Why are so many people interested in who took the picture ?
Are some of you suggesting that you never do anything that’s against the law 
What I miss here is that you Kate misses the point by a mile, if the load is that dangerous in your opinion you don’t let the driver carry on with it.
You flash your lights bleep your horn till he stops.
And than you inform the driver about the danger (in your opinion) and how to strap and secure this properly.
For all you know it could have been an inexperienced driver, or a driver inexperienced with this load.
You know if somebody was killed by this load and the picture get used in court, this could mean prosecution to the person who made this picture and was aware of the “danger” (as you state here)
You let a in your eyes dangerous situation carry on, and only made a picture to glory on TNUK??
Sad, very sad and very worrying.
If you had stopped the driver informed him and he had pushed you out the way and carried on, than I would have a lot of respect for you, but in this case ………None……………FAIL 
Where is your responsibility gone? That left when you turned the other way??
I hate people who report “dangerous situations” but don’t do anything about it.
We have enough such a people in the industry who write a 3 pages report of you not wearing your safety glasses, but let you carry on doing your job with strong acids, only to show the boss that they caught you (I was them honestly forgotten) instead of pointing it out to you and than make the report.
The rules for safe working are:
Make it safe, remove the danger
And after that report.
Not: Score some Brownie points and ■■■■ the world.
tachograph:
Why are so many people interested in who took the picture ?Are some of you suggesting that you never do anything that’s against the law
This^
I know who I would rather encounter on the road if it was a choice between someone taking a picture and someone who has 24t of stuff restrained ion a flat with one old, twisted, strap.
Granted, that might be because I have taken pictures more often while driving than I have driven around with a 24t load unsecured and others may see it differently
I bet no-one can point me toward the relevant legislation which states that it is an automatic endorseable offence to take a photo using any device whilst driving, not that such behaviour should be condoned. Under the law presumably being referred to in this thread:-
legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2003 … ion/2/made
you will see there are specific conditions to be fulfilled to complete the offence.
It states “a mobile telephone or other device is to be treated as hand-held if it is, or must be, held at some point during the course of making or receiving a call or performing any other interactive communication function”. “interactive communication” does not include taking a photo amongst its definitions. You have to be e.g. texting or on a call; even talking into it is not per se an offence (e.g. dictating) (search Jimmy Carr mobile phone).
Snudger:
I bet no-one can point me toward the relevant legislation which states that it is an automatic endorseable offence to take a photo using any device whilst driving, not that such behaviour should be condoned. Under the law presumably being referred to in this thread:-legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2003 … ion/2/made
you will see there are specific conditions to be fulfilled to complete the offence.
It states “a mobile telephone or other device is to be treated as hand-held if it is, or must be, held at some point during the course of making or receiving a call or performing any other interactive communication function”. “interactive communication” does not include taking a photo amongst its definitions. You have to be e.g. texting or on a call; even talking into it is not per se an offence (e.g. dictating) (search Jimmy Carr mobile phone).
Yes I can… driving without due care and attention is an offence in accordance with Section 3 of the Road Traffic Act 1988.
caledoniandream:
What I miss here is that you Kate misses the point by a mile, if the load is that dangerous in your opinion you don’t let the driver carry on with it.
You flash your lights bleep your horn till he stops.
And than you inform the driver about the danger (in your opinion) and how to strap and secure this properly.
For all you know it could have been an inexperienced driver, or a driver inexperienced with this load.
You know if somebody was killed by this load and the picture get used in court, this could mean prosecution to the person who made this picture and was aware of the “danger” (as you state here)
You let a in your eyes dangerous situation carry on, and only made a picture to glory on TNUK??
Sad, very sad and very worrying.
If you had stopped the driver informed him and he had pushed you out the way and carried on, than I would have a lot of respect for you, but in this case ………None……………FAILWhere is your responsibility gone? That left when you turned the other way??
I hate people who report “dangerous situations” but don’t do anything about it.
We have enough such a people in the industry who write a 3 pages report of you not wearing your safety glasses, but let you carry on doing your job with strong acids, only to show the boss that they caught you (I was them honestly forgotten) instead of pointing it out to you and than make the report.
The rules for safe working are:
Make it safe, remove the danger
And after that report.Not: Score some Brownie points and [zb] the world.
^^^^
+1
caledoniandream:
Snudger:
I bet no-one can point me toward the relevant legislation which states that it is an automatic endorseable offence to take a photo using any device whilst driving, not that such behaviour should be condoned. Under the law presumably being referred to in this thread:-legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2003 … ion/2/made
you will see there are specific conditions to be fulfilled to complete the offence.
It states “a mobile telephone or other device is to be treated as hand-held if it is, or must be, held at some point during the course of making or receiving a call or performing any other interactive communication function”. “interactive communication” does not include taking a photo amongst its definitions. You have to be e.g. texting or on a call; even talking into it is not per se an offence (e.g. dictating) (search Jimmy Carr mobile phone).
Yes I can… driving without due care and attention is an offence in accordance with Section 3 of the Road Traffic Act 1988.
Yes, but taking a photo whilst driving doesn’t necessarily mean you are guilty of driving without DC&A, e.g. if you were stopped at lights when you did it; though you might well get points for holding a mobile up to your ear in that situation, if spotted (even if it wasn’t in use!). It would be considered “driving” by the law if they so wanted. The DWDC&A charge would have to be proven and I stated an automatic endorsement, without any burden of proof. My point is that people are assuming (I assume) that it is automatically illegal to use a mobile to take a photo whilst driving, nor does doing so necessarily mean you are driving without DC&A. If something happened while a driver was so distracted then yes, otherwise probably not IMO. Picking up a phone and taking a photo looks dodgy and shouldn’t be done but it’s not an automatic endorseable offence to use a mobile non-interactively.
Snudger:
caledoniandream:
Snudger:
I bet no-one can point me toward the relevant legislation which states that it is an automatic endorseable offence to take a photo using any device whilst driving, not that such behaviour should be condoned. Under the law presumably being referred to in this thread:-legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2003 … ion/2/made
you will see there are specific conditions to be fulfilled to complete the offence.
It states “a mobile telephone or other device is to be treated as hand-held if it is, or must be, held at some point during the course of making or receiving a call or performing any other interactive communication function”. “interactive communication” does not include taking a photo amongst its definitions. You have to be e.g. texting or on a call; even talking into it is not per se an offence (e.g. dictating) (search Jimmy Carr mobile phone).
Yes I can… driving without due care and attention is an offence in accordance with Section 3 of the Road Traffic Act 1988.
Yes, but taking a photo whilst driving doesn’t necessarily mean you are guilty of driving without DC&A, e.g. if you were stopped at lights when you did it; though you might well get points for holding a mobile up to your ear in that situation, if spotted (even if it wasn’t in use!). It would be considered “driving” by the law if they so wanted. The DWDC&A charge would have to be proven and I stated an automatic endorsement, without any burden of proof. My point is that people are assuming (I assume) that it is automatically illegal to use a mobile to take a photo whilst driving, nor does doing so necessarily mean you are driving without DC&A. If something happened while a driver was so distracted then yes, otherwise probably not IMO. Picking up a phone and taking a photo looks dodgy and shouldn’t be done but it’s not an automatic endorseable offence to use a mobile non-interactively.
There has been cases of drivers fined after being seen eating an apple while waiting at traffic lights.I don’t think being stationary makes any difference,you are still in charge of the vehicle.
A photo whilst driving is bad but in that case you would look to prosecute for due care, which we’ve no evidence about.
Loose load is worse. I certainly wouldn’t want to be alongside that.
If it was a farmer, everyone would be up in arms about insecure loads and not cameras 
Dave the Renegade:
Snudger:
caledoniandream:
Snudger:
I bet no-one can point me toward the relevant legislation which states that it is an automatic endorseable offence to take a photo using any device whilst driving, not that such behaviour should be condoned. Under the law presumably being referred to in this thread:-legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2003 … ion/2/made
you will see there are specific conditions to be fulfilled to complete the offence.
It states “a mobile telephone or other device is to be treated as hand-held if it is, or must be, held at some point during the course of making or receiving a call or performing any other interactive communication function”. “interactive communication” does not include taking a photo amongst its definitions. You have to be e.g. texting or on a call; even talking into it is not per se an offence (e.g. dictating) (search Jimmy Carr mobile phone).
Yes I can… driving without due care and attention is an offence in accordance with Section 3 of the Road Traffic Act 1988.
Yes, but taking a photo whilst driving doesn’t necessarily mean you are guilty of driving without DC&A, e.g. if you were stopped at lights when you did it; though you might well get points for holding a mobile up to your ear in that situation, if spotted (even if it wasn’t in use!). It would be considered “driving” by the law if they so wanted. The DWDC&A charge would have to be proven and I stated an automatic endorsement, without any burden of proof. My point is that people are assuming (I assume) that it is automatically illegal to use a mobile to take a photo whilst driving, nor does doing so necessarily mean you are driving without DC&A. If something happened while a driver was so distracted then yes, otherwise probably not IMO. Picking up a phone and taking a photo looks dodgy and shouldn’t be done but it’s not an automatic endorseable offence to use a mobile non-interactively.
There has been cases of drivers fined after being seen eating an apple while waiting at traffic lights.I don’t think being stationary makes any difference,you are still in charge of the vehicle.
You may be right but where did that seriously happen? By seriously I mean it wasn’t some rookie or narked copper trying to make a name for himself or similar and they tried to make a frivolous case serious out of solely eating an apple at lights, if you know what I mean. Surely you would have to have done something else to have brought it to the authorities’ attention, e.g. wandering over the road, not just stopped whilst eating an apple. I bet it was after some dodgy driving and they only caught up with the perp at the lights and used the apple-eating as justification. Anyone remember that incident where a lorry driver was eating a peach whilst on his phone (this was years ago when it wasn’t illegal) and threw his phone out the window and presumably put his peach to his ear because he was concentrating on his driving. On is that another urban myth?
Back slightly OT, there was this notorious case but even then no points were accrued despite an apparently immense law effort:- independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho … 88199.html
And wasn’t some copper reprimanded for issuing similar spurious tickets relatively recently (or was it a PCSO)? Can’t find it.
OK Back to topic
Did my first load of steel yesterday, composite load all shapes and sizes including long lengths of different size tubing. As far as I’m concerned you can’t have enough straps on the bloody stuff and recheck the tension once you’ve been on the road for a short while.
Also had my 1st 4hr drop, they ■■■■■■ of for lunch half way through unloading me 
Snudger:
Back slightly OT, there was this notorious case but even then no points were accrued despite an apparently immense law effort:- independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho … 88199.htmlAnd wasn’t some copper reprimanded for issuing similar spurious tickets relatively recently (or was it a PCSO)? Can’t find it.
The incident led to the dispatching of a police helicopter in order to take aerial photographs and videos, as well as nine preliminary hearings.
Nothing illustrates better than that case why the taxpayer does not get value for money from the police, what a joke 
I once left a cup of coffee down by the side of my seat and forgot all about it, I ran from the yard in London to somewhere like Liverpool or Leeds and never spilled a drop, in that case I could have easily driven that load of unsecured steel witout incident 
I have also got no further than the first roundabout from the yard and ended up under an avalanche of gear that came flying off the top bunk when I had to slam on the anchors because a car with no lights on suddenly appeared, in that case I would’ve been cut in two by that load of unsecured steel 
I’ve had more idiots on the road than I’ve had unspilled coffee, so I would throw a few chains over that, if I was only going up the road a few miles it would be the bare minimum because I would drive accordingly, but any distance and it would be over secured 
Its an insecure load (plain & simple) and the driver would have been stopped and nicked by an observant traffic officer.
There can be no doubt that if it moved it has the potential to kill anyone who was unlucky enough to be in its way & yes had I have seen it I would have tried to stop the lorry by flashing my lights etc and let the halfwit try to explain why.
No doubt that would have meant another broken nose, but you never know he might have knocked it a little straighter for me ?