tango boy:
speedyguy:
tango boy:
the hard shoulder was visible by a camera then the Highways Agency have blood on their hands!!! 
Why would they 
What are eyeballs for ?
Signals are a backup to try and warn people there may be a problem ahead and to try and manage traffic not absolve drivers of any responsibility to use their eyes and drive accordingly.
Despite masses of automated technology saying âqueue aheadâ people are forever running into the back of a queue, can you explain that one â â
Canât explain that one at all everybody is different as is eye sights, but what i was getting at if the hard shoulder was a live lane and the car was broken down they should be switching the lane lights off if that was the case!!
To add, i was coming down the M6 Fri mid morning between J6 J5 hard shoulder was being used as a live lane, there was a car in it broke down, it was still saying it was open and to use it and a foreigner nearly hit the car, donât know about his eye sight but the Highways agency should of been on the ball and closed the lane off by switching the red X on!!!
Iâve said it before, and if this was not the case, then it could be soon, that using the hard shoulder as a live lane with small lay byes for those who unfortunately break down does not take into account that it is not always possible to have a break down right by the place provided.
If one should have a problem between these parking places, and the hard shoulder is being used, a tragedy like this could occur in a matter of seconds, well before the HA has had time to put something on the overheads.
I was n/b on the M40 at 09.00this morning heading for Oxford msa for my 45 and cars were passing me in the fog, lane three, much too fast and with no â â â â â â â lights on!
While on my break I got the heads up on the situation and ran into Oxford, out on the A44 and A429 getting back on the M40 at J15. Cost me about an hour.
I for one aint gonnna use the hardshoulder of a managed motorway ever.
I see to many numptys driving cars looking 5 yrds infront.
All it takes is 1 major accident like a coach vs fuel tanker and that will be the end of them all.
Theres to much proof out there that rtcâs happen.
switchlogic:
Dan Punchard:
no thatâs not a fair comment ,nearly all coach drivers I see on the motorway are doing what I said above ,and carrying passengers I think they should be speed limited lower than lorries .
Interesting double standards there. You must see a lot more coaches than me to come to this enlightened educated conclusion. After all you must be on to something with all these awful coach accidents every week. Oh, waitâŚ
The ones that drive correctly are still stuck behind him taking 10 miles to pass that other truck 
bertiebus:
I for one aint gonnna use the hardshoulder of a managed motorway ever.
I see to many numptys driving cars looking 5 yrds infront.
All it takes is 1 major accident like a coach vs fuel tanker and that will be the end of them all.
Theres to much proof out there that rtcâs happen.
If you refuse to use the open hard shoulder because of the danger you must cause some massive tailbacks riding along in lane two on roads like the A14. Or do vehicles break down less on dual carriageways? Hard shoulder running isnât new, some countries like Holland have been doing it donkeys years
Something on the hard shoulder and I am coming up to it I indicate right this might waken up whoever is following me thatâs a good
start and if there is enough room without causing chaos at least move right a bit or obviously into the next lane.
If we all did it,might just save a few probs,seemples,letâs INDICATE at least.
switchlogic:
bertiebus:
I for one aint gonnna use the hardshoulder of a managed motorway ever.
If you refuse to use the open hard shoulder because of the danger you must cause some massive tailbacks riding along in lane two on roads like the A14. Or do vehicles break down less on dual carriageways? Hard shoulder running isnât new, some countries like Holland have been doing it donkeys years
Indeed, successfully used in countries in the continent for years, and they arenât that new over here, but itâs just further proof of the decline in driving standard and ability in Britain compared to our cousins over the water. We have more and more lNe hoggers like this guy than we ever did.
robroy:
Winseer:
I still get the âmaxwell houseâ for pulling or staying in lane 2 when I canât see ahead in the âuse hardshoulderâ section. Especially along the J12-13 stretch of the M1 going past Flitwick off and on slips in particular⌠(also past Luton & Toddington on/off slips in the same section of road)
I donât trust using the hard shoulder for a âlive laneâ when I canât see past the next bend/next hillock - just in case someone like today is sitting there, broken down for whatever reason, and youâve then got nowhere to go. Easier to stay in lane 2 until you get around the bend, over the hill crest - by which point the âhard shoulder live lineâ is often merging back into 3 lanes by that point.
Thus, I find myself not driving in them at all on these regular routes like M1 northbound past lutonâŚ
Thing is mate it ainât up to you to agree or disagree with the system.
Speaking broadly and not referring to specific stretches, this system was devised to ease congestion. They have spent millions developing these new stretches and if people are not using them it is turning a 4 lane stretch back into a 3 lane, which defeats the entire object of the excercise. Itâs exactly the same situation as middle lane hoggers turning a 3 lane into a 2 
Iâm sure that as a pro driver you are aware of the keep left when possible rule, so in that context how can it be acceptable, all you are doing is adding to the problem that is trying to be solved, hence the coffee shaker gestures.
I donât know if the tragedy today has anything to do with the hard shoulder being used, but no system is 100% safe.
The system is daft because itâs done with âsaving moneyâ rather than saving lives in mind. If 4 live lanes were wanted - then 4 lanes should have been widened and a new hard shoulder made out of part of the surrounding field added.
I agree that people like me being refusniks defeats the object - but my suggestion here is that this very scenario results from this object that very much needs defeating!
In my professional judgement therefore - Iâll judge the system ânot fit for purposeâ and will fly in the face of arguments from suits whoâve designed this daft system, and more importantly more than likely have not lost a family member to it as yet. Theyâll never be going to jail for any âblood on their handsâ after all. 
Dan Punchard:
buses:
This is a major problem.
I see it all the time.Us truckers and coach drivers should plan ahead and get in to the second lane when a fellow trucker is broken down,aa man or anything is on the hard shoulder.
Coach drivers should do a lot things but they donât ,I class them as lower than white van man ,constantly tail gating loaded or empty ,using the fast lane when it suits them the list is endless ,not proffesional drivers in any way .
Thats probably the worse generalisation i have seen here in a long time. I myself are on the coaches just now and i am just as proffesional as any other driver on the road. Talk about tarring everyone with the same brush!!!
You know it i know it and everyone else knows it. There are â â â â â â â â â in every industry. It just so happens when a HGV /PSV driver makes a pigs ear of it the consequences tend to be far worse than your everyday RTA.
Infact there are even decent white van men out there too.
I have seen examples of bad driving from every class of road user in my 30 years on the road. But for you to think that all coach drivers are unprofessional just shows how unprofessional you are yourself.
I came off the ferry at Cairnryan today. In the ferry terminal i was cut up by a Montgomery tanker so he could exit the terminal before me. God forbid he might get caught behind a coach sticking to the 50mph speed limit.
He completely wasted his time as i caught up with him on the Glenluce bypass crawler lane. So there he was stuck behind me until the next overtaking section.
Which he passed me on the limiter. I just let him go. One day his luck will run out . Just so long as it dont involve me he can crack on being a prat
Winseer:
The system is daft because itâs done with âsaving moneyâ rather than saving lives in mind. If 4 live lanes were wanted - then 4 lanes should have been widened and a new hard shoulder made out of part of the surrounding field added.
I disagree, we cant keep building over countryside. Iâm a fan of smart motorways but if the alternative was tarmac over yet more countryside then Iâd happily make do with fewer lanes.
The vast majority of hard shoulder RTCâs are nothing to do with Smart Motorways and using the hard shoulder as a live lane. They happen with frightening regularity on ânormalâ motorways or on smart sections when the h/s isnât live, as this incident did. A point missed by the terminally bewildered on this thread who ignore the facts because it doesnât fit in with their need to hog lanes.
So given this fact perhaps we should all use lane 2 at all times in case something breaks down and pulls on the hard shoulder, or perhaps they already do this. Or just stop using motorways because a vehicle could breakdown and come to a halt in any lane at any time.
But then thereâs other roads vehicles can break down on? Itâs a conundrum.
Maybe just the pant wetters who canât successfully use a system proven to work and ease congestion should stop driving and leave it to others who can. 
tango boy:
switchlogic:
Winseer:
The system is daft because itâs done with âsaving moneyâ rather than saving lives in mind. If 4 live lanes were wanted - then 4 lanes should have been widened and a new hard shoulder made out of part of the surrounding field added.
I disagree, we cant keep building over countryside. Iâm a fan of smart motorways but if the alternative was tarmac over yet more countryside then Iâd happily make do with fewer lanes.
+1
Look at the new M74 Extention. It was hailed as the answer to congestion on the M8 Kingston bridebridge⌠Not a bit of difference on the M8 westbound from the friut market cut off.
Infact it has just added to the congestion at the M74/ M77/ M8 merge making the bottle neck far worse.
Building new roads is not the only answer to congestion. We need to manage the existing traffic and roads better than ever before. Smart motorways are ok and do help in some instances.
But building more roads just moves the congestion from one road to another âŚIMHO
Forgive me if I come across as a bit naĂŻve. I really donât understand HOW these accidents occur. We all drive past stranded cars on the hard shoulder every day. Can anyone offer any theories as to why they get piled into with alarming regularity??
eagerbeaver:
Forgive me if I come across as a bit naĂŻve. I really donât understand HOW these accidents occur. We all drive past stranded cars on the hard shoulder every day. Can anyone offer any theories as to why they get piled into with alarming regularity??
Ok i will kick off with âadjusting sat navâ
Anyone want to give another ?
eagerbeaver:
Forgive me if I come across as a bit naĂŻve. I really donât understand HOW these accidents occur. We all drive past stranded cars on the hard shoulder every day. Can anyone offer any theories as to why they get piled into with alarming regularity??
Drivers not paying full attention and drifting.
Take your eyes off the road for a few seconds to play with your phone or whatever. Youâll hear the rumble strip. Same happens if you start to nod.
Having a gander at the bird in the short skirt passing you in the X5
switchlogic:
Winseer:
The system is daft because itâs done with âsaving moneyâ rather than saving lives in mind. If 4 live lanes were wanted - then 4 lanes should have been widened and a new hard shoulder made out of part of the surrounding field added.
I disagree, we cant keep building over countryside. Iâm a fan of smart motorways but if the alternative was tarmac over yet more countryside then Iâd happily make do with fewer lanes.
If weâre to stop building over countryside - we need to stop breeding like rabbits first. At least those of us that do.
This country isnât getting any bigger, despite itâs constantly expanding population.
If âsmartâ motorways are some mamby-pamby âgreenâ thing then I spit on it - because it kills people. Thereâs never going to be anything smart about some rich people getting rewarded for a fancy idea, or at least not having anything in âtheir back yardâ - whilst someone else theyâve never met risks life and limb trying to follow the stupid, unsafe system that as Iâve said - was âdesigned to save money not livesâ.
I agree with the idea of âif you canât expand, then donât build it at all.â though. Iâll make do with fewer lanes, as we all do when driving on roads like the M2, M45, etc. all the time. Two lanes with a proper hard shoulder is always going to be safer than 3 lanes without one.
