Kobe Steel scandal deepens over quality of products used in cars and aircraft.
theguardian.com/business/20 … zda-boeing
Hope this does come back to haunt us all in the future!
Carryfast:
Buckstones:
The difference between prestressed and reinforced concrete is how the steel provides tensile strength.Concrete has low strength in tension or bending: reinforcing steel bars will strengthen it as long as the rebars adhere firmly, if cracks lead to corrosion the steel rusts, expands and makes cracks worse.
Prestressed concrete has steel bars running through its length and these are stretched mechanically before the concrete sets around them, so the concrete is under compression and can resist tensile load. The key is again that the steel does not ‘unstick’ from the surrounding concrete or corrode.
Both methods need careful manufacture from quality materials and proper maintenance inspections, probably some of which was lacking in the Genoa bridge.
Pre stressed concrete clearly has no proper re bar in it at all.It’s just a case of using cables or other wiry type stuff to create a stressing action within just the concrete and then saying that’s supposedly as good as RC.
Which leaves the question if it’s supposedly that good why do they still use RC at all,let alone in the most demanding applications like the Quensferry bridge’s towers,as opposed to just relying on PSC for everything.Probably because they know that at the end of the day RC is superior but costs more.
This clip explains how prestressed concrete is made: it is not a cheap substitute for reinforced concrete, needs more calculation and expensive equipment to apply the prestress. youtube.com/watch?v=2QQsaPY … ngineering
Buckstones:
Carryfast:
Buckstones:
The difference between prestressed and reinforced concrete is how the steel provides tensile strength.Concrete has low strength in tension or bending: reinforcing steel bars will strengthen it as long as the rebars adhere firmly, if cracks lead to corrosion the steel rusts, expands and makes cracks worse.
Prestressed concrete has steel bars running through its length and these are stretched mechanically before the concrete sets around them, so the concrete is under compression and can resist tensile load. The key is again that the steel does not ‘unstick’ from the surrounding concrete or corrode.
Both methods need careful manufacture from quality materials and proper maintenance inspections, probably some of which was lacking in the Genoa bridge.
Pre stressed concrete clearly has no proper re bar in it at all.It’s just a case of using cables or other wiry type stuff to create a stressing action within just the concrete and then saying that’s supposedly as good as RC.
This clip explains how prestressed concrete is made: it is not a cheap substitute for reinforced concrete, needs more calculation and expensive equipment to apply the prestress. youtube.com/watch?v=2QQsaPY … ngineering
Strange how the NPCA here puts lower construction costs at the top of the list.While if its so good why use RC for the Queensferry’s towers and not PSC ?.
precast.org/2010/05/why-prestress-2/
Let’s get this right concrete is all about it’s strength in the form of resistance to massive compression.Then they use a process which supposedly uses cables or other wiry zb to supposedly compress it enough to provide it with the tensile strength of RC.What could possibly go wrong.
switchlogic:
Winseer:
My hope is that “if just one single life can be saved as a result of those in power merely to look in the right places, respond correctly, and act to avert moral hazard in the future” then all my rants might have not been in vain.Wow…you think your comments on bridge design and the EU will save lives?
No, but if I can stimulate those in power to take a look at it all from the “Political Science” angle - they might. 
Carryfast:
switchlogic:
Wow…you think your comments on bridge design and the EU will save lives?Obviously assuming enough of us join him in at least saying that what Italian cash there is should be spent on Italian infrastructure not Spanish/East Euro etc etc and to make rich Danes and Luxembourgers and Dutch etc even richer,in this case obviously yes.
I’m trying not to so much preach to fellow drivers on this site, but rather just get some stuff “out there” on the internet that won’t be taken down by the powers that be for being “inflammatory” at any whim that takes them.
It hasn’t been helpful across this weekend, that the BBC for instance, has chosen to big-up the India Flood Story, and notice that the Genoa Bridge Collapse - has disappeared completely, almost to the hour that this got reported by the daily wail…
"Oh ■■■■. We’re not going to get anything else out of this tragedy other than Pro Fivestar/Anti EU stuff. - DROP IT then. "
The daft thing is, the BBC initially jumped all over it, as a “escape hatch” for the breaking Westminster attempted murder “terror attack” story, when it became apparent that it was a terror attack, was a non-EU Islamic, and was aimed at the general public rather than dignitaries.
I’ve noticed that the Beeb does that: You get headline stories further and further away from Britain - if the news “closer to home” is no longer in their politically correct interests to cover. 
If the Westminster thing had been a white boy running his BMW into a bus queue outside of Mosque - The story would still be running and running (on the BBC) of course.
Likewise, if the Genoa Bridge Collapse had been caused by say, a Russian truck driver crashing in a way that made the bridge collapse - The story will still be running and running on that too.
Winseer:
I’m trying not to so much preach to fellow drivers on this site, but rather just get some stuff “out there” on the internet that won’t be taken down by the powers that be for being “inflammatory” at any whim that takes them.It hasn’t been helpful across this weekend, that the BBC for instance, has chosen to big-up the India Flood Story, and notice that the Genoa Bridge Collapse - has disappeared completely, almost to the hour that this got reported by the daily wail…
State funeral for Genoa bridge collapse disaster | Daily Mail Online
"Oh ■■■■. We’re not going to get anything else out of this tragedy other than Pro Fivestar/Anti EU stuff. - DROP IT then. "
The daft thing is, the BBC initially jumped all over it, as a “escape hatch” for the breaking Westminster attempted murder “terror attack” story, when it became apparent that it was a terror attack, was a non-EU Islamic, and was aimed at the general public rather than dignitaries.
I’ve noticed that the Beeb does that: You get headline stories further and further away from Britain - if the news “closer to home” is no longer in their politically correct interests to cover.
If the Westminster thing had been a white boy running his BMW into a bus queue outside of Mosque - The story would still be running and running (on the BBC) of course.
Westminster crash suspect is charged with two counts of attempted murder | Daily Mail OnlineLikewise, if the Genoa Bridge Collapse had been caused by say, a Russian truck driver crashing in a way that made the bridge collapse - The story will still be running and running on that too.
Firstly I’ve shown an obvious bleedin great big crack running through a tower post of the tower which collapsed and which was no where more difficult to find than google maps.So I’d guess the attempt to divert attention to the stays rather than the towers is because the latter obviously raises the questions over similar construction methods used to date in numerous structures.So it’s not just the BBC with a dodgy agenda here.
As for the BBC spot on everything the BBC does has a laughably amateurishly attempted hidden agenda behind it.In the case of the bridge the trail would have inevitably led back to Italian infrastructure spending restraints among other austerity.While East Euro gets covered in new motorways,and Luxembourg fat cats like Juncker get fatter,while Italians live in poverty and die on collapsing bridges because what cash they have goes to pay for it.
Much better to make the all too amateurishly obvious bs inference that the age old regular as clockwork Indian monsoon is now suddenly the result of ‘climate change’ and we must send more Brit cash to pay for the usual damage it causes. If not even better lets bring the whole ‘refugee’ Indian population here to our green and pleasant land while India spends the cash on space projects and buying up Brit industry.The Soviet style zb’s who run the BBC must take their naive Brit audience as tame lab rats.
This is all getting a bit pathetic. Ill-informed conspiracy theorists ranting about EU finance and engineering practice in 1950s Italy…
It would be funny if it wasn’t so boring.
Santa:
This is all getting a bit pathetic. Ill-informed conspiracy theorists ranting about EU finance and engineering practice in 1950s Italy…It would be funny if it wasn’t so boring.
Agreed, perhaps it’s been taken over by a different thread Santa?
Santa:
This is all getting a bit pathetic. Ill-informed conspiracy theorists ranting about EU finance and engineering practice in 1950s Italy…It would be funny if it wasn’t so boring.
So why don’t you provide your better informed view for our benefit by answering questions like if PSC is supposedly so good then why use RC for state of the art projects like Quensferry Bridge ?.While the ‘engineering’ in question is obviously still in use to date and not just in Italy.
As for EU finance the fact that Italian infrastructure is a dangerous lottery to use seems to be no coincidence with the fact that their much needed cash to build it and maintain it is clearly being nicked by the EU to subsidise other parts of Europe.Assuming you can do basic maths.
Spardo:
Santa:
This is all getting a bit pathetic. Ill-informed conspiracy theorists ranting about EU finance and engineering practice in 1950s Italy…It would be funny if it wasn’t so boring.
Agreed, perhaps it’s been taken over by a different thread Santa?
I bet you two are only seeing half the posts. When you learn how to unlock the system you can see the “hidden” messages nestling amongst the other clear posts.
Just stop taking the medication that Nurse Ratched brings around and you’ll be fine like the rest of us!
Sent from my SM-G361F using Tapatalk
It hasn’t been helpful across this weekend, that the BBC for instance, has chosen to big-up the India Flood Story, and notice that the Genoa Bridge Collapse - has disappeared completely, almost to the hour that this got reported by the daily wail…
"Oh ■■■■. We’re not going to get anything else out of this tragedy other than Pro Fivestar/Anti EU stuff. - DROP IT then. "
The daft thing is, the BBC initially jumped all over it, as a “escape hatch” for the breaking Westminster attempted murder “terror attack” story, when it became apparent that it was a terror attack, was a non-EU Islamic, and was aimed at the general public rather than dignitaries.
I’ve noticed that the Beeb does that: You get headline stories further and further away from Britain - if the news “closer to home” is no longer in their politically correct interests to cover.
If the Westminster thing had been a white boy running his BMW into a bus queue outside of Mosque - The story would still be running and running (on the BBC) of course.
Likewise, if the Genoa Bridge Collapse had been caused by say, a Russian truck driver crashing in a way that made the bridge collapse - The story will still be running and running on that too.
[/quote]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
+1
so sad,but so true. 
listen to radio 4 nowadays and you might as well have on the world service.
for me nowadays its " ignorance is bliss" as i dont watch live tv or read newspapers with radio4 also being a thing of the past due to the subject matter.
i just prefer to live in my own wee racist bigoted world ad do my best to ignore the inevitable.
most of my news comes from links and topics from here which is more than enough to completely sicken me as to the way the country is becoming a nation of mongrels.
Me? I just watch “Alt Media” now, and only check on the BBC to “see if they have covered this or that story or not…” Nope. <Switches back to France 24, RT, Fox News> etc etc. 
I do like to tune into the “World Tonight” on Radio Four though.
You can get some real “politically incorrect” remarks made on that, which keeps R4 at least - streets ahead of News24 - at least for the time being.
The same applies to Marr on Sunday Mornings. 
Carryfast:
Santa:
This is all getting a bit pathetic. Ill-informed conspiracy theorists ranting about EU finance and engineering practice in 1950s Italy…It would be funny if it wasn’t so boring.
So why don’t you provide your better informed view for our benefit by answering questions like if PSC is supposedly so good then why use RC for state of the art projects like Quensferry Bridge ?.While the ‘engineering’ in question is obviously still in use to date and not just in Italy.
As for EU finance the fact that Italian infrastructure is a dangerous lottery to use seems to be no coincidence with the fact that their much needed cash to build it and maintain it is clearly being nicked by the EU to subsidise other parts of Europe.Assuming you can do basic maths.
Because I can google as well as you can but that proves nothing at all. If any of you has an engineering and a political science/economics qualification I would gladly listen, but while you and the other guy continue to talk through your exhaust pipes, I will wait for some expert opinions after the investigation.
Richard Branson could use this thread to fuel his next ballooning adventure.
Sent from my SM-G950W using Tapatalk
Winseer:
Me? I just watch “Alt Media” now, and only check on the BBC to “see if they have covered this or that story or not…” Nope.I do like to tune into the “World Tonight” on Radio Four though.
You can get some real “politically incorrect” remarks made on that, which keeps R4 at least - streets ahead of News24 - at least for the time being.
The same applies to Marr on Sunday Mornings.
Because of course Russia Today and Fox News aren’t biased at all… 
newmercman:
Richard Branson could use this thread to fuel his next ballooning adventure.
Retro humour, but very funny.
Santa:
I will wait for some expert opinions after the investigation.
Are you new to trucknet? Everyones an expert on everything, didnt you know?
Santa:
Carryfast:
Santa:
This is all getting a bit pathetic. Ill-informed conspiracy theorists ranting about EU finance and engineering practice in 1950s Italy…It would be funny if it wasn’t so boring.
So why don’t you provide your better informed view for our benefit by answering questions like if PSC is supposedly so good then why use RC for state of the art projects like Quensferry Bridge ?.While the ‘engineering’ in question is obviously still in use to date and not just in Italy.
As for EU finance the fact that Italian infrastructure is a dangerous lottery to use seems to be no coincidence with the fact that their much needed cash to build it and maintain it is clearly being nicked by the EU to subsidise other parts of Europe.Assuming you can do basic maths.
Because I can google as well as you can but that proves nothing at all. If any of you has an engineering and a political science/economics qualification I would gladly listen, but while you and the other guy continue to talk through your exhaust pipes, I will wait for some expert opinions after the investigation.
I didn’t see any conditions laid down in the OP which said speculation,you know stuff like build and maintenance budgets and design and materials won’t be tolerated,let alone by self appointed mods like yourself.Not surprising because a topic concerning a bridge collapse wasn’t going to get far with that stipulation put in from the start.
While the question,why did the ‘experts’ who designed the Humber and Queensferry bridges choose RC to build them with,v Morandi’s choice of PSC,by definition fits the description of ‘expert opinion’,because the question is obviously why the difference in those respective ‘expert opinions’.
newmercman:
Richard Branson could use this thread to fuel his next ballooning adventure.
To be fair you started off the speculative frenzy by saying that the bridge looks out of alignment when it was built from looking at a pic of the gap that’s now in it of around half a mile. 