Sorry, I know it has been done a load of times.
New Job, I was told it was absolutely 30 mins break min at 6 hours (Talking working time only here,) and 45 mins before 9 hr.
So I agreed, but where is the actual official evidence it’s only 15 mins required after 6hr.
Or does it simply come down to just do what you’re told and just roll with it.
Cheers,
Pete
Depends on the total length of your shift, e.g. more than 6hrs and less than 9hrs, you need to show 30 minutes on tacho. Anything more than 9hrs, 45 minutes.
The no more than 6 hour working
rule is re-set with a 15 minute break.
What Sixties boy said.
(This is for Working Time only. It does not take into account DRIVING time.) The Road Transport (Working Time) Regulations 2005 Regulation 7
Regulation 7:
Breaks7.—(1) No mobile worker or self-employed driver shall work for more than six hours without a break.
(2) Where the working time of a mobile worker or self-employed driver exceeds six hours but does not exceed nine hours, the mobile worker or self-employed driver must take a break lasting at least 30 minutes and interrupting that period.
(3) Where the working time of a mobile worker or self-employed driver exceeds nine hours, the mobile worker or self-employed driver must take a break lasting at least 45 minutes and interrupting that period.
(4) Each break may be made up of separate periods of not less than 15 minutes each.
(5) An employer shall take all reasonable steps, in keeping with the need to protect the health and safety of the mobile worker, to ensure that the limits specified above are complied with in the case of each mobile worker employed by him.
(6) A self-employed driver must take all reasonable steps, in keeping with the need to protect his health and safety, to comply with the limits specified above.
In a shift you need no break (up to and including 6 hours work {7.1}), 30 minutes break (more than 6 hours, less than 9 hours work {7.2}) or 45 minutes break (more than 9 hours work {7.3}). Any 15 or longer minute break (7.4) [edit: RESETS not rests] the 6 hour clock (7.1).
Edit “work” meaning other work or driving, not POA or break/rest (or unknown).
would this be legal, at 6 hours take 15 mins, and take a further 15 min at 8:40, and work last 5 mins of a 9 hr shift.
30 mins of a break over 9 hours in separate 15 min breaks. max of 6 hours worked before a break is taken.
I genuinely, appreciate some input on this as I thought it was accumulated breaks of 15 mins minimum, and am now doubting my understanding of the rules.
Thanks.
Yes. The often given extreme example is (This is for Working Time only. It does not take into account DRIVING time.)
0000 - 0559 6 hours work
0600 - 0614 15 minutes break
0615 - 1214 6 hours work
1215 - 1229 15 minutes break
1230 - 1443 2 hours 14 minutes work
1444 - 1458 15 minute break
1459 1 minute work
1500 9+ hours rest
15 hour shift. Total 14 hours 15 minutes work. 45 minutes total break. Never more than 6 hours work. Never less than 15 minutes break (because otherwise it wouldn’t qualify for WTD). Shift ends with other work (a break would count towards the daily rest). Minimum 9 hour rest now required.
A company might well insist on you taking 30min before 6hrs.
“Rules” and “Laws” are not the same thing.
PeteMac:
just roll with it.
I would.
PeteMac:
would this be legal, at 6 hours take 15 mins, and take a further 15 min at 8:40, and work last 5 mins of a 9 hr shift.30 mins of a break over 9 hours in separate 15 min breaks. max of 6 hours worked before a break is taken.
The extreme 9 hour WORK (7.2) would be (This is for Working Time only. It does not take into account DRIVING time.)
Click for larger image.0000 - 0559 6 hours work
0600 - 0614 15 minutes break
0615 - 0913 2 hours 59 minutes work
0914 - 0928 15 minute break
0929 1 minute work
0930 9+ hours rest
9 hour 30 minute shift. Total 9 hours work. 30 minutes total break. Never more than 6 hours work. Never less than 15 minutes break (because otherwise it wouldn’t qualify for WTD). Shift ends with other work (a break would count towards the daily rest). Minimum 9 hour rest now required.
Franglais:
A company might well insist on you taking 30min before 6hrs.
“Rules” and “Laws” are not the same thing.PeteMac:
just roll with it.I would.
Agreed.
I asked this same question about a year ago. Was also told about 30min at 6hours by transport office.
After some great advice from here, eventually I just went with it - it’s better for us as drivers. If that’s what they want, then you enjoy 30mins at 6hours.
There’s 2 parts to the wtd breaks.
The 6 hour rule
you can’t work more than 6 hours at any point without a 15 min break, a break of 15 or more allows you to work upto another 6 hours before needing another 15 min break. This works the same as driving 4.5 hours and a 45. (Only driving and other work count as working time)
The total break
This is dependent on the total amount of working time in the shift, only driving and other work count as working time for the wtd.
0-6 hours of working time = 0 break required
Over 6 but not over 9 = 30 mins of break/s
Over 9 = 45 mins of break/s required.
A shift can only be have 1 of the 3 apply, so ignore the other 2
Breaks can be taken anywhere in the shift to count towards the total required, except the very beginning or end of the shift, so each break must have at least 1 min of work either side of it and they must be at least 15 mins long to count.
The 6 - 9 and 9+ are purely used to determine how much break is required in total and are nothing to do with when any breaks are required.
So anyone who drives over 4.5 hours in a shift will have a 45 for that and tick the total break box for any shift, so all they’ll need to worry about is the 6 hour rule.
These are extreme examples
of what is legal
Work 6
Break 15
Work 6
Break 15
Work 2:14
Break 15
Work 1 min
Work 6
Break 25
Work 6
Break 20
Work 2:15
Work 2
Poa 11
Work 2
Muddy K:
I asked this same question about a year ago. Was also told about 30min at 6hours by transport office.After some great advice from here, eventually I just went with it - it’s better for us as drivers. If that’s what they want, then you enjoy 30mins at 6hours.
Meanwhile in…
Civilized non slave labour jobs, people are enjoying an hour for lunch after 3 or 4 hours of chatting over a PC and sending each other pictures of their bottoms on the printer.
yourhavingalarf:
Muddy K:
I asked this same question about a year ago. Was also told about 30min at 6hours by transport office.After some great advice from here, eventually, I just went with it - it’s better for us as drivers. If that’s what they want, then you enjoy 30mins at 6hours.
Meanwhile in…
In civilized non-slave labour jobs, people are enjoying an hour for lunch after 3 or 4 hours of chatting over a PC and sending each other pictures of their bottoms on the printer.
God, so so true. But being poorly educated, mostly worn out, old bloke. I take what I can get
at this point!
Thanks for the people’s views on it, I know its a subject this been beaten to death.
Think it will come down to rules and law, roll with it.
Hi im of the opinion if you have time for a 30 min break generally you have time for a 45/50 min break which of course resets all available time back to zero
i find if you try to mix and match break times you get lost off and make an even bigger ■■■■ up
granted not the same for everyone in different situations
PeteMac:
Sorry, I know it has been done a load of times.New Job, I was told it was absolutely 30 mins break min at 6 hours (Talking working time only here,) and 45 mins before 9 hr.
So I agreed, but where is the actual official evidence it’s only 15 mins required after 6hr.
Or does it simply come down to just do what you’re told and just roll with it.
Cheers,
Pete
Pete,
The WTD is a little confusing, so you have to bear two things in mind.
With 1 after 6hrs work you must have at least a 15 min break. You dont need to take any longer. If you’ve already taken a 15 or 45 then no probs crack on.
At the end of the day if it has been between 6 and 9 hrs you need to make sure youve taken 30 mins of rest 2 x 15 or 1 x 30.
This is where the confusion of 15 mins versus 30 mins comes in. After 9hrs work the break during the day must total at least 45mins.
PaddyTheLorryDriver:
Rest breaks at work: Overview - GOV.UK
Whoa There!
That shows the WTD for mere mortals, not for we Gods of the steering wheel.
Mortals get (from your link)
“Workers have the right to one uninterrupted 20 minute rest break during their working day, if they work more than 6 hours a day. This could be a tea or lunch break.”
We get
gov.uk/guidance/drivers-hou … time-rules
“breaks:
mobile workers must not work more than 6 consecutive hours without taking a break
if working hours total between 6 and 9 hours, working time should be interrupted by a break or breaks totalling at least 30 minutes
if working hours total more than 9 hours, working time should be interrupted by a break or breaks totalling at least 45 minutes
breaks should be of at least 15 minutes’ duration
rest: the regulations are the same as the EU drivers’ hours rules”
yourhavingalarf:
Meanwhile in…Civilized non slave labour jobs, people are enjoying an hour for lunch after 3 or 4 hours of chatting over a PC and sending each other pictures of their bottoms on the printer.
+1 multiplied by infinity. Which other industry regularly features workers who try their damndest to take the least amount of break time possible? None that I know of.
Never work for more than 2 hours without taking a 30 min break for tea/coffee and a whizz - all rules complied with and mine is the most sensible! 
Zac_A:
yourhavingalarf:
Meanwhile in…Civilized non slave labour jobs, people are enjoying an hour for lunch after 3 or 4 hours of chatting over a PC and sending each other pictures of their bottoms on the printer.
+1 multiplied by infinity. Which other industry regularly features workers who try their damndest to take the least amount of break time possible? None that I know of.
Who would want an hour for lunch? Unless you’re going to do something it’s pointless, where I work I’m the only driver, everyone is entitled to a 1 hour unpaid lunch break and a paid morning and afternoon break, no one takes an hour, everyone takes half an hour and so half an hour’s ot a day.
I’m 95% a day driver, stopping for extra or longer breaks just means I get home later, that’s not to say I never do, but normally getting home earlier is preferable to me.
It’s a different mindset if you go home at a set time rather than when you’re done.
And explaining what the legal requirements are when it’s less than what a lot think is just that, explaining what the legal requirements are.
Horses for courses.
Even when the job I used to do was job & knock, that didn’t necessarily mean I would take the minimal breaks. Having a bit of “me time” during the working day was just as important as “getting home”, or some other activity like going to the gym. I did a lot of fairly rural work, so having a bit of peace and quiet in the middle of nowhere was as enjoyable as driving out the gates. After it stopped being job and knock that was even more of an impetus to not get back to the yard too soon.
The industry-wide focus on minimal requirements for breaks and rests is all too often interpreted by (some) companies as “all we will allow you to have”, that for me is the problem.
PeteMac:
would this be legal, at 6 hours take 15 mins, and take a further 15 min at 8:40, and work last 5 mins of a 9 hr shift.30 mins of a break over 9 hours in separate 15 min breaks. max of 6 hours worked before a break is taken.
I genuinely, appreciate some input on this as I thought it was accumulated breaks of 15 mins minimum, and am now doubting my understanding of the rules.
Thanks.
Yes, that is 100% legal.
Click for larger image.