and reversing it and seriously injuring or worse, killing the driver? Or going through the drivers belongings?

What does elf and safety say about that then?

Ken.

7

So the driver, who is about to stand between the truck and the bay, is being asked to give the keys to someone else.
If someone else was to go and close the doors then there may be an excuse for them having the keys, but this way is surely putting the driver at risk? Give the keys to an unqualified non-driver?
Looks like an ill conceived idea to me*.

  • Chuffing Insanity!
8

Ask him if he’s been drinking and point out if he has then you’d be aiding and abetting a criminal offence by giving him the keys and therefore responsibility for the vehicle. He will of course deny any alchohol has passed his lips and at this point you request a drug and alchohol test for him as you’re not satifsfied he is sober/not under the influence of drugs. All bollox of course but they started it…

9

Ezy, you have got to tell us all who TF has initiated this Bowlocks

10

Honked:
[…]
Hand over your phone - not got one (I had) and this one got him puzzled. ‘You haven’t got a phone?’ he says.
‘Nope’
‘How do you get in touch with your company then?’
‘I don’t, they gave me a delivery and I’m here with it, managed it all on my own too.’
OK, I’m going to have to do a random search, are you OK with that?
Yup. What are you looking for?
A phone he says.

Not a lighter that I can use to set a fire, not an ecig that I can use to … well vape
but a phone. He didn’t find it but his face was a picture as I was driving back out and I putting it back on the screen mount.

Hopefully they won’t let me in next time.

I’d have told him in no uncertain terms that there was no way in hell he’d get my phone, my phone is also my wallet it has a section for banknotes and my debit card, drivers card, driving licence and so on are all in it too.
I’d have said would you expect me to hand over my wallet to you? Which he’d have no doubt replied “No of course not”… Same goes for my phone, either let me in or turn me away, your choice!

11

pierrot 14:
Ezy, you have got to tell us all who TF has initiated this Bowlocks

Amazon Swansea do this (well they did a while ago at least, not been there for a while), don’t know if that is who ezy is referring too though

12

Sounds like it might be an abattoir to me…

13

Honked:
Aye it gets me boiling my pee every time I go near a security / booking in office.

I now refuse most requests (in the hope of getting barred) and last week went through the usual …
Hand over your lighters - not got one (I hadn’t)
Hand over your e-cig - not got one (I had)
Hand over your phone - not got one (I had) and this one got him puzzled. ‘You haven’t got a phone?’ he says.
‘Nope’
‘How do you get in touch with your company then?’
‘I don’t, they gave me a delivery and I’m here with it, managed it all on my own too.’
OK, I’m going to have to do a random search, are youu OK with that?
Yup. What are you looking for?
A phone he says.

Not a lighter that I can use to set a fire, not an ecig that I can use to … well vape
but a phone. He didn’t find it but his face was a picture as I was driving back out and I putting it back on the screen mount.

Hopefully they won’t let me in next time.

Where is this ?I want to real off a rant to these pricks
Cheers

14

Beetlejuice:

Honked:
Aye it gets me boiling my pee every time I go near a security / booking in office.

I now refuse most requests (in the hope of getting barred) and last week went through the usual …
Hand over your lighters - not got one (I hadn’t)
Hand over your e-cig - not got one (I had)
Hand over your phone - not got one (I had) and this one got him puzzled. ‘You haven’t got a phone?’ he says.
‘Nope’
‘How do you get in touch with your company then?’
‘I don’t, they gave me a delivery and I’m here with it, managed it all on my own too.’
OK, I’m going to have to do a random search, are youu OK with that?
Yup. What are you looking for?
A phone he says.

Not a lighter that I can use to set a fire, not an ecig that I can use to … well vape
but a phone. He didn’t find it but his face was a picture as I was driving back out and I putting it back on the screen mount.

Hopefully they won’t let me in next time.

Where is this ?I want to real off a rant to these pricks
Cheers

UPL Sandbach is one, Synthomer Grimsby is another.

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15

kcrussell25:
Sounds like it might be an abattoir to me…

Why, are they scared that escapee animals might jump in and get away ■■ :open_mouth: :open_mouth: :unamused: :unamused:

16

kcrussell25:
Sounds like it might be an abattoir to me…

Nah you don’t get any of that nonsense in abattoirs. I’ve never even been asked to put a hiviz on.

17

Honked:
his face was a picture as I was driving back out and I putting it back on the screen mount.

Quality! :sunglasses:
Love it! :laughing: :laughing:

On a more serious note however, as I understand it having a set of car keys on you when you are drunk is classed as drunk in charge so if you give your truck keys to the ■■■■■■, if he doesnt have a CE license is he technically breaking the law? Even if hes not above the blood alcohol level (which has already been pointed out that how do I know he isnt), technically hes in charge of a vehicle he doesnt have a license for.

My response to the ops scenario, though, would be “The company gave me the keys for the truck and I took responsibility for it. And ive to give the keys to someone I just met 5 minutes ago? And ive to stand in the danger area while said stranger has the keys? Yeah, that ain’t happenin’”

18

I think I posted this one before, but I used to work for a waste paper company and we collected out of Kirkham Prison.
The ■■■■ on the gate went through all the questions, I had to provide photo ID too as well as having all my belongings checked.

When he got to the phone question, I said it was a fixed phone and I couldn’t turn it off. He was adamant it would turn off or come out so he stomped me back to the cab. He looked every where and asked where is it then? I pointed to the phone buttons on the steering wheel and said you might need some help getting that out.

I like my job sometimes :smiley:

19

From a H&S point of view if you are between the trailer and the dock closing the doors you would be safer with the cab locked and the keys in your pocket rather than some unknown holding on to them.

20

The-Snowman:

Honked:
his face was a picture as I was driving back out and I putting it back on the screen mount.

Quality! :sunglasses:
Love it! [emoji38] [emoji38]

On a more serious note however, as I understand it having a set of car keys on you when you are drunk is classed as drunk in charge so if you give your truck keys to the ■■■■■■, if he doesnt have a CE license is he technically breaking the law? Even if hes not above the blood alcohol level (which has already been pointed out that how do I know he isnt), technically hes in charge of a vehicle he doesnt have a license for.

My response to the ops scenario, though, would be “The company gave me the keys for the truck and I took responsibility for it. And ive to give the keys to someone I just met 5 minutes ago? And ive to stand in the danger area while said stranger has the keys? Yeah, that ain’t happenin’”

No, because there is no offence committed by being in charge of a motor vehicle with no licence. The offence is only committed when you actually drive it.

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