Several months ago whilst plugging away at this pointless, thankless task we call “Truck Driving”, I was unfortunate enough to encounter a moron who decided to do a U Turn on a single carriageway without checking her mirror. I shan’t bore you with the in’s and out’s of the whole story but there was a collision in which I hit her side on after some very heavy braking and swearing, which the tachograph analysis showed.
Fast forward to today and 6 Penalty Points, £425.00 Fine £600.00 Costs & A £30.00 victim surcharge later and I have got the right ■■■■■■■■.
According to the magistrates we should be able to read the minds of others on the road and deduce when they are about to do something stupid.
The sad fact of the matter is, the people that judge us humble servants have absolutely no legal qualification, and i’m willing to bet my life that they have never set foot on a truck step, let alone actually driven a commercial vehicle.
It strikes me as “blame the HGV/PSV driver”, it must be their fault - always. Don’t get me wrong, sometimes it genuinely is, and I accept that, but I am now looking forward to receiving my Crown Court appeal hearing date in the post.
Interestingly, I was represented by a Barrister at great expense today, who was brilliant, and blew massive holes in the prosecutions case and sat with her head in her hands when the guilty verdict was delivered.
I guess the point I am making is that we all do a thankless task in an industry that is rotten to the core, and that isn’t getting any better, for very little reward.
Punchy Dan:
Did you have dash cam evidence ? And would it of cut any ice ?
Sadly not. Lesson learned. I drive nothing now without my camera firmly in the screen and recording. If I had had footage I am 100% certain it would have been No Case To Answer.
I’ve just had a new sprinter and didn’t choose the £2800 radio /sat nav dash with 1 single camera that doesn’t record because I thought the money is better spent on a 4 camera system that records with screen in 4 or 1 for £750 could be Gaurdian or durite make iirc .
Steve H:
Fast forward to today and 6 Penalty Points, £425.00 Fine £600.00 Costs & A £30.00 victim surcharge later and I have got the right [zb].
Interestingly, I was represented by a Barrister at great expense today, who was brilliant, and blew massive holes in the prosecutions case and sat with her head in her hands when the guilty verdict was delivered.
Forgive me…
If you were fined and found guilty, what was the charge?
How did your barrister blow big holes in the prosecutions case but still lose?
…on the verdict, because outside London, magistrates are three unqualified persons (usually middle-class busy-bodies with too much time on their hands) who sit and listen to the evidence, and then retire to consider it.
While I’m sure some are as fair-minded as can be, there does seem to be a bit of prejudice against lorry drivers and motorcyclists, and in favour of car drivers, among magistrates, or the ‘amateur judiciary’ as a truck driving mate used to describe them.
If you were fined and found guilty, what was the charge?
How did your barrister blow big holes in the prosecutions case but still lose?
Driving without due care / attention was the charge.
The 3rd party emerged from a side road (Minor to Major) It was an open and shut case. She pulled out in front of me, I hit her square on in the Offside door/Quarter panel. Even her insurers paid out and accepted liability. Hence the reason for the appeal to be heard at the crown.
A few years ago near Wetherby on the A1M southbound a female vet in a car moved from lane 1 to lane 2 in her car failing to notice a tanker (Arclid?)close by her right shoulder.Her o/s rear collided with the n/s front of the tanker.Her car was swung round until it was pushed down the road by the tanker’s bumper bar.It has been seen on tv regularly in dashcam programmes.The tanker driver could not see the car.
The police found no evidence of any offence to pursue either driver in court.Seems strange to me.
GasGas:
…on the verdict, because outside London, magistrates are three unqualified persons (usually middle-class busy-bodies with too much time on their hands) who sit and listen to the evidence, and then retire to consider it.
While I’m sure some are as fair-minded as can be, there does seem to be a bit of prejudice against lorry drivers and motorcyclists, and in favour of car drivers, among magistrates, or the ‘amateur judiciary’ as a truck driving mate used to describe them.
The general impression that was given to me was that anyone accused of a driving offence and tried at a magistrates court is guilty until proven innocent, regardless of ■■■ age gender race religion etc. This is just simply wrong.
The amateur judiciary just about sums it up.
The prosecutor put to me that “As a HGV driver I should be exercising further caution and have a higher awareness of what other road users intentions are” I fully agreed with him, and then pointed out that I’m a HGV Driver, not a ■■■■■■■ mind reader.
The mind boggles at some of the stuff that goes on in these places. I sat in the public gallery before my trial and was privvy to some poor woman on benefits that had given her husband a good hiding fined £60.00 and sent on her way, meanwhile this ■■■■■■■ idiot gets humped for a grand.
The best bit is, I guarantee you i’ll end up with a meeting with Mr Turfitt or one of his understudys and have to persuade them that I am a reputable character.
Gidders:
A few years ago near Wetherby on the A1M southbound a female vet in a car moved from lane 1 to lane 2 in her car failing to notice a tanker (Arclid?)close by her right shoulder.Her o/s rear collided with the n/s front of the tanker.Her car was swung round until it was pushed down the road by the tanker’s bumper bar.It has been seen on tv regularly in dashcam programmes.The tanker driver could not see the car.
The police found no evidence of any offence to pursue either driver in court.Seems strange to me.
You seem to think the magistrates are to blame for what’s happened to you, what about the evidence from the police to the prosecutors all showing you at fault with no evidence from your side showing different.
If you were fined and found guilty, what was the charge?
How did your barrister blow big holes in the prosecutions case but still lose?
Driving without due care / attention was the charge.
The 3rd party emerged from a side road (Minor to Major) It was an open and shut case. She pulled out in front of me, I hit her square on in the Offside door/Quarter panel. Even her insurers paid out and accepted liability. Hence the reason for the appeal to be heard at the crown.
Thank you…
For that. I hope your appeal proves your innocence.
Punchy Dan:
I’ve just had a new sprinter and didn’t choose the £2800 radio /sat nav dash with 1 single camera that doesn’t record because I thought the money is better spent on a 4 camera system that records with screen in 4 or 1 for £750 could be Gaurdian or durite make iirc .
Have you bought this camera setup Dan ?
Ring me if you have not, i can get durite/gaurdian camera setup well cheaper than £750 .
Lot to be said for cameras facing in or out, judging what the poster said about the event it would have had a different outcome with a camera fitted.
Also you would not have had to rely on an unqualified magistrate to find you guilty.
Nothing better than some footage gets rid of the lying everybody relies on when they have not got the balls to hold their hands up.
Take it with a pinch of salt if you like Steve H, but Magistrates Courts are often called ‘Police Courts.’ The majority Magistrates do not have legal training and they are not professionals. The one with legal training is the Magistrates Clerk, the person who asked you whether you pleaded guilty or not guilty. It’s their job to advise the Magistrates about the law only to make sure there are no legal mistakes. Unless you can find someone who saw what happened and can back you up, the Magistrates get to choose who they think the guilty party are.
The appeal to a higher court isn’t going to work if your only defence is that the insurers paid up. The standards in a civil matter are different to that in a criminal case. I sympathize, but that’s how it works.
In a magistrates court you will be found guilty if you drive a lorry, don’t have a job, do have a job, keep cats, hate cats! The magistrates will fine you for a blown light bulb but drive their own combine harvesters without lights, markings, ■■■■■■ vehicles or an excise licence.
Magistrates are farmers, teachers and Rotary Club secretaries.
You hit her car, she didn’t hit you! Next [emoji23]
mac12:
You seem to think the magistrates are to blame for what’s happened to you, what about the evidence from the police to the prosecutors all showing you at fault with no evidence from your side showing different.
Vehicle A emerges from a minor road into a major road over give way line and is hit in the side by Vehicle B. Who is at fault?
Grandpa:
Take it with a pinch of salt if you like Steve H, but Magistrates Courts are often called ‘Police Courts.’ The majority Magistrates do not have legal training and they are not professionals. The one with legal training is the Magistrates Clerk, the person who asked you whether you pleaded guilty or not guilty. It’s their job to advise the Magistrates about the law only to make sure there are no legal mistakes. Unless you can find someone who saw what happened and can back you up, the Magistrates get to choose who they think the guilty party are.
The appeal to a higher court isn’t going to work if your only defence is that the insurers paid up. The standards in a civil matter are different to that in a criminal case. I sympathize, but that’s how it works.
Hence the comment above about the amateur judiciary. Nothing is closer to the truth. We have two independent witnesses, an expert witness who provided tachograph analysis that shows extreme emergency braking, yet by all accounts I should have been prepared to stop.
This is the problem. They get to choose. The law shouldn’t and doesn’t need to work like that. It needs people to stand up to ridiculous decisions made by people that do not live in the same world we do. In this case they chose a 17 year old female that had had her licence for 5 weeks at the time of the incident and clearly made a mistake by failing to give way to traffic already established on the “A” road she was attempting to join.
Wheel Nut:
In a magistrates court you will be found guilty if you drive a lorry, don’t have a job, do have a job, keep cats, hate cats! The magistrates will fine you for a blown light bulb but drive their own combine harvesters without lights, markings, ■■■■■■ vehicles or an excise licence.
Magistrates are farmers, teachers and Rotary Club secretaries.
You hit her car, she didn’t hit you! Next [emoji23]
