berewic:
So if I do 10hrs driving in 11& half hrs, take a nine, put in a new card and do the same the next day, take a nine and do 9hrs driving on the 3rd day, I’m not committing any offences?
You are correct - no offences 
- assuming that you have those 10s & 9s available to use.
site GURU got there before me - me too slow this time of night 
I got to admit I,ve not studied the changes brought in during 2007. I was off the lorries when my license ran out when I turned 50 and didn’t bother to renew it until early last year.
I’ve got a copy flouting around my gaff somewhere and it’s best I dig them out and start looking.
Thanks for all your replies everyone, even though it got bit tough going at times reading it at time!! LOL
Cheers to Graham for clarifying the rules for us, and everyone else for their input.
Johnny is now en-route to Swiss, with the said “7th Card”…
Coffeeholic:
berewic:
Coffeeholic:
berewic:
Is there a deliberate mistake here or Is it no longer an offence to drive more than ten hrs in a any 24hr period?Under tacho regs it’s not an offence and there has been no changes to that rule for as far back as I can remember.
If there has been no changes to the rules then it is an offence.
Only in your mind. There is no restriction on the driving in 24 calendar hours.
berewic:
Mon 0600-1400hrs with 6hrs driving
Mon 2300hrs-Tues morn 0700hrs, 6hrs driving adds up to 12hrs driving in a 25hrs period or 11hrs driving in a 24hr period.Which isn’t an offence.
berewic:
How many hours driving can I do in any 24hr period?Around 13.5 and remain legal.
Example
Start work Monday 06:00
Shift of 10 hours consisting of 9 hours driving, 15 minutes other work and 45 minutes break.
16:00 Monday - 01:00 Tuesday - reduced daily rest of 9 hours.
Tuesday 01:00 - 05:00 - first 5 hours of next shift which includes 4.5 hours driving, 15 minutes other work and 15 minutes break.
i make that 13.5 
delboytwo:
i make that 13.5
So do I!!!
Coffeeholic:
delboytwo:
i make that 13.5So do I!!!
are so you edit my post as well how cool 
ROG:
delboytwo:
my point is on the bases of the 6x24 hours from 0.00 Mon till 24.00 sun and to the question 0.00 Tues till 24 00 Tues you only show 8 hours and as you no rest can not be take before so the hours rest show in that 24 hour period show only 8I now refer you to this -
tachograph:
To stop any further confusion this bit needs clarifying, the start of a new shift (or end of a daily or weekly rest period) does trigger a new 24 hour period for the relevance of the daily rest requirements, but not for the 6 x 24 hour periods that this thread is about.The 24 hours you refer to is a different one - “it is unfortunate that the terminology of the words ‘24 hour period’ is used in both the different parts of the regulations - one meaning is to describe the 144 hour part (6 X 24 hour periods) and the other to descride the rest needed in each 24 hour period of a shift” - I did not say that - it was a quote from the tacho regs expert I called this morning.
ROG:
I have made a slight error in my wordings
Where I have used the word shift I should have used the wording new work period
You really should remember to take your medication ROG 
tachograph:
You really should remember to take your medication ROG
Aye, but he gets all excited when he’s reading his new books, bless 'im…
dieseldave:
tachograph:
You really should remember to take your medication ROG
Coffeeholic:
berewic:
How many hours driving can I do in any 24hr period?Around 13.5 and remain legal.
Example
Start work Monday 06:00
Shift of 10 hours consisting of 9 hours driving, 15 minutes other work and 45 minutes break.
16:00 Monday - 01:00 Tuesday - reduced daily rest of 9 hours.
Tuesday 01:00 - 05:00 - first 5 hours of next shift which includes 4.5 hours driving, 15 minutes other work and 15 minutes break.
Okay, working under the assumption that you’re driving a UK vehicle/ vehicle combination over 3.5 tonnes, the rules have not changed since I have been driving that much, and as stated in the “Rules on Drivers’ Hours and Tachographs (Goods vehicles in the UK and Europe)”, the following can be found, in black and white. “GB domestic limit (a maximum of 10 hours of driving a day) must always be obeyed. But at any time when you are actually driving under the EU rules you must obey all the rules on EU driving limits.” And to clarify; “Day: The day is the 24-hour period beginning with the start of duty time.”.
Therefore it is quite clear that as every member state under EU regs has its own definitions which are much the same, the mandarins in Brussels probably thought that they didn’t need to reiterate what a 24 hour period was (they obviously hadn’t counted on some clever peeps on TNUK). You can use hundreds of disc in a week, so long as it is reasonable to do so and all hours are correctly accounted for, but this would only be practicable if you were changing between more vehicles in a day than you had space for in said tachograph. Yes the rules are very clear in the publication that MADBAZ linked to above. So stop this foolishness about 7 days, it’s just plain wrong.
BuzzardBoy:
Right, bear with me on this before you say its not legal…My mate Johnny(Scania Doctor on T/N) is in Letchworth tonight, Tommorow he has tip Letchworth, reload Tamworth, Solihull and Littlehampton then due to ADR reasons ship out of Tilbury at 10am Wednesday Morning… Now, due to parking issues at Tilbury he is going to park at Littlehampton tomorrow night, then run the 2 and half hours to the boat Wednesday morning… Now the boat crossing is 9 hours, so he will have had a legal break by the time he docks in Zeebrugge(or made up a split 11 ferry rest), So therefore will have a completely clean card to start with from Zeebee…But, if he works Saturday, which is looking likely at this stage, that will make a 7th Card(He’s on Digi, but you know what i mean), but all his break wil be legal and above board…
So,basically, is it legal to use 7 cards in 6 days, providing all your breaks and rests are legal??
In a word, no, as I’ve just stated EU regs (and AETR) are to be taken not as a separate entity but in conjunction with the rules of the country of origin.
Which rules apply?
Within Great Britain (GB), either UK domestic or EU rules may apply. For international journeys, either the EU rules or the European Agreement Concerning the Work of Crews of Vehicles Engaged in International Road Transport (AETR) may apply. Which set of rules applies depends on the type of driving and the type of vehicle being used, and, in the case of international journeys, the countries to be visited.
Vehicles used for the carriage of goods by road and with a maximum permissible weight (including any trailer or semi-trailer) of over 3.5 tonnes are in scope of the EU rules. ‘Carriage by road’ is defined as any journey entirely or in part made on roads open to the public of a vehicle, laden or unladen, used for the carriage of passengers or goods. ‘Off-road’ driving is in scope where it forms part of a journey that also takes place on public roads. Journeys made that are entirely ‘off-road’ are out of scope of the EU rules.
International journeys to or through countries that are outside the EU but are signatories to the AETR are subject to AETR rules, which currently mirror the old Regulation (EEC) 3820/85.
For journeys that are partly in the EU and partly in countries that are neither in the EU nor signatories to AETR, EU rules will apply to that portion of the journey that is in the EU. Countries outside the EU and AETR are likely to have their own regulations governing drivers’ hours, which should be adhered to while you are driving in that country.
Vehicles that are exempted from the EU rules come under UK domestic rules on drivers’ hours while engaged in domestic journeys.
BuzzardBoy:
Right, bear with me on this before you say its not legal…My mate Johnny(Scania Doctor on T/N) is in Letchworth tonight, Tommorow he has tip Letchworth, reload Tamworth, Solihull and Littlehampton then due to ADR reasons ship out of Tilbury at 10am Wednesday Morning… Now, due to parking issues at Tilbury he is going to park at Littlehampton tomorrow night, then run the 2 and half hours to the boat Wednesday morning… Now the boat crossing is 9 hours, so he will have had a legal break by the time he docks in Zeebrugge(or made up a split 11 ferry rest), So therefore will have a completely clean card to start with from Zeebee…But, if he works Saturday, which is looking likely at this stage, that will make a 7th Card(He’s on Digi, but you know what i mean), but all his break wil be legal and above board…
So,basically, is it legal to use 7 cards in 6 days, providing all your breaks and rests are legal??
Scotchbaz:
In a word, no, as I’ve just stated EU regs (and AETR) are to be taken not as a separate entity but in conjunction with the rules of the country of origin.
I thought he was only doing EU countries so EU regs apply in which case the answer is YES
BuzzardBoy:
Thanks for all your replies everyone, even though it got bit tough going at times reading it at time!! LOLCheers to Graham for clarifying the rules for us, and everyone else for their input.
Johnny is now en-route to Swiss, with the said “7th Card”…
Anyone know what the rules are in Swiss? cos they ain’t in the EU nor do they sign up to the AETR■■?
When you drive through various member states of the EU, do you have to change your vehicle details (registration number, steering wheel from right to left, etc)? NO, you operate as regards the law in the country of origin. In most peoples case on this forum that would be the United Kingdom. The EU regulations are a supplemental to the domestic rules for the vehicles country of origin. For example every country has its own regulation as regards driving hours, but if you had to change to suit every country, I suspect you’d get nowhere fast, hence the need for EU and AETR. The government of the United Kingdom still is the only legislator for the people of the UK, and when the EU put forward new regulations pertaining to any part of day to day life, it still has to be passed by, at the very least, a group of Members of Parliament sitting on a committee and in a lot of cases by an act of parliament.
And just to be doubly clear, international law does not and probably never will take precedence over domestic legislation.
MADBAZ:
Anyone know what the rules are in Swiss? cos they ain’t in the EU nor do they sign up to the AETR■■?
Cuckoo regs 
I know… TAXI !!
MADBAZ:
BuzzardBoy:
Thanks for all your replies everyone, even though it got bit tough going at times reading it at time!! LOLCheers to Graham for clarifying the rules for us, and everyone else for their input.
Johnny is now en-route to Swiss, with the said “7th Card”…
Anyone know what the rules are in Swiss? cos they ain’t in the EU nor do they sign up to the AETR■■?
As I understand it Switzerland aren’t part of the EU but do use EU regulations for LGV vehicles so presumably the whole of the journey will come under EU regulations and therefore 7 cards are legal.
Scotchbaz:
BuzzardBoy:
So,basically, is it legal to use 7 cards in 6 days, providing all your breaks and rests are legal??In a word, no, as I’ve just stated EU regs (and AETR) are to be taken not as a separate entity but in conjunction with the rules of the country of origin.
Could you expand on what regulations will be broken if 7 cards are used ?
As far as I can see Switzerland have agreed to use EU driving rules so the whole journey will most likely not go outside of the EU regulations and therefore is legal with 7 cards
By the way when we signed up to the EU we agreed to abide by certain rules, all EU countries have adopted EU driving and tachograph rules (theoretically anyway ) and these do in fact take precedence unless there’s an exemption or derogation in place, in the case of an exemption being in place then the countries domestic rules come into operation.
Section 4:
Mixed EU/AETR and GB domestic drivingDriving limits
GB domestic limit (a maximum of 10 hours of driving a day) must always be obeyed. But at any time when you are actually driving under the EU rules you must obey all the rules on EU driving limits.
Other duty limits
GB domestic limit (i.e. no more than 11 hours on duty) must always be obeyed. But when working under EU rules you must also obey all the rules on breaks, daily rest (only on those days when actually driving) and weekly rest.Section 3:
GB domestic rules
Day: The day is the 24-hour period beginning with the start of duty time.