If communist Corbyn manages to get to number 10, then he intends to increase apprentices pay to £10 ph…most apprentice are I guess from 16 to 20 years old. That then, by theory, should put the average lorry driver on what. £25 to £30 ph for his skill and experience ?
Nothing wrong with dreaming!
Not quite accurate, he intends to raise the pay for 18-25 yr olds. Apprentices are a separate category. But your point is valid, if van drivers can get £10/hr then I will certainly be expecting a prorata pay rise. I didn’t invest all that time & money to earn minimum wage. And therein lies the problem with his policy, could the sector afford such dramatic pay rises in such a short period of time (1 year)?
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Fergie47:
If communist Corbyn manages to get to number 10, then he intends to increase apprentices pay to £10 ph…most apprentice are I guess from 16 to 20 years old. That then, by theory, should put the average lorry driver on what. £25 to £30 ph for his skill and experience ?
Assuming it’s an apprentice factory worker etc learning the full range of engineering skills for example.With a few exceptions it’s worth more than a truck driver’s wage just to be able to stand the mind numbing inside working environment in which every hour seems like at least two.Realistically needing no more than a 3 day 32 hour week,preferably less,just to stay sane and not clocking out and running for the exit before lunch time on Monday morning.Let alone the skills needed to be learn’t by the first year let alone the fifth.Trust me the average lorry driver wanting to be out on the road all day wouldn’t handle even that let alone 40 hours +.I managed around two years in a factory from leaving school and was almost metaphorically suicidal in the job by that point.Anyone taking that on as a career choice deserves every pound and then some. 
Now I’m no economics master, but I cant see how it’s going to work.
For us to get a pay rise in line with what’s being proposed would mean either one of two things. Companies take a hit on their profit margins or the price of the goods increases in line with the increased costs. The money for our raise has to come from somewhere and frankly, only one of those options is likely.
Considering the unique way our industry is intertwined with all aspects of our economy (if you bought it it came by truck), any increase in prices would be across all aspects of our spending, affecting us drivers as well as the general population. Effectively negating any pay rise we might have been given.
Nite Owl:
Now I’m no economics master, but I cant see how it’s going to work.For us to get a pay rise in line with what’s being proposed would mean either one of two things. Companies take a hit on their profit margins or the price of the goods increases in line with the increased costs. The money for our raise has to come from somewhere and frankly, only one of those options is likely.
Considering the unique way our industry is intertwined with all aspects of our economy (if you bought it it came by truck), any increase in prices would be across all aspects of our spending, affecting us drivers as well as the general population. Effectively negating any pay rise we might have been given.
Ladies & gentlemen, I give you our next chancellor…
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Nite Owl:
Now I’m no economics master, but I cant see how it’s going to work.For us to get a pay rise in line with what’s being proposed would mean either one of two things. Companies take a hit on their profit margins or the price of the goods increases in line with the increased costs. The money for our raise has to come from somewhere and frankly, only one of those options is likely.
Considering the unique way our industry is intertwined with all aspects of our economy (if you bought it it came by truck), any increase in prices would be across all aspects of our spending, affecting us drivers as well as the general population. Effectively negating any pay rise we might have been given.
Not exactly. Suppose as an example your day’s work is to transport 26,000 x 1 litre bottles of fizzy drink.
Now suppose your wages increase by £100 per day.
That would increase the cost of each bottle of fizzy drink by just under one-third of a penny.
matto75:
Not quite accurate, he intends to raise the pay for 18-25 yr olds.
Roughly a 62% increase, hmm, I can forsee that working. So for those of us on say £12, thats £18 / hour. I can cope with that, until the company goes bust the following week. 
I just worked out, for that pay rise it would cost the company around £6m instead of around £300K. Kindof suspect this isn’t going to fly.
Nite Owl:
Now I’m no economics master, but I cant see how it’s going to work.For us to get a pay rise in line with what’s being proposed would mean either one of two things. Companies take a hit on their profit margins or the price of the goods increases in line with the increased costs. The money for our raise has to come from somewhere and frankly, only one of those options is likely.
Considering the unique way our industry is intertwined with all aspects of our economy (if you bought it it came by truck), any increase in prices would be across all aspects of our spending, affecting us drivers as well as the general population. Effectively negating any pay rise we might have been given.
The cost of goods is not entirely the cost of workers’ labour. There is also interest, rents, profits, advertising budgets, and so on.
With a pay increase, you never lose more at the checkout than you gain in wages.
It’s one of the big lies of neoliberal economics that workers should be concerned to keep their wages down, simply so that prices will be cheaper.
If workers were paid nothing at all, prices in the shops would still be non-zero, to pay for the cost of the boss still taking his cut.
Harry Monk:
Nite Owl:
Now I’m no economics master, but I cant see how it’s going to work.For us to get a pay rise in line with what’s being proposed would mean either one of two things. Companies take a hit on their profit margins or the price of the goods increases in line with the increased costs. The money for our raise has to come from somewhere and frankly, only one of those options is likely.
Considering the unique way our industry is intertwined with all aspects of our economy (if you bought it it came by truck), any increase in prices would be across all aspects of our spending, affecting us drivers as well as the general population. Effectively negating any pay rise we might have been given.
Not exactly. Suppose as an example your day’s work is to transport 26,000 x 1 litre bottles of fizzy drink.
Now suppose your wages increase by £100 per day.
That would increase the cost of each bottle of fizzy drink by just under one-third of a penny.
You haven’t taken account of the increased production costs (due to increased staff costs), increased fuel costs, increased retail costs, etc, etc.
Increasing labour costs by so much & so rapidly will cause costs to spiral across the board. Add into that, if we have a labour government half the country will be out on strike demanding these pay rises.
I’m a huge fan of minimum wage & worker rights. I also support the idea of equal pay for equal work regardless of age but we mustn’t lose sight of the bigger picture.
Politics is too short sighted currently.
Here ends the lesson for today…
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Harry Monk:
Nite Owl:
Now I’m no economics master, but I cant see how it’s going to work.For us to get a pay rise in line with what’s being proposed would mean either one of two things. Companies take a hit on their profit margins or the price of the goods increases in line with the increased costs. The money for our raise has to come from somewhere and frankly, only one of those options is likely.
Considering the unique way our industry is intertwined with all aspects of our economy (if you bought it it came by truck), any increase in prices would be across all aspects of our spending, affecting us drivers as well as the general population. Effectively negating any pay rise we might have been given.
Not exactly. Suppose as an example your day’s work is to transport 26,000 x 1 litre bottles of fizzy drink.
Now suppose your wages increase by £100 per day.
That would increase the cost of each bottle of fizzy drink by just under one-third of a penny.
Fair point, but dont forget that all of the components to make that fizzy pop also had to come by lorry. I dont know how many components there are: plastic for the bottles, paper for the labels, pallets to stack them on. And that’s before you get to the ingredients for the drink itself. Each of the trucks run on fuel which has to be delivered by truck who also have a pay rise which has to be accounted for. Now take into account that each pallet will probably go from the factory via an artic to an rdc or warehouse where it’ll be put on another truck for delivery to store.
Each and every driver adds 1/3 of a penny onto the price of the bottle of pop. Let’s just say that it increases by 5p and is indicative of everything we buy. How many products does your household buy per week? That’s a lot of 5 pences.
And while you might be ok because your income has gone up more than your spends, how will the rest of the population feel knowing their weekly costs have increased by 5% just to give us truckers a decent pay rise? (Based on a £1 bottle of pop so hardly the most accurate assessment I agree.) That would be politically unviable.
Nite Owl:
Harry Monk:
Nite Owl:
Now I’m no economics master, but I cant see how it’s going to work.For us to get a pay rise in line with what’s being proposed would mean either one of two things. Companies take a hit on their profit margins or the price of the goods increases in line with the increased costs. The money for our raise has to come from somewhere and frankly, only one of those options is likely.
Considering the unique way our industry is intertwined with all aspects of our economy (if you bought it it came by truck), any increase in prices would be across all aspects of our spending, affecting us drivers as well as the general population. Effectively negating any pay rise we might have been given.
Not exactly. Suppose as an example your day’s work is to transport 26,000 x 1 litre bottles of fizzy drink.
Now suppose your wages increase by £100 per day.
That would increase the cost of each bottle of fizzy drink by just under one-third of a penny.
Fair point, but dont forget that all of the components to make that fizzy pop also had to come by lorry. I dont know how many components there are: plastic for the bottles, paper for the labels, pallets to stack them on. And that’s before you get to the ingredients for the drink itself. Each of the trucks run on fuel which has to be delivered by truck who also have a pay rise which has to be accounted for. Now take into account that each pallet will probably go from the factory via an artic to an rdc or warehouse where it’ll be put on another truck for delivery to store.
Each and every driver adds 1/3 of a penny onto the price of the bottle of pop. Let’s just say that it increases by 5p and is indicative of everything we buy. How many products does your household buy per week? That’s a lot of 5 pences.
And while you might be ok because your income has gone up more than your spends, how will the rest of the population feel knowing their weekly costs have increased by 5% just to give us truckers a decent pay rise? (Based on a £1 bottle of pop so hardly the most accurate assessment I agree.) That would be politically unviable.
You mention components for making the drink. Also there are costs associated with components for the manufacturing equipment where factory workers building them may need an increase. Shipping components to the company will also cost more as the mail man will need a increase possibly too
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Well all I can say from Oz is that we’ve just dodged a bullet in our federal election… Labor (sic) lost. Hopefully you’ll get some of the same.
I wouldn’t worry too much, as there’s more chance of seeing Lord Lucan riding Shergar down Downing Street, than there is seeing Jeremy Corbyn walking through the door of 10 Downing Street as Prime minister.
Nite Owl:
Now I’m no economics master, but I cant see how it’s going to work.For us to get a pay rise in line with what’s being proposed would mean either one of two things. Companies take a hit on their profit margins or the price of the goods increases in line with the increased costs. The money for our raise has to come from somewhere and frankly, only one of those options is likely.
Considering the unique way our industry is intertwined with all aspects of our economy (if you bought it it came by truck), any increase in prices would be across all aspects of our spending, affecting us drivers as well as the general population. Effectively negating any pay rise we might have been given.
Neither am I an ‘Economics master’ either, but why should a driver have to feel guilty about getting any type or amount of raise in pay?..Because whenever he asks he always gets the standard b/s answer of ‘‘If your pay goes up, in theory prices of goods will go up’’…it’s been the same answer chucked at us by politicians and the like for years (incidentally there’s never a mention or an objection on these lines, when their already ridiculously high wages increase every year, for doing ■■■■ all 
)
So we are automatically given and handed the responsibility (in theory) of subsidising prices (not to mention the cut to the bone haulage rates) and the cost of living for everybody else…
Ok, these are general and very simplistic terms, but as I said I aint an economist, and I’m sure you’ll get my drift.
Ask your boss even at his level for a substantial raise, never mind the MPs,.and you’ll get the same answer about ‘‘Transport costs and prices, and about not making enough profit in the job today’’ …, that’s if you can wait until he comes back from his Indian Ocean cruise hol, and arrives back to his million quid home in his top of the range BMW before you can ask him.
So we’ll do our bit by continuing to work for ■■■■ money, safe in the knowledge everybody else is benefiting from it. 
Don’t know about a modern type/■■■■ poor Labour government, but ffs bring back (proper legit pre mid 70s 
) Trade Unions who genuinely fought for us against all this crap in the old days.
Somebody a lot cleverer than me has calculated that Corbyn’s fiscal policys would lead to a tax increase of approx
To continue , approx £6700 a year . Fat fingers there , clicked wrong button , oops
I can do better than Corbyn’s promises …When I’m Prime Minister we’ll (or rather you 
) will.all be on bloody good wages,.proper night out money, and you’ll no longer have any parking probs.
Beer will go down, all football matches will be on tv, Newcastle Utd will be Govt subsidised to Champions league level, and Holly Willoughby and Rachel Riley will be my very 
loyal P.A.s 
…because let’s face it I sure as hell have more chance of getting into no10 than that ■■■■ idiot.
From an (now ex) employer’s pov, it really doesn’t matter what you get paid. Corbyn could put the minimum wage up to £100.00 an hour and then say truck drivers got £120.00-140.00 per hour; what matters is if it’s in line with everyone else and as long as my competitors are paying their staff around £130.00, then it really doesn’t make any difference. Trouble is that you will find that factory workers will be on £105.00-120.00 and lawyers will be on £800.00 an hour so the status quo will stay the same.
Harry Monk:
Nite Owl:
Now I’m no economics master, but I cant see how it’s going to work.For us to get a pay rise in line with what’s being proposed would mean either one of two things. Companies take a hit on their profit margins or the price of the goods increases in line with the increased costs. The money for our raise has to come from somewhere and frankly, only one of those options is likely.
Considering the unique way our industry is intertwined with all aspects of our economy (if you bought it it came by truck), any increase in prices would be across all aspects of our spending, affecting us drivers as well as the general population. Effectively negating any pay rise we might have been given.
Not exactly. Suppose as an example your day’s work is to transport 26,000 x 1 litre bottles of fizzy drink.
Now suppose your wages increase by £100 per day.
That would increase the cost of each bottle of fizzy drink by just under one-third of a penny.
Then allow LHV’s which would allow you to carry around 15 tonnes worth more bottles per run and allow the use of red diesel for haulage purposes.