delboytwo:
as this post as not moved for a while and we need a few more pages i would like to know if this is legal
you are a driver that works part time and work 5 days per week for a company working under EU regs and do 3 hours each morning
on Weds and Thurs you work for some one else for 2 hours in the evening
in between the two jobs you have a daily rest
you have in fact used 7 tachographs in 5 days as
you would have to use a separate chart for each company would you not
so is it legal
you have used more cards than days worked
Ah, but the two afternoon cards could go on the two morning cards. Its only because the afternoon job is for a different employer, who will want their own records of their trucks movements. If it was your truck and you were working on two separate contracts, you would only use one card per day.
Besides, you could drive 6 different trucks, with 6 different sets of E numbers in the tacho head, so need to use 6 different cards, in one day. Does that mean you have to stay home for the rest of the week ? (Although, with that many E numbers, wouldn’t you be running around the walls for the rest of the week anyway )
It’s perfectly legal IMHO.
In fact you could do another mornings work with yet another card and still be legal.
Coffeeholic on Mon Oct 12, 2009 @ 11:19 pm:
The number of cards isn’t in dispute, you could use 6 cards in a single shift if you drove 6 different vehicles.
There is no restriction on the number of cards you can use in a week. That isn’t in dispute here.
There is no dispute Neil, the regulations are clearly written down and have been clearly decided and interpreted. Interpreted specifically for the existing recording equiptment legilsation and the previous drivers hours legislation. There has been no mention in the current hours legislation of an intent to change as it was desirable (as is the norm when there is change),from the previous hours legislation of which this current one was borne and with the exeption of a few noted changes remains very similar to the previous one. There is nothing in the descriptors/makeup of the legislation that suggests any change either.
The current ‘guidance’ from our government departments of a 144 hour figure is a hastily put together interpretation of the legislation.One which some of our members decide to stick to because VOSA said it.
When Geebee said something along the lines of
this is something we used to see regular with market traders
I’m unclear as to how long back in time he meant as the current hours regs have only been in force now for 2 years. Prior to that the wording for 3820/85 was
A driver must, after no more than six daily driving periods, take a weekly rest period as defined in Article 8 (3).
There is nothing to be tested or case law to be made, its already been done and its clearly in the legislation. The only things that are not in the legislation are [1] any mention or intent to change it [2] any mention of 144 hours. The only thing which has actually changed has been the wording which was defined by the court case.
Daily driving period is synonymous with 24 hour period. Period !!
Don’t let any amateur buffs give you room for doubt !!
Rog your missing one thing about the hours the reason why there don’t use hour is cost it may not be possible to do 144 hours between rest your not considering the 60 hour work limit cos if a driver was to follow the rule of 144 hours there driver would go over there hours by 18 hours if there did work all possible limits the driver would be allowed only taking the required breaks and no poa all other hours been work, and there is in the regs a note about it working time
The weekly driving time shall not exceed 56 hours and
shall not result in the maximum weekly working time laid
down in Directive 2002/15/EC being exceeded.
delboytwo:
Rog your missing one thing about the hours the reason why there don’t use hour is cost it may not be possible to do 144 hours between rest your not considering the 60 hour work limit cos if a driver was to follow the rule of 144 hours there driver would go over there hours by 18 hours
You don’t ‘do’ 144 hours between rests, you ‘do’ - work - a lot less than that. Just because it may not be able to work to the full extent of the EU regs due to the WTD doesn’t mean there should be no possibility of being able to fit all your work into 6x24 hour periods.a driver can quite easily start work after a weekly rest and begin his next weekly rest 144 hours later and remain well within the limits of the WTD, he might only do 4 shifts in that period for example.
what i am trying to say is the reason why there don’t use hours I.E (144) in the EU regs is cos it may not be possible to do 144 hours between rest if you work you max hours and that why there say 6x24 hour periods
if you look at this in the GV262 you will see there use the term 144 hours work
A weekly rest period that falls in two weeks may be counted in either week but not in both. However, a rest period of at least 69 hours in total may be counted as two back-to-back weekly rests (e.g. a 45-hour weekly rest followed by 24 hours), provided that the driver does not exceed 144 hours’ work either before or after the rest period in question.
which IMHO is wrong
i think the word
work
in the quote is wrong, i for a fact no that you can’t work 144 hours in 144 hours that would be illegal would it no
delboytwo:
what i am trying to say is the reason why there don’t use hours I.E (144) in the EU regs is cos it may not be possible to do 144 hours between rest if you work you max hours and that why there say 6x24 hour periods
if you look at this in the GV262 you will see there use the term 144 hours work
A weekly rest period that falls in two weeks may be counted in either week but not in both. However, a rest period of at least 69 hours in total may be counted as two back-to-back weekly rests (e.g. a 45-hour weekly rest followed by 24 hours), provided that the driver does not exceed 144 hours’ work either before or after the rest period in question.
which IMHO is wrong
i think the word
work
in the quote is wrong, i for a fact no that you can’t work 144 hours in 144 hours that would be illegal would it no
should that not say 60 hours work for WTD
I must agree with you Del - it does say 144 hours work
IMO it should omit that word
Although ROG & Del have a good point, perhaps they’re taking this one too literally.
If every possible variation on a scenario were spelled out and dissected in excruciating depth and detail, the book would be very thick indeed, and some might then look at it and say that it’s too complicated. (And then ask the reason why. )
Does it really need to mention that you can’t work for all of 144 hours or six daily driving periods (leaving aside the maths) or should it be common sense?
Anyway guys, keep it up cos the snacks have arrived.
That’s a fair point Del, but ROG’s post-count proves that he’s been causing confusion to a far higher standard than you.
But recently Del has had a better grasp of the regulations so I think it should be Del and ROG.
Yes, that’s a fair point too Neil.
Having given it some thought, some things look better a certain way around.
Eg. Bracket and Hinge ( somewhat comparable to Del and ROG ) wouldn’t look the same somehow, but I do think that Del and ROG does have a certain ‘ring’ to it.
Having given it some thought, some things look better a certain way around.
Eg. Bracket and Hinge ( somewhat comparable to Del and ROG ) wouldn’t look the same somehow, but I do think that Del and ROG does have a certain ‘ring’ to it.
Yep, like Batman and Robin. some people are destined to always be the sidekick.
Having given it some thought, some things look better a certain way around.
Eg. Bracket and Hinge ( somewhat comparable to Del and ROG ) wouldn’t look the same somehow, but I do think that Del and ROG does have a certain ‘ring’ to it.
Yep, like Batman and Robin. some people are destined to always be the sidekick.
delboytwo:
if you look at this in the GV262 you will see there use the term 144 hours work
Doesn’t really matter what it says in GV262, it isn’t the regulations we work to and much like The Highway Code you won’t be prosecuted for ‘breaking’ GV262. Concentrate on what it says in the actual regulations and not a dumbed down guide to them.
Looks like it. Any conversations I’ve had in recent weeks, either face to face or in PM, about these mega threads the other person always refers to you pair as Del and ROG. I can’t recall anyone saying it the other way round.
delboytwo:
if you look at this in the GV262 you will see there use the term 144 hours work
Doesn’t really matter what it says in GV262, it isn’t the regulations we work to and much like The Highway Code you won’t be prosecuted for ‘breaking’ GV262. Concentrate on what it says in the actual regulations and not a dumbed down guide to them.
)
Although ROG & Del have a good point, perhaps they’re taking this one too literally. 
