V8Lenny:
Volvos I-■■■■ best automated box only if they could take the torque of big 16 liters.
They all seem to rely on some sort of torque output reduction in certain gears under certain conditions.But it’s difficult to see how,what seems to be a helical single counter shaft design,can stay with let alone trump Fuller’s straight cut twin countershaft design.
Quite simply a helical gear has more than one tooth engaged at any time.But a helical gear under load trys to wind its self forward or backwards within its case.
People rave about I shift,really its poor from an engineering point of view whereas the AS Tronic and now Traxon is a twin countershaft box.
Carryfast:
They all seem to rely on some sort of torque output reduction in certain gears under certain conditions.But it’s difficult to see how,what seems to be a helical single counter shaft design,can stay with let alone trump Fuller’s straight cut twin countershaft design.
Quite simply a helical gear has more than one tooth engaged at any time.But a helical gear under load trys to wind its self forward or backwards within its case.
People rave about I shift,really its poor from an engineering point of view whereas the AS Tronic and now Traxon is a twin countershaft box.
The last time we discussed it on here I made the case that it’s not only easier to make straight cut gears that can handle single meshing than a box which can handle the axial loads imposed by helical cut gears but Fuller also managed to combine multi mesh and straight cut gears and twin countershaft.
I past my PSV test in a Leyland PD3A half cab bus, it had a three speed gearbox - 35mph top speed. The top of the gear stick was at the same level as the join between the cab frame and lower bodywork so your knuckles came into contact with this flange which just for good measure, had metal clips holding the wiring loom!
For the record, it was an ex Leicester City Corporation 93 HBC.
Best box for me was the Fuller 13, plenty of gears and easy change. Second best has got to be David Brown as it was the first ‘proper’ box I used coupled to a Gardner, clutch use optional once rolling. As with many others my bottom of the list has got to be Mercs EPS, the main problem was they fitted a lever where there should have been a switch so a quick flick in what would have been neutral and hey presto you have a lucky dip, or more often neutral when you didn’t want it.
Buzzer:
Volvo 16 speed no question easy to use 4 over four with splitter lever up on the dash with green light on high so you knew where you were when tired, needed an expert if they went wrong to pull em apart as loads of spring loaded bearings internally which would fly everywhere to the unexperienced fitter but we had an expert in Basingstoke who we called Doctor Finlay who was mustard on them, Bob was his name and he was in to heavy metal music, another Mary Hopkins moment, cheers Buzzer.
gazsa401:
The gearbox installation in the Seddon Atkinson was in the “H” sequence 3rd and 4th were the wrong way round
So 1 2 4 3
There was a modification for the gearbox linkage to make it a standard
4 over 4 “H” sequence
The box you’re referring to was the Fuller Roadranger RTO9509, which had 3 & 4 the wrong way round whatever chassis it was installed in. The difference in the SA 400 Series was that because the remote for the gear linkage was fixed (to avoid an air gap around the lever) it effectively flipped the gearchange pattern through 180 degrees so the gears were back-to-front. You could cure it by using a David Brown remote on the linkage - which a certain John Killingbeck did on all his 400 series. This is why there were pallets of remotes and gear levers at the closedown auction…
I had two ‘Mastiffs’. One H reg and one J reg. I drove one and brother Andy drove the other. 5 speed synchro boxes and 2 speed axle. Easy to use and I don’t remember a single problem with either of them and they both did about 250,000 miles with me IIRC.
I took a 2800 Daf with the ZF 6 speed constant mesh and splitter to Baghdad. Worked fine. The same box in the Saviem that I had doing internals in Saudi, with the gearstick on the steering column, was never as slick, although to be fair it was never any trouble.
Geoff Collins and Ginger McNeil always used to say ‘come on John, we’ll go in your wagon’ if we were going from the yard into Dammam or Khobar for a meal. I could have driven the ■■■■ thing all day without missing a gear, but with four or five critical truck drivers in it, you could guarantee I would miss one, much to their amusement!
Just to clear up some hazy memories amongst you regarding 9-speed and 13-speed Fullers. The RT 9509 had various suffixes - a, b or c for instance. Those denoted different ratios for different applications. For example if you wanted big spacing between the upper gears you opted for an RT 9509c.
As for the H-shaped shift in the H-pattern: the RT 9509 (or RT 9513) were all of this pattern. The U-shaped shift version of the H-shaped pattern were all RTO versions of the same 'boxes: ie they were all overdrive versions. The only variable here is the SA 401 corrected pattern by introducing further linkage (as I understand it - someone will no doubt refine my argument here). Robert
It’s certainly generating some fascinating stuff, and in far more detail than I ever dared hope for - so thankyou all! If I don’t seem to be saying much it’s simply because I’m enjoying sitting back and learning!
ERF-NGC-European:
Just to clear up some hazy memories amongst you regarding 9-speed and 13-speed Fullers. The RT 9509 had various suffixes - a, b or c for instance. Those denoted different ratios for different applications. For example if you wanted big spacing between the upper gears you opted for an RT 9509c.
As for the H-shaped shift in the H-pattern: the RT 9509 (or RT 9513) were all of this pattern. The U-shaped shift version of the H-shaped pattern were all RTO versions of the same 'boxes: ie they were all overdrive versions. The only variable here is the SA 401 corrected pattern by introducing further linkage (as I understand it - someone will no doubt refine my argument here). Robert
Spot on Robert.
My addition would just be that the Seddon Atkinson linkage reversed the entire overdrive U pattern, as Marky has said above. Not easy to describe, but imagine looking at the U pattern in a mirror, if you follow!. [Edit] - see post below from ‘Windrush’ - it explains it far better than I did!
The first Fuller overdrive gearboxes to have a completely conventional H gate shift pattern ‘out of the box’ were the RTX series built from 1981, which had changeover linkage built into the selector cover of the gearbox to reverse the gate position of 3rd and 4th (7th and 8th) at the lever.
Sed-Ak 400 gearchange layout (pic borrowed from elsewhere on trucknet)
I liked this setup and never had a problem with it at all, although if the bush at the lever base was worn the lever could give your wrist a nasty clout if you hit a pothole while reaching for the lever! High range in ‘low’ was a handy gear to use, though not advertised as such of course.
The ‘Nine Speed’ Eaton Fuller RT(X) 11609.
Probably the best selling Fuller gearbox in the UK through the 1980’s.
Still very popular with tipper operators into the late 1990’s.
Fabulous! Where are you guys getting these images from, if you don’t mind me asking? I need to think about sourcing some just like it for the feature, but they need to either be a minimum file size of 1mb in digital format (these are showing as under 200kb) or the original prints sent into the office…Any ideas?
To be honest mine come via google Lucy, I don’t have much in the way of literature myself apart from a couple of old Foden workshop manuals from my time repairing them.
Mine is a scan of the original Eaton UK spec sheet from the day. I have most of the Fuller ones, from the early ‘boxes through to the twin splitter - I’m happy to scan any at full resolution if they are of use.
Fuller Roadranger 9 & 13 speed, never liked the 10 speed, 18 speed ok, Spicer box in the Roadtrain rubbish, and nobody has given the ZF 16 speed (slapover) as it’s been called the correct name. it was iirc the ZF Eco Split
High range in ‘low’ was a handy gear to use, though not advertised as such of course. 
