guardian.co.uk/society/2012/ … sfeed=true
so come on then whats everyones views…
terriers:
Boris Johnson launches unpaid work scheme for young Londoners | Young people | The Guardianso come on then whats everyones views…
I read this in the Telegraph and it said that school leavers have to do 12 weeks unpaid work before getting any dole money, sounds good to me, but I still object to these companies expecting vocational drivers to work for nothing
Wheel Nut:
terriers:
Boris Johnson launches unpaid work scheme for young Londoners | Young people | The Guardianso come on then whats everyones views…
I read this in the Telegraph and it said that school leavers have to do 12 weeks unpaid work before getting any dole money, sounds good to me, but I still object to these companies expecting vocational drivers to work for nothing
tbh i think its wrong but its just my opinion… haveing to have to have been on the dole and i hated every min of it cause they be little you and make you feel a right arse… but the likes of some people who stroll in there every 2 weeks sign on with out the hassle the genuin people who want to work get… they know them buy first name turms and seem to get left alone cause they dont want to work…
when i got made unemployed just befour xmas i made a phone call to the pop facotry i worked in when i left school and i was told to come down cause theres a months work there “off the books” but that turned into bout 6 months worth… during the time i wasent claiming dole or cheeting the system in anyway but when i did eventualy sign on god it was like id walked in with 2 heads… i explaied i was made unemployed in the previous nov… and they were asking me why it had taken me till may to sign on and what i had been living on ect i said i had been living on savings ect… god i had a right mouth full… and sitting next to me was a guy i know who hasent worked in about 3 years and claiming everything but yet he wasnt getting have the verbal ■■■■ storm i was getting… i stayed on the dole for about a month befour i gave up and said forgoet it because i was fed up of all the bull ■■■■ i was getting…
whats to stop companys after the 12 weeks saying that the person is not suitable for the role in which they been working then they get another on in for another 12 weeks or what ever the period is… thus getting more or less free labour?
When politicians don’t have any good ideas on how to deal with a problem , they come up with something like this, just so that they can appear to be doing “something”.
It didn’t work when called workfare and it won’t work now.
All that happens is that a company gets cheap labour for while, the young people may get a tiny bit of experience but rarely get as job at the end of it.
The experience they do get is by and large a bit of training doing a job that only requires any kind of training at all becuase it has been dressed up a bit, e.g floor sweeping becomes “base level hardstanding hygiene operative” .
No matter how skilled the kids are, no matter how willing they are, if there are no jobs then they won’t get one, simples!.
The only way to get people into work is
a) reduce the number of foreigners coming in to the country.
b) invest in projects that create jobs.
c) stop companies taking profits earned in Britain to invest elsewhere and encourage them to invest here
d) treat euro laws on fair competition in the same way the other countries do, i.e. putting Britain first.
edited to add WTF has it do with Boris anyway?
is every town mayor to have the same authority to amend the rules on social security
del949:
When politicians don’t have any good ideas on how to deal with a problem , they come up with something like this, just so that they can appear to be doing “something”.
It didn’t work when called workfare and it won’t work now.
All that happens is that a company gets cheap labour for while, the young people may get a tiny bit of experience but rarely get as job at the end of it.
The experience they do get is by and large a bit of training doing a job that only requires any kind of training at all becuase it has been dressed up a bit, e.g floor sweeping becomes “base level hardstanding hygiene operative” .
No matter how skilled the kids are, no matter how willing they are, if there are no jobs then they won’t get one, simples!.
The only way to get people into work is
a) reduce the number of foreigners coming in to the country.
b) invest in projects that create jobs.
c) stop companies taking profits earned in Britain to invest elsewhere and encourage them to invest here
d) treat euro laws on fair competition in the same way the other countries do, i.e. putting Britain first.
exactly…
my mother works in a factory and we used to do a bit of work for them when i was in the pop warehouse cause they used to fill bottles of lucozade… but the mojority of their work was bottleing and packing shampoo for alberto culver and there was a old guy there whos only job was to empty the bin of cardbord and compact it… when he was due to retire then had a young lad of 16 shadow him for 2 weeks to learn how to do the job?
when the young lad left a few months after he could put on his cv that he had experiance of being a hygine opretive or so he was told buy the company
If you work for nothing, how do you prove that you’ve done it?
No payslip with “zero” on it will presumably be given, since everyone involved in the whole scheme is a tightwad only looking to exploit some actual workers (the workshy still managing to sidestep the whole thing I reckon!)
Anyone with a profession should be exempted from the whole daft scheme, as having a profession I would have thought is mutually exclusive from being one of the “workshy” who are hardly qualified to wipe their arses and sign their name once a fortnight! 
Winseer:
If you work for nothing, how do you prove that you’ve done it?No payslip with “zero” on it will presumably be given, since everyone involved in the whole scheme is a tightwad only looking to exploit some actual workers (the workshy still managing to sidestep the whole thing I reckon!)
Anyone with a profession should be exempted from the whole daft scheme, as having a profession I would have thought is mutually exclusive from being one of the “workshy” who are hardly qualified to wipe their arses and sign their name once a fortnight!
the dole is ment to be there to help… but it just screws the people who want to work but cant find work over… yet the likes of people who dont work and never worked its just hands out money… and £56 a week so thats £112 every two weeks… how are you ment to live on that? cause lets face it alot of 18 - 24 yr olds are living on their own or with partners they dont have their perants to fall back on…
i just heared on the radio news now that they be expected to go and volentire for a charity? no diss respect to charitys but what “work” experiance would they get there?
I could say that if you want to reduce the dole queues to zero, then scrap unemployment/incapacity benefit outright, and double the threshold for tax credits.
That way, even the workshy will be climbing over each other to get their “24 hours credit” in paid or not. It would obviously be a lot easier to “create” a job for yourself unpaid, than even at minimum wage, so I can’t see any reason why anyone can moan about “starving” etc.
If you choose not to participate, then that’s ok by society too - as you’ll be off the radar for benefits altogether, probably living in cardboard box city or with some idiot who’s decided to put you up for free.
Most long-term signers do it because “they’d be worse off if they got a job” which really means
(a) they are getting too much benefit for doing nothing
(b) minimum wages don’t pay the bills
(c) The only jobs arbitrarily available ARE at minimum wage!
Since you can’t easily increase the number of jobs available paying well above the minimum wage, (c) represents the piece that cannot be moved here.
(b) will be solved by the recession turning into full-blown depression, which of course drops the prices of just about everything ONCE the bottom is allowed to fall out to get there. Meanwhile, we continue to just gently play “Autumn” on the deck of the Titanic, pretending that all this cannot happen when it actually needs to happen.
(a) It occurs to me that even a lazy person would rather do “a little for a lot” than “nothing for very little”, and has the bi-product of taking would-be hooligans and petty criminals off the streets as well, since they’re otherwise occupied for their 8 hours a day or whatever. 
In Theory a good idea, but if everyone of that age is doing unpaid work, it is going to produce even less paying jobs isnt it, the work will be being done by this lot 
JLS Driver SOS:
In Theory a good idea, but if everyone of that age is doing unpaid work, it is going to produce even less paying jobs isnt it, the work will be being done by this lot
but the unemployed numbers will be down - and thats a good thing as far as the Government are concerned .
beefy4605:
JLS Driver SOS:
In Theory a good idea, but if everyone of that age is doing unpaid work, it is going to produce even less paying jobs isnt it, the work will be being done by this lotbut the unemployed numbers will be down - and thats a good thing as far as the Government are concerned .
aint that what they want tho? makes them loook good on paper ect ect ect
To be fair, it’s a better idea than the one they had a few weeks ago, getting all the unemployed to start their own business. I mean that can work if you have a) half a brain and a bit of business sense, and b) you actually have an idea you can make a business out of.
All they want is to the get the unemployed numbers down, they don’t give a rats about the follow up to it.
It would be worth it just to pay them the same money net for doing some menial job like picking up leaves, or fishing bikes out of the canal.
It’s the keeping them off the streets that is the real useful bit of productivity, as I’m sick to death of finding “yoof” that are supposed to have no cash to spend, hogging promenades, noisying about outside takeaways, etc. 
Until there’s a way of sorting out those that want to work, from those that don’t, it will be a disaster.
Unfortunately there’s not enough of a work ethic amongst the young in this country, many of whom expect to be given everything on a plate, or have no clue about how to go and find work, that too many simply sign on because they don’t have the initiative, let alone the education to imagine doing anything else.
Too many simply want to sit around, playing with their wii or watching Sky, rather than actually thinking about how they could help themselves.
Then there’s those that do want to work, but simply need a few quid to tide them over until their efforts at finding work bear fruit. They’re the ones that will be hit hardest. Unfortunately.
And yes, I was young once. I was without a job once. And I went and found work that paid enough for me to go and find other work that paid more. I hated signing on but I had enough pride and self belief that I vowed to myself I would never do it again. And I haven’t.
I don’t think this is a great idea, but this government don’t seem to have anything that resembles intelligent thinking, preferring the knee-jerk, cost cutting, Daily Mail pleasing policies they’ve been following since they were voted into power.
del949:
When politicians don’t have any good ideas on how to deal with a problem , they come up with something like this, just so that they can appear to be doing “something”.
It didn’t work when called workfare and it won’t work now.
All that happens is that a company gets cheap labour for while, the young people may get a tiny bit of experience but rarely get as job at the end of it.
The experience they do get is by and large a bit of training doing a job that only requires any kind of training at all becuase it has been dressed up a bit, e.g floor sweeping becomes “base level hardstanding hygiene operative” .
No matter how skilled the kids are, no matter how willing they are, if there are no jobs then they won’t get one, simples!.
The only way to get people into work is
a) reduce the number of foreigners coming in to the country.
b) invest in projects that create jobs.
c) stop companies taking profits earned in Britain to invest elsewhere and encourage them to invest here
d) treat euro laws on fair competition in the same way the other countries do, i.e. putting Britain first.edited to add WTF has it do with Boris anyway?
is every town mayor to have the same authority to amend the rules on social security
It’s probably not Boris who’s actually running the show it’s more like Tebbit’s lot are still behind the scenes actually making policy while the ones in government just follow orders.It’s only b) that you’re wrong about there del.The only way you’ll create jobs is to start employing people making things here for the domestic market and paying them well for their efforts so they can then spend the money earn’t on buying more of those things and forget all about the idea of the global free market economy in which we’re always going to be losers. 
This idea is the total opposite of that policy so if they can get some workers to work for nothing then why bother paying anyone else so you’ll end up with a downward spiral of less pay means less spending means more on the dole means more people having to work for their ‘benefits’ etc etc etc.The Labour government shot itself in the foot (more like stabbed it’s own people in the back) by going for a government controlled so called ‘social security’ national ‘insurance’ scheme (scam) that can be manipulated to suit this type of idea.
If they’d have been genuine then they’d have made the terms and ‘benefits’,as they stood when the scheme was introduced,subject to contract and inflation linked,like any other income protection insurance policy when it’s taken out,from the day of introduction.Instead of which the terms of the policy can be altered and messed with by whoever is in government with no recourse to the courts for breach of contract which is actually what this type of idea is just like the ‘all work test’ for,what was,‘Sickness Benefit’ then Incapacity Benefit and now something else.
It seems obvious that this idea is just a way of circumventing the idea of a proper wage to do a job and there was a time when any such government policy would have caused an immediate strike in any workplace,where such type of placement was implemented,backed by the TUC.
EastAnglianTrucker:
Until there’s a way of sorting out those that want to work, from those that don’t, it will be a disaster.Unfortunately there’s not enough of a work ethic amongst the young in this country, many of whom expect to be given everything on a plate, or have no clue about how to go and find work, that too many simply sign on because they don’t have the initiative, let alone the education to imagine doing anything else.
Too many simply want to sit around, playing with their wii or watching Sky, rather than actually thinking about how they could help themselves.
That seems like a stereotypical painting of different individuals with the same brush.The fact is it’s always been the case that the population varies individually in everything from outright criminals to hard working demobbed ex war veterans who worked hard before they were called up and after they were demobbed.There wasn’t much point in the latter groups’ efforst if you’re now going to brand their descendents all under the same heading with benefits fraudsters.
Carryfast:
That seems like a stereotypical painting of different individuals with the same brush.The fact is it’s always been the case that the population varies individually in everything from outright criminals to hard working demobbed ex war veterans who worked hard before they were called up and after they were demobbed.There wasn’t much point in the latter groups’ efforst if you’re now going to brand their descendents all under the same heading with benefits fraudsters.
Can you actually read Carryfast?
I went to extravagent lengths to differentiate between those that do want to work and those that don’t. How is that painting everyone with the same brush? And where exactly have I made any mention of benefits fraudsters?
I was talking about work ethic, personal initiative and a lack of education. What planet are you on again?
EastAnglianTrucker:
Carryfast:
That seems like a stereotypical painting of different individuals with the same brush.The fact is it’s always been the case that the population varies individually in everything from outright criminals to hard working demobbed ex war veterans who worked hard before they were called up and after they were demobbed.There wasn’t much point in the latter groups’ efforst if you’re now going to brand their descendents all under the same heading with benefits fraudsters.Can you actually read Carryfast?
I went to extravagent lengths to differentiate between those that do want to work and those that don’t. How is that painting everyone with the same brush? And where exactly have I made any mention of benefits fraudsters?
I was talking about work ethic, personal initiative and a lack of education. What planet are you on again?
You did say there’s not enough of a work ethic amongst ‘the young’ of this country ‘many of who’ expect to be given everything on a plate.
If someone is claiming jobseekers allowance then the deal is that they have to be looking for work which follows that they’ll need a ‘work ethic’ to do that.Anything other than that is (rightly) classed as a type of benefit fraud.In just the same way any one who says that they haven’t got a job to offer at the minimum wage but then says that they can employ someone who’s forced to work for unemployment benefit (should be) a type of fraud too.