Carryfast:
The 80%+ rate of income tax for high earners in the 1970’s did’nt ‘affect us all’ in the same way that reducing it to 45% and putting it all on road fuel duty instead did.
It does get round to everyone eventually one way or another. For example you put a higher rate on top earners and then all they do is get bigger payrises to make up for it, that money has to come from somewhere, probably their employer’s profits. Less profits means less dividends for shareholders, which probably affects us all either directly or by way of affecting the value of pension funds.
It might seem a bit far fetched in that example but there’s a way of linking most tax rises to just about everyone.
TBH He was committed to a 1p rise plus inflation which would have given us a 6p rise. So you can look at it as a 7ppl reduction, although the extra VAT he is getting from the current high prices will probably keep his books balanced.
Rikki-UK:
If someone has the chance to punch you in the face 10 times, but only does it 9 times, should you be grateful or would you prefer he didnt do it at all?
Not at all of course but that analogy doesn’t work. To make your analogy work you need to ask “would you like to be punched in the face 10 times or in the nuts 10 times?” Not being punched at all isn’t an option, the money has to come from somewhere. If they massively cut fuel duty, they’ll have to massively increase some other tax and like it or not whatever or whoever you tax it all affects us all anyway in the end.
Paul
I can’t fault Paul’s thinking here, it has to come from somewhere, think yourselves lucky that road transport has had a small but welcome reprieve for the time being.
Carryfast:
The 80%+ rate of income tax for high earners in the 1970’s did’nt ‘affect us all’ in the same way that reducing it to 45% and putting it all on road fuel duty instead did.
It does get round to everyone eventually one way or another. For example you put a higher rate on top earners and then all they do is get bigger payrises to make up for it, that money has to come from somewhere, probably their employer’s profits. Less profits means less dividends for shareholders, which probably affects us all either directly or by way of affecting the value of pension funds.
It might seem a bit far fetched in that example but there’s a way of linking most tax rises to just about everyone.
Paul
Far fetched is right but the facts of the economy as it stood in the mid 1970’s and 1980 shows the results of high fuel costs regardless of how the basic flaws and unfairness in running a Thatcherite economic ideology is dressed up.
One point not mentioned here is the fact that he is going to tax the oil companies more and regardless of how he said they will not do it they WILL increase the cost of initial supply to absorb paying extra tax!
Wheel Nut:
In the other thread entitled. “It’s the budget tomorrow”, a couple of soothsayers mentioned what would happen.
I mentioned having less planning constraints
And after years of our local Conservative councils telling us how bad that fat zb Prescott was in his plans to decimate what remains of our local green belt to house more Londoners we now find out that this Tory zb is probably likely to be even worse.
It doesn’t make any ■■■■■■■ difference and anyone who thinks it does is being naive. The only direction that fuel prices are going in the short, medium and long term is north. Diesel will still continue rise at the current rate and I reckon will be £1.60-1.70/litre by the end of the year.
surely the daftest thing to come out of the tories yesterday was the increase in tax to the oil companies will not mean an increase at the pump to the general public because of “competition” wtf! one garage puts it up a penny and within minutes all others in the area have followed suit, are these people really so far removed from reality?
i love all this talk of the “monies got to come from somewhere”, to what end, the deficit grows, government borrowing is increassing and now the fella openly admits that any plan to clear the deficit in this gvernment term has gone out the window and may now take far longer than expected, no ■■■■, you mean to say reducing the amount of money people have to spend and putting people out of work isn’t good for the economy?
the only thing that he could have done he dismissed,
Hauliers are the life blood of industry and also every day life, giving the industry an essential user rebate, giving British Hauliers the opportunity to fill up in the Uk at prices comparable to those in Europe would have been far more effective for the industry than the 1p of a litre and the postponed fuel escalator.
We are paying the highest fuel prices already, promising not to add an increase, and too remove only the last percentage increment of a punative tax in no way goes towards creating a level playing field
To put it in simple terms
He was demanding £10 (random figure) exorbitant tax off us all
and next month it was going to be £11
Now it wont go to £11 and in fact will only be £9
and we are supposed to be grateful he is only robbing the £9 instead of the £11
paul b:
surely the daftest thing to come out of the tories yesterday was the increase in tax to the oil companies will not mean an increase at the pump to the general public because of “competition” wtf! one garage puts it up a penny and within minutes all others in the area have followed suit, are these people really so far removed from reality?
Agree.
i love all this talk of the “monies got to come from somewhere”, to what end, the deficit grows, government borrowing is increassing and now the fella openly admits that any plan to clear the deficit in this gvernment term has gone out the window and may now take far longer than expected, no [zb], you mean to say reducing the amount of money people have to spend and putting people out of work isn’t good for the economy?
Maybe you should ask your Labour chums for some answers as it was mainly them that got us into this mess.
there is no such thing as get rich quick!
in any walk of life to make more money you have to invest, be it time or money.
by taking money out of people’s pockets to fill a hole quickly will never work because the people with less money stop or cut down buying the tax lucritive luxuries, wether it be ■■■■, drink or petrol.
so by putting the idea into the heads of the masses that taxes will rise, everybody tightens up the ■■■■■ strings and the duty and vat lost creates a bigger hole and thus increases taxes further.
The Saxmachine:
Time to move abroad. At least you have an idea of what you are paying for in taxes
shut the door on the way, there’s a good chap, oh and you wont need any state pension money or NHS benefits then.
Like there are too many lorries on the road, there are also too many cars with one driver in them going to a non job. If fuel rises for them, it might make them realise they can do what they do in the office from home. That leaves the roads clear for transport to move goods.
And if you boycott China and its imports that will help
The Saxmachine:
Time to move abroad. At least you have an idea of what you are paying for in taxes
shut the door on the way, there’s a good chap, oh and you wont need any state pension money or NHS benefits then.
Like there are too many lorries on the road, there are also too many cars with one driver in them
So we make road fuel so expensive that no one can afford it.
And having plenty of trucks on the road and big cars used for recreational use did’nt do the American economy any harm in the 1960’s.
And by the time Cam and Clegg have finished there won’t be an NHS or state pension worthy of the name anyway and good riddance.It’s just that under the new Communist idea of capitalism they won’t pay the wages to pay for a decent private pension and health insurance either.
Well most pensioners are below the poverty line any way and there’s talk of privatising the nhs, and you know full well they won’t remove ni and if thy do it will go on your tax. So tell me what that’s all worth when you are an arthritic poverty stricken pensioner! Or go abroad, still work hard but have a nice climate for a change.
Look ere me ol mateys…you and i know that no one in this country has any backbone eg : any problems in any othjer country, theyre all marching, fighting, blockaiding, setting light to everything, until they get what they want…here in the uk we have the transport industry fighting itself…i9f company drivers walked out…owner drivers, and other small companies would rub their hands together…because we are not united…i wonder how many people shouting on here are actually owner drivers…or company drivers…i am not being sarcastic…but if its company drivers…fuel duty wont affect them too much…but it will their bosses, and you can understand the owner drivers cos they are not being allowed to increase the rates…but like i say …we are not united in this industry…if we were, we could get whatever we wanted from our government…and dont say the foreigners would do the work…for if we were militant…they wouldnt be able to driver their trucks because of the damage caused to them…get it…anyway…we just sit and take it, and call them all the names under the sun…but we still take it…if the government said they are going to take 50% of your wage to pay off the national debt…most would just sit and take it…and swear…and take it again…and again…
Previous and present governments have said they will tax the foreign trucks working in the uk, or using uk roads…but they are stretching it a bit…■■■■, booze etc is going up immediately…wheres the foreign tax ■■
we have the means already in place…for years the uk international traffic always had to pay the benelux tax via the ferry companies…well they are still there…so just do it in reverse…let the ferry companies charge every company who uses the ferry/train…take 1% for their troubles, and bobs your uncle…give the rest to uk plc…or is that too difficult…failing that…get the germans over to install their maut system…and fannys your aunt…all up and running before the government can say, once again…were going to charge the foreigners to use our roads`.ha ha dont make me laugh.
Maybe if a few thousand Wagons were parked across the road network like the Stobart chilled one in the knock Stobbies thread,maybe just maybe things would be different in this country!! But we all know it will NEVER happen EVER!!
Folk can rabbit on blaming the government but who are the ones who’s been lumping the price of a litre up over 20p since the turn of the year EVEN THOUGH the cost of a barrel is at the same level as 1998 or something daft■■?
Your oil companies with their 400 trillion pound plus annual profits thats who!
As for hard times in general, its Labour scum who got us into this mess and its the current guv who are having to prevent us turning into another Iceland! Folk have such short memories
