raymundo:
+1 to the above post and a -8 to C/F’s last one. My view is not one of cowardice and apeasement, it’s just one of trying to keep the world as a living planet not as an eradiated corpse as you advocate …
How is a defence strategy based on your fears of nuclear war,to the point of wanting to go grovelling to the Chinese,under threat of it hitting us with its nuclear arsenal,not cowardice and appeasement.When that’s exactly what it is.
While I don’t remember the world ending up an irradiated corpse during the 1960’s/70’s.Based on exactly the type of defence strategy ( the threat of mutually assured destruction ) that we now need to face down China and its puppet ally North Korea with.The fact is you can’t de invent nuclear weapons and China is a very real potential enemy that’s getting stronger and more aggressive in its attitude to the west as part of that by the day.Showing the type of weakness that you’re proposing just makes it more likely that it will either use its nuclear arsenal against us or if not turn us into another version of Tibet.
Carryfast, i think your very off the mark saying that North Korea are puppets of the Chinese, as far as i know the Chinese tolerate their “quirky” neighbour because its mostly bluster and hot air that comes from the Kim’s, other than testing they’ve not targeted anywhere yet.
IF they did actually nuke somewhere i’d think the Chinese and Russians would be just as keen as the USA to stop them as there’d be far to much local damage done to them as mentioned above and they won’t stand for that.
I could be way off here but the only reason North Korea are flexing their muscles is because the USA has got an arguably just as “quirky” leader at the minute and are just trying to get a reaction, and much like the cold war i don’t think anything major will happen the worlds a much closer place now and it would be bad for business.
If i’m wrong i’ll apologize just before the mushroom cloud!
I wish I knew if we are going to get nuked or not cos if we are I shall be sticking up two fingers to the tax man and his demands this year, who can I ask?? definetly no-one on this forum …
RB84:
Carryfast, i think your very off the mark saying that North Korea are puppets of the Chinese, as far as i know the Chinese tolerate their “quirky” neighbour because its mostly bluster and hot air that comes from the Kim’s, other than testing they’ve not targeted anywhere yet.
IF they did actually nuke somewhere i’d think the Chinese and Russians would be just as keen as the USA to stop them as there’d be far to much local damage done to them as mentioned above and they won’t stand for that.
I could be way off here but the only reason North Korea are flexing their muscles is because the USA has got an arguably just as “quirky” leader at the minute and are just trying to get a reaction, and much like the cold war i don’t think anything major will happen the worlds a much closer place now and it would be bad for business.
If i’m wrong i’ll apologize just before the mushroom cloud!
Firstly there were plenty of people saying that war with Germany would be bad for business in the 1930’s.While like in the case of Germany before,it’s obvious that the revenues being made by China in this one sided ‘business’ relationship are mostly being ploughed into China’s ever increasing military build up and capabilities.
As for Korea’s hidden nuclear agenda it seems obvious that it’s all about using the pretence and diversion of short range capability,intentions and targets as cover for what is really a long range one directed at ‘the west’.All that technology obviously being supplied by China.As I said that being all about China using fat rocket man as a patsy to threaten the west with strategic nukes for minimum exposure of China to retaliation.With those with your ideas being all to keen to fall into the Chinese scam and trap.
As for Trump he’s actually being crippled by the same agenda of appeasement being put forward by the global business community who are all about selling us out to the Chinese Communist Party for the right kick backs and a US population and defence agencies who’ve lost their bottle for a defence strategy based on mutually assured destruction.On that note we’re facing far more dangerous times as a result than we ever did when people like Kennedy faced down the Russians on that basis.With it being my guess that he would have successfully used the same strategy against China in the case of Vietnam.Rather than throw away the lives of 50,000 American servicemen for nothing in another conventional proxy hidden war with China that they knew they couldn’t win by use of conventional tactical methods.
Having said that I could understand the logic in the West saying that it is up for a defence strategy based on mutually assured destruction ‘but’ we’re ‘not’ going to get involved with local oriental issues and arguments like the historic animosities between China and Japan and red v white ethnic Chinese factions as part of that.In which case Trump seems to have totally lost the plot in that regard in saying that he’ll do what’s good for the US.While doing the total opposite in getting involved in a pointless foreign fight just like the last Korean war and Vietnam.When it’s now time to cut the East Asian theatre loose and tell them all to look after themselves and sort out their own arguments we’re out.
Raymundo I still think you’ll have to keep the taxman happy for a while yet!
Carryfast I’m sorry but I don’t buy your idea that China are the Puppet masters in all of this. If they’re doing a good trade with the west I can’t see them attacking it even with a “Patsy”.
North Korea’s nuclear intentions aren’t very hidden either they like to show the world what they’re capable of.
I kind of agree with you on Trump in that he would be silly to get so involved in foreign conflict’s when he’s made so much fuss about sorting the USA out and spending money and manpower elsewhere won’t sit well with his voters.
One thing that is very different nowadays is that if there’s a major conflict it will wipe out a whole lot, no one wants to be responsible for a world turned to ashes so I don’t think any red buttons will be pushed just yet
RB84:
Raymundo I still think you’ll have to keep the taxman happy for a while yet!
Oh bugger, just apent 9 1/2 grand of it on another car !!
Well we can always send Carryfast on an envoy to China he’ll have them riled up in no time! I’ll give CF his dues, he doesn’t pussyfoot about when dealing with some tinpot dictator, straight after one of the worlds biggest countries instead.
RB84:
Raymundo I still think you’ll have to keep the taxman happy for a while yet!
Carryfast I’m sorry but I don’t buy your idea that China are the Puppet masters in all of this. If they’re doing a good trade with the west I can’t see them attacking it even with a “Patsy”.
North Korea’s nuclear intentions aren’t very hidden either they like to show the world what they’re capable of.
I kind of agree with you on Trump in that he would be silly to get so involved in foreign conflict’s when he’s made so much fuss about sorting the USA out and spending money and manpower elsewhere won’t sit well with his voters.
One thing that is very different nowadays is that if there’s a major conflict it will wipe out a whole lot, no one wants to be responsible for a world turned to ashes so I don’t think any red buttons will be pushed just yet
Firstly it’s clear that China’s ‘trading’ relationship with the west is all part of Xiaoping’s ‘cat’ ‘catch’ ‘mice’ plan.Which isn’t about destroying the west it’s about turning it into a bigger version of Tibet.In which China sees the West as a solution to the fact that it doesn’t have sufficient decent land space to feed its population.In addition to the fact that China follows an expansionist no compromise form of Communism that won’t settle for anything other than its rule being the predominant one.IE similar to ■■■■ Germany and Stalin’s ideologies.The question in this case being all about what happens if we say no which is what this is all about.
As for North Korea’s ‘intentions’.It seems clear that it’s using its Chinese backed and supplied military machine to make veiled coded threats by proxy along the lines of we have access at some point to long range ballistic strategic weapons and first we’ll rattle your cage by threatening our historic enemies and your perceived ‘allies’ like Japan as part of that to test your resolve.With the US falling into exactly the same trap as it did in the Korean War and Vietnam in that regard by taking the all too predictable line.
When its obvious that the solution to all this is say that we no longer give a zb about Japan and pathetic internal oriental arguments.We are closing the doors on the East Asian theatre and we’re ceasing our trading relationship with China which as it stands is just giving them the means to hit us with and to further their commy expansionist aims.With the lose lose of taking jobs away from western workers and giving then to oriental ones.‘That’s’ what Trump was put into office to do.It’s my guess that China will then show it’s true colours in threatening us directly rather than covertly and by proxy and ‘that’s’ the point when we need to have the bottle to say fine go for it and see what happens just like Kennedy did with Kruschev.Mutually Assured Destruction meaning exactly the same thing now as it did then and being just as effective in its ability to defend us from such evil zb’s whether Stalinist Russia or red China.
I will agree that China will look further afield to look after it’s population I know for a fact that it gets a lot of gas from countries like Turkmenistan and probably plenty more resource’s from elsewhere, investing in Hinkley point c for example. But why would they do all this to then decide its time to risk it all for a war?
As far as I’m aware North Korea got most of it weapons after the fall of the Soviet union and its rumoured Iran has played a role in its nuclear programs? China has supplied Weapons and plenty of aid in more peaceful times being its neighbour, but they’re not in charge of them or using them I really can’t see China trying to take over the west at all!
Also I can’t see us leaving the far east alone anytime soon especially as we want more trade deals and like it or lump it they make a hell of a lot of goods we want, plus the foods cracking
You have got to understand RB48 ( Now that’s a big shovel ! ) that “CF” is just a ■■■■■■■ warmonger and he will not rest until the whole ■■■■■■■ World is up in arms and at each others throats ! Cheers Bewick.
Bewick:
You have got to understand RB48 ( Now that’s a big shovel ! ) that “CF” is just a [zb] warmonger and he will not rest until the whole [zb] World is up in arms and at each others throats ! Cheers Bewick.
Yep I think your right there Bewick. Planet CF would be an interesting place to live I reckon
I will agree that China will look further afield to look after it’s population I know for a fact that it gets a lot of gas from countries like Turkmenistan and probably plenty more resource’s from elsewhere, investing in Hinkley point c for example. But why would they do all this to then decide its time to risk it all for a war?
As far as I’m aware North Korea got most of it weapons after the fall of the Soviet union and its rumoured Iran has played a role in its nuclear programs? China has supplied Weapons and plenty of aid in more peaceful times being its neighbour, but they’re not in charge of them or using them I really can’t see China trying to take over the west at all!
Also I can’t see us leaving the far east alone anytime soon especially as we want more trade deals and like it or lump it they make a hell of a lot of goods we want, plus the foods cracking
It’s clear that the trading relationship with China is all about a few people taking kick backs made on the backs of cheap effective slave Chinese labour in exchange for selling out the country’s interests both economic and national defence/security.While as I said China doesn’t intend to destroy the country just so long as it sees an advantage in that situation.Which ultimately will turn into a situation of Brits starving to feed China under threat of attack either directly or by Korean proxy or both.To which your answer is to appease the zb’s from the start of that plan through fear,instead of nipping it in the bud now.
While from China’s point of view what better plan than to lure the West into another wild goose chase in East Asia fighting a hidden proxy war against China’s Korean puppet state thereby weakening our defences.The West having learn’t nothing in that regard since the previous examples of that plan in the Korean and Vietnam Wars previously.With,just as in that case,China betting that the west doesn’t have the bottle to face it down in the form of the proven strategic mutually assured destruction defence policy.With Trump proving just as much an appeaser,willing to waste the lives of US service personnel to maintain the sham of a so called US defence policy in East Asia,as Johnson and Nixon were in that regard.
It’s time to wake up and smell the coffee regarding the absolute bunch of treacherous and aggressive zb’s that we’re historically dealing with in East Asia.This time making sure not to get lured into another idiotic piecemeal disadvantageous localised war on China’s terms as a pointless diversionary face saving exercise for our equally treacherous and stupid leadership.
We’re supposed to believe that China isn’t hostile to the west.It’s supposedly just ‘protecting’ it’s trade routes.Oh wait by taking out the defence assets of its ‘trading partners’ like the US and taking over its neighbours.
As opposed to the reality that it’s using the revenues of that trade to build up its military and then luring its enemies into a localised war on its terms to leave its victims defenceless.While the mugs running the western governments are stupid enough to keep giving them the cash to do it and to walk into the trap because they are too scared to cut the trade that’s giving them the money to do it and meet the threat strategically on the basis of mutually assured destruction.In addition to pulling those vulnerable assets out of China’s obvious kill zone by cutting East Asia loose.
) that “CF” is just a ■■■■■■■ warmonger and he will not rest until the whole ■■■■■■■ World is up in arms and at each others throats ! 
Yep I think your right there Bewick. Planet CF would be an interesting place to live I reckon 