Another general election

OUT OF HOURS BULLY'S TRUCKSTOP BAR (INTERACTIVE)
41

discoman:

Carryfast:
I’ve been saying for ages that her ( Cameron’s ) plan is all about delaying/derailing the Brexit process so that the Cons can create a General election result that confirms the remain agenda in parliament.On that note it’ll predictably be a Con minority government in which all/many of the supposed Brexit Con MP’s are either deselected in favour of remainers,or lose their seats to LibDems,while the remainer Con/Lab/LibDem/SNP alliance then reverses the referendum vote.Meanwhile don’t say it hasn’t already happened in the form of the Richmond Park/Kingston by election in which the LibDems beat Zac Goldsmith on a remain ticket.Farage and with him UKIP having obviously also been silenced and infiltrated by the establishment agenda. :unamused:

Goldsmith ran as an independent due to the Heathrow extention. … he was not a con MP in that election. …

Bearing in mind the Cons didn’t oppose him.If those who believe that the Cons aren’t just a bunch of LibDem remainers in blue clothes are right,then the Conservative vote would obviously have been expected to back him.

IE The relevant bit in this case is that he was also one of the Eurosceptic Cons just like Raab.Like Raab at least will probably find here the LibDems then fought a reasonably safe Con seat by going for the remain Con vote and won it on that basis.In which case as usual the Leave vote is probably going to make the mistake of believing the lying Cons.Who it needs to be remembered were the Party who took us into the EU scam and have supported it ever since to the point of lumbering us with a remain PM after the Leave vote.

As for Goldsmith what a convenient surprise first Cameron says no Heathrow expansion then his own Party stitches Goldsmith up by effectively and predictably handing his vote to the LibDems.In addition to May conveniently delaying Brexit until handing the agenda over to her remain SNP/LibDem etc allies in parliament.With Richmond Park having just been the rehearsal with the idea of not bothering to oppose him to let the LibDems take it just being part of the remain scam and a test of the strength of the remain v leave Con vote.

In which case at best we probably get a minority Con government and swap EU member state for EEA ( EU in all but name ). :unamused:

42

OVLOV JAY:
We know the polls aren’t worth a toss at the best of times. But seeing as they’re polling on a pm/government they’re particularly redundant now. This will be Brexit mk2. I just hope enough Brexiteers come out. It’s going to be a very high turn out for a ge I think. Trouble is, the majority of Brexit voters are centre grounders, and very principalled. I can’t see staunch eurosceptic Labour voters bringing themselves to vote Tory. However, the vast majority of remoaners are Lilly livered Liberals, and change their minds to suit their Europhile agenda. I can’t see the most ardent Europhile Tories voting that way. More likely to vote for the Dolmio doll Farron :unamused:

+1

The problem being that too many Brexit and natural UKIP voters have probably now swallowed the lie that the Cons have suddenly changed from committed remainers to leavers.

While the idea that Corbyn isn’t a big player is yet more silly complacency or just the establishment playing down the Labour vote for tactical reasons.That establishment having shown that it would way prefer a Corbyn administration to a UKIP one. :bulb:

43

Stanley Knife:

Carryfast:
Richmond Park was also a reasonably safe Con seat too.

Lib Dem 97, 01, 05. Con 10,15. Lib Dem 2016 by-election.

The rest of that paragraph I give in, it’s just incomprehensible waffle.

Carryfast:
On that note don’t under estimate the remain agenda within the Cons and do you really think that remainers May and Hammond had/have the slightest intention of delivering Brexit.

FFS CF do you not think I know that. There will be no hard brexit as I want it. A Conservative majority gives her, and her backers, the mandate to pursue the brexit that they want, which will be very soft and fluffy. But the other options are parties that have stated that they will ignore the referendum result and reinstate our association with the EU.

UKIP is a busted flush and has shown time and time again it’s organisational skills are next to none. It won’t win a seat!

I’d call a Con vote of 34,404 v LibDem 11,389 in 2015 and LibDem 20,510 in 2016 a ‘reasonably safe’ Con seat.

So we swap EU for EEA.Exactly how would that meet any of the Leave manifesto promises whatsoever and what if anything would have changed regarding our relationship with the EU.Yes the people probably will be daft enough to vote Con not UKIP in which case they’ll get what they deserve just like 1979 and every Con government since.

44

On ‘Today’ this morning, with apologies to Mrs Merton- “And what was it about the latest polls that convinced you to go to the country Mrs May?”

Sent from my GT-S7275R using Tapatalk

45

Carryfast:

OVLOV JAY:
We know the polls aren’t worth a toss at the best of times. But seeing as they’re polling on a pm/government they’re particularly redundant now. This will be Brexit mk2. I just hope enough Brexiteers come out. It’s going to be a very high turn out for a ge I think. Trouble is, the majority of Brexit voters are centre grounders, and very principalled. I can’t see staunch eurosceptic Labour voters bringing themselves to vote Tory. However, the vast majority of remoaners are Lilly livered Liberals, and change their minds to suit their Europhile agenda. I can’t see the most ardent Europhile Tories voting that way. More likely to vote for the Dolmio doll Farron :unamused:

+1

The problem being that too many Brexit and natural UKIP voters have probably now swallowed the lie that the Cons have suddenly changed from committed remainers to leavers.

While the idea that Corbyn isn’t a big player is yet more silly complacency or just the establishment playing down the Labour vote for tactical reasons.That establishment having shown that it would way prefer a Corbyn administration to a UKIP one. :bulb:

I haven’t swallowed any lies, and I don’t believe the current government are overly committed to Brexit. But seeing as they’ve already triggered article 50, I’ll be voting for them. I’m not a Tory, I’m not anything actually, as growing up under Thatcher, Major and Blair has left me without a voice tbh, but I just worry that a vote for ukip right now will be another step towards a hung parliament. If you’re a Brexiteer you’ve only got two options, the government that have already triggered article 50, or ukip. For the remoaners it’s pretty much anyone else

46

OVLOV JAY:

Carryfast:

OVLOV JAY:
We know the polls aren’t worth a toss at the best of times. But seeing as they’re polling on a pm/government they’re particularly redundant now. This will be Brexit mk2. I just hope enough Brexiteers come out. It’s going to be a very high turn out for a ge I think. Trouble is, the majority of Brexit voters are centre grounders, and very principalled. I can’t see staunch eurosceptic Labour voters bringing themselves to vote Tory. However, the vast majority of remoaners are Lilly livered Liberals, and change their minds to suit their Europhile agenda. I can’t see the most ardent Europhile Tories voting that way. More likely to vote for the Dolmio doll Farron :unamused:

+1

The problem being that too many Brexit and natural UKIP voters have probably now swallowed the lie that the Cons have suddenly changed from committed remainers to leavers.

While the idea that Corbyn isn’t a big player is yet more silly complacency or just the establishment playing down the Labour vote for tactical reasons.That establishment having shown that it would way prefer a Corbyn administration to a UKIP one. :bulb:

I haven’t swallowed any lies, and I don’t believe the current government are overly committed to Brexit. But seeing as they’ve already triggered article 50, I’ll be voting for them. I’m not a Tory, I’m not anything actually, as growing up under Thatcher, Major and Blair has left me without a voice tbh, but I just worry that a vote for ukip right now will be another step towards a hung parliament. If you’re a Brexiteer you’ve only got two options, the government that have already triggered article 50, or ukip. For the remoaners it’s pretty much anyone else

It seems clear that the Cons ‘triggering’ article 50 is just a tactical move to keep the Eurosceptics happy within what is still just the same basically Europhile rabble as before.Having clearly done so and in a way which keeps the remain agenda on track and still in the game.If the Cons were for real article 50 would have been triggered the day after the referendum with anything other than so called hard Brexit taken off the table and us well on our way out by the end of 2016.Bearing in mind that the single market is actually an economic liability to us for which we pay for the privilege.While no surprise the Cons haven’t even made that point.

On that basis it seems clear that everything that has happened since the referendum,from May’s leadership,to her conveniently delaying article 50,with EEA still on the table as part of that,is a pre arranged plan B by the Con remainers who didn’t believe that they could possibly lose the referendum vote.

While as you’ve said there the Cons haven’t exactly done anything good for the country since they took us into the EEC.So why trust them now on the basis that only a fool votes for the same lot and expects a different outcome.In which case the Brexit vote has got the option of voting for something different in UKIP but bottled out when the going got tough.Although to be fair Farage hasn’t exactly helped with his own actions in that regard.

While the idea of voting for May seems moot anyway when her plan is clearly just a bigger version of the stunt the Con remainers pulled in the Richmond Park fiasco.Based on their idea of better to let their remain opposition allies in than allow a Eurosceptic Conservative one.Another indicator being that the establishment media is clearly happy about May nuking her government because it knows that the most likely outcome is a Con minority government and with it a remain stitch up in parliament.Also bearing in mind that parliament not just May’s Cons voted to trigger article 50,the majority of that parliament being remainers,clearly on the basis that at most soft Brexit ( EEA ) is a foregone conclusion.Or at worse possibly even a small Labour majority in which case we can forget even that. :open_mouth:

In which case,as I’ve said,there’s nothing to lose in the Brexit vote holding its nerve and voting for UKIP and everything to gain and which is the only realistic way that we’ll get what we’ve voted for in the referendum. :bulb:

47

mazzer:
Sturgeon is rapidly becoming Ian Paisley mk 2 just disagreeing with everything, a while back she taunted May saying she had no mandate as no one had voted for her, now as May seeks a mandate Sturgeon says she’s wrong to do so, Sturgeons hatred of the English will do Scotland no favours at all

alot of scotland hate her too!!

48

you should all get online and search out the results of last election. me, i live in a very safe labour seat. last election Labour got almost 70% of the vote, with ukip, tories and liberals all on about 10%

remember - you are not voting for Corbyn vs May, not really even for a party - you can only vote to elect your MP, and in the election that i get to vote in, its going to be a Labour landslide

so i feel a bit disenfrachised to be honest, hardly worth voting at all. those of you who live in a marginal seat have so much more impact than i do

49

chrisdalott:
you should all get online and search out the results of last election. me, i live in a very safe labour seat. last election Labour got almost 70% of the vote, with ukip, tories and liberals all on about 10%

remember - you are not voting for Corbyn vs May, not really even for a party - you can only vote to elect your MP, and in the election that i get to vote in, its going to be a Labour landslide

so i feel a bit disenfrachised to be honest, hardly worth voting at all. those of you who live in a marginal seat have so much more impact than i do

The system as it stands isn’t really democracy.What’s needed is a combination of PR and transfer of powers from national government to local government regarding local issues and a lot more use of the referendum option in decision making.Instead of which we’ve got so called Liberal ‘Democrats’ calling for us to be governed by EU commissioners and foreign majority vote and refusing to recognise a referendum vote decision.In addition to the situation of 4 million + UKIP voters having no parliamentary representation.

50

chrisdalott:
you should all get online and search out the results of last election. me, i live in a very safe labour seat. last election Labour got almost 70% of the vote, with ukip, tories and liberals all on about 10%

remember - you are not voting for Corbyn vs May, not really even for a party - you can only vote to elect your MP, and in the election that i get to vote in, its going to be a Labour landslide

so i feel a bit disenfrachised to be honest, hardly worth voting at all. those of you who live in a marginal seat have so much more impact than i do

I’m the same I live in a safe Tory seat.

51

kr79:
I’m the same I live in a safe Tory seat.

‘Safe’ Con seats don’t get much safer than Richmond Park 35,000 + Con v around 11,000 LibDem.A majority which was obviously then over turned by remainer Cons either staying at home or voting LibDem.You can add to that our constituency which at the last count was 35,000 + v around 7,000 Labour and 5,000 LibDem.On that note there’s no reason to think that the Richmond Park example won’t be repeated in more or less every ‘safe’ Con seat around the country let alone marginal ones.Especially including this one,which like Richmond Park had,has a Brexit MP,but with a large remain majority vote who’ll vote LibDem in their droves probably together with tactical voting by the Labour lot.

Make no mistake May knows exactly what she’s doing and it has nothing to do with leaving the EU and everything to do with remaining.By creating a massive remain alliance majority in parliament.By effectively holding another EU referendum but this time on constituency boundary vote lines which the remainers will win easily.Having played a blinding act of a remainer who pretended to turn leaver.

52

Carryfast:

chrisdalott:
you should all get online and search out the results of last election. me, i live in a very safe labour seat. last election Labour got almost 70% of the vote, with ukip, tories and liberals all on about 10%

remember - you are not voting for Corbyn vs May, not really even for a party - you can only vote to elect your MP, and in the election that i get to vote in, its going to be a Labour landslide

so i feel a bit disenfrachised to be honest, hardly worth voting at all. those of you who live in a marginal seat have so much more impact than i do

The system as it stands isn’t really democracy.What’s needed is a combination of PR and transfer of powers from national government to local government regarding local issues and a lot more use of the referendum option in decision making.Instead of which we’ve got so called Liberal ‘Democrats’ calling for us to be governed by EU commissioners and foreign majority vote and refusing to recognise a referendum vote decision.In addition to the situation of 4 million + UKIP voters having no parliamentary representation.

exactly like in switzerland youtube.com/watch?v=dSLs5G4SPP4

53

chrisdalott:
exactly like in switzerland youtube.com/watch?v=dSLs5G4SPP4

  • 1

The key is the Confederal government system.That applies whether it’s the EU or the UK or ( what would/should have been ) the Confederate States of America. :bulb: :wink: Ironically I was discussing exactly that with our prospective Lib Dem County Councillor a few days ago regarding the contradiction between so called ‘democrats’ preaching so called democracy and local democracy and on the other hand,like Labour and the Cons,their liking for Centralised,Federal government when it suits them.To which his answer went along the lines of what’s that and how does it work and doesn’t it mean rebel,red kneck racist. :open_mouth: :laughing:

54

She and her media support conveniently seem to have forgotten that we’ve already voted in a referendum to Leave the EU on a hard Brexit mandate.We don’t need to vote again on the issue.Also bearing in mind that the Conservative government also already has the parliamentary majority in addition to the referendum mandate to deliver what they promised.

express.co.uk/news/politics/ … te–Brexit

IE the same referendum that the Cons said that they’d honour and do whatever the electorate decided.Then when the vote didn’t go Cameron’s way obviously decided to stall it so as to let the remainers among the Cons and in opposition in Parliament over turn it by whatever means.The ‘means’ in this case being obvious in the form of an unnecessary election in the hope ( probability ) that the Cons lose their majority.With the win win,for them,that they’ll then be able to say it wasn’t them when the Lab/Lib/SNP alliance reverse Brexit,or at least make it remain in all but name. :imp:

55

Carryfast:
I’d call a Con vote of 34,404 v LibDem 11,389 in 2015 and LibDem 20,510 in 2016 a ‘reasonably safe’ Con seat.

Typical Carryfast, the headline says this so it must be true!

The Richmond Park constituency was created in 1997 mainly out of the Richmond and Barnes constituency.
It returned a Lib Dem MP in 97, 01 and 05.

1997
Con: 22442
LDem: 25393
MAJ: 2951

2001
Con: 18480
LDem: 23444
MAJ: 4964

2005
Con: 20280
LDem: 24011
MAJ: 3731

At the 2010 election, following boundary changes, the constituency swung to the Conservatives but, again, with a similar majority
Con: 29461
LDem: 25370
MAJ: 4091

At the 2015 there was a sizeable shift to the Conservatives
Con: 34404
LDem: 11389
MAJ: 23015

Now anyone with a working brain cell would be asking why the majority has risen by so much. The answer is simple; Zac Goldsmith, the incumbent Conservative MP, fought the election as a single issue of being against Heathrow expansion with the promise that if the government of the day chose to expand Heathrow he would resign his seat and contest it as an Independant. He resigned in October 2016 and lost the by-election to the Lib Dems in December 2016. Goldsmith fought the by-election purely on the expansion of Heathrow but the Lib Dems fought it on Brexit and the local principles changed. Richmond Park was the number one Remain constituency in the country with 70% voting to remain.

You really need to learn to read past the headlines CF, there is a big wide world out there if only you could see past your pre-conceived ideas.

56

OVLOV JAY:
If you’re a Brexiteer you’ve only got two options, the government that have already triggered article 50, or ukip. For the remoaners it’s pretty much anyone else

And seeing as the Conservatives have stolen most of UKIP’s clothes, whilst the organisational ability of UKIP is appalling, it’s not surprising that the Conservative side of the 3.9m UKIP voters will return back to the Tories.

The Conservatives will win this election, and with a resounding majority. It’s then a matter of how they use that majority - to push for a deal with the EU which satisfies the Leave or Remain side of her party? As an out and out Brexiteer I hope for a deal which cuts our ties with the EU, I fear we will end up being tied to them through a never ending, transitional deal.

57

Stanley Knife:

OVLOV JAY:
If you’re a Brexiteer you’ve only got two options, the government that have already triggered article 50, or ukip. For the remoaners it’s pretty much anyone else

And seeing as the Conservatives have stolen most of UKIP’s clothes, whilst the organisational ability of UKIP is appalling, it’s not surprising that the Conservative side of the 3.9m UKIP voters will return back to the Tories.

The Conservatives will win this election, and with a resounding majority. It’s then a matter of how they use that majority - to push for a deal with the EU which satisfies the Leave or Remain side of her party? As an out and out Brexiteer I hope for a deal which cuts our ties with the EU, I fear we will end up being tied to them through a never ending, transitional deal.

I totally agree with you. I just worry that if not enough turn out, and some stay true to ukip, a hand full of ukip seats in places like Thurrock and Clacton pull enough seats off the cons, it may force a remoaners coalition. We’ve already seen in Richmond that they abandon all principles for their beloved eu. They don’t want a third runway, but they’re happy to have one if membership is maintained :open_mouth: I’m sure that while a Corbyn/Farron/Sturgeon set up will absolutely blow us back to the stone ages within a 5 year term, these people will vote for them as per their Europhile agendas :unamused:

58

Stanley Knife:

Carryfast:
I’d call a Con vote of 34,404 v LibDem 11,389 in 2015 and LibDem 20,510 in 2016 a ‘reasonably safe’ Con seat.

Typical Carryfast, the headline says this so it must be true!

The Richmond Park constituency was created in 1997 mainly out of the Richmond and Barnes constituency.
It returned a Lib Dem MP in 97, 01 and 05.

1997
Con: 22442
LDem: 25393
MAJ: 2951

2001
Con: 18480
LDem: 23444
MAJ: 4964

2005
Con: 20280
LDem: 24011
MAJ: 3731

At the 2010 election, following boundary changes, the constituency swung to the Conservatives but, again, with a similar majority
Con: 29461
LDem: 25370
MAJ: 4091

At the 2015 there was a sizeable shift to the Conservatives
Con: 34404
LDem: 11389
MAJ: 23015

Now anyone with a working brain cell would be asking why the majority has risen by so much. The answer is simple; Zac Goldsmith, the incumbent Conservative MP, fought the election as a single issue of being against Heathrow expansion with the promise that if the government of the day chose to expand Heathrow he would resign his seat and contest it as an Independant. He resigned in October 2016 and lost the by-election to the Lib Dems in December 2016. Goldsmith fought the by-election purely on the expansion of Heathrow but the Lib Dems fought it on Brexit and the local principles changed. Richmond Park was the number one Remain constituency in the country with 70% voting to remain.

You really need to learn to read past the headlines CF, there is a big wide world out there if only you could see past your pre-conceived ideas.

You seem to have conveniently missed the point that the LibDems are also anti Heathrow expansion.Which obviously counts out that as an explanation for Goldsmith’s previous massive Con majority.

In which case all you’ve proved is what I’ve said that firstly the remainers aren’t prepared to accept the referendum vote for Brexit and will do everything in their power to over turn it.May obviously being one of them.

Which leaves the inconvenient questions why did the Cons go back on their promise not to expand Heathrow.Bearing in mind Goldsmith’s position of being both anti Heathrow expansion and pro Brexit with,just like now,the result of that move being totally predictable ?.IE the Con remainers predictably voted accordingly when he carried out his promise of resigning his seat.

On that note I guess that you’re also now going to say that Raab’s seat was never a ‘safe’ Con seat. :unamused: In which my bet is he’ll also have a his 28,000 + majority overtuned in favour of LibDem with,like Richmond Park,the Labour vote probably also voting tactically with the LibDems to add to the remain Con vote. :open_mouth: With at least myself as one of the 5,000 + UKIP vote here now being even less prepared than before to ditch my anti EU principles by voting for him.While Kingston and Twickenham returning to LibDem is also a foregone conclusion to add to Richmond Park.Bearing in mind that the Richmond and Twickenham Remain referendum vote covers two seperate parliamentary seats.IE we can probably subtract at least three present Con seats,from its present majority before the election even starts.

The fact is the Cons are an ideologically pro EU federalist Party despite all their pretence otherwise and anyone who really thinks that May will deliver Brexit is deluded.The fact that she’s a remainer,who’s successfully delayed Brexit by at least a year and now dissolved a perfectly viable government,which could/should have delivered it,in the knowledge that this will be a Remain v Brexit General Election,which the remainers will inevitably win,just confirming that fact. :unamused:

Ironically my personal view now being that it’s better to stick to my principles by voting UKIP than believe May’s lies.While it’s probably easier to fight the EU federal project from within anyway allied with other European nationalist groups.Than to rely on the pathetic Brit Brexit agenda characterised by people of the calibre of Carswell and Boris Johnson.When we inevitably end up with the predictable Con minority remain government after May’s re run of the referendum on constituency boundary lines,just as May and her remain cronies intended from the start.

59

OVLOV JAY:

Stanley Knife:

OVLOV JAY:
If you’re a Brexiteer you’ve only got two options, the government that have already triggered article 50, or ukip. For the remoaners it’s pretty much anyone else

And seeing as the Conservatives have stolen most of UKIP’s clothes, whilst the organisational ability of UKIP is appalling, it’s not surprising that the Conservative side of the 3.9m UKIP voters will return back to the Tories.

The Conservatives will win this election, and with a resounding majority. It’s then a matter of how they use that majority - to push for a deal with the EU which satisfies the Leave or Remain side of her party? As an out and out Brexiteer I hope for a deal which cuts our ties with the EU, I fear we will end up being tied to them through a never ending, transitional deal.

I totally agree with you. I just worry that if not enough turn out, and some stay true to ukip, a hand full of ukip seats in places like Thurrock and Clacton pull enough seats off the cons, it may force a remoaners coalition. We’ve already seen in Richmond that they abandon all principles for their beloved eu. They don’t want a third runway, but they’re happy to have one if membership is maintained :open_mouth: I’m sure that while a Corbyn/Farron/Sturgeon set up will absolutely blow us back to the stone ages within a 5 year term, these people will vote for them as per their Europhile agendas :unamused:

The simple questions as to -

Why have the Cons chosen to delay Brexit up to this point.

Why now dissolve a perfectly functioning administration.Which had a sufficient majority to honour its supposed promise to implement the rederendum vote, including obviously soft Brexit being taken off the table as part of that.

Why do the remain opposition Parties seem so keen to go along with all that.

Why put remainers in the top jobs instead of at least supposed Con Leavers like Davis and Raab after Cameron’s resignation.

Should all set the alarm bells ringing with any true committed Brexiteer.

As for UKIP’s chaotic opposition anyone with any sense would have asked the question why would Conservatives like Carswell have any interest in UKIP.While it’s clear that UKIP has predictably been infiltrated by establishment wreckers regardless.While exactly what/who has shut Farage up.Which explains the present situation and is even more reason why the UKIP vote now needs to hold its nerve and add to its previous vote not abandon the Party.

While yes ideologically Europhile Cons,just masquerading in UKIP clothes to defeat UKIP,explains exactly Cameron’s and May’s plan from losing the referendum vote.Together with having placed people like Carswell in UKIP to act as a wrecking ball,as a bit of insurance.

60

Carryfast:

Stanley Knife:

Carryfast:
I’d call a Con vote of 34,404 v LibDem 11,389 in 2015 and LibDem 20,510 in 2016 a ‘reasonably safe’ Con seat.

Typical Carryfast, the headline says this so it must be true!

The Richmond Park constituency was created in 1997 mainly out of the Richmond and Barnes constituency.
It returned a Lib Dem MP in 97, 01 and 05.

1997
Con: 22442
LDem: 25393
MAJ: 2951

2001
Con: 18480
LDem: 23444
MAJ: 4964

2005
Con: 20280
LDem: 24011
MAJ: 3731

At the 2010 election, following boundary changes, the constituency swung to the Conservatives but, again, with a similar majority
Con: 29461
LDem: 25370
MAJ: 4091

At the 2015 there was a sizeable shift to the Conservatives
Con: 34404
LDem: 11389
MAJ: 23015

Now anyone with a working brain cell would be asking why the majority has risen by so much. The answer is simple; Zac Goldsmith, the incumbent Conservative MP, fought the election as a single issue of being against Heathrow expansion with the promise that if the government of the day chose to expand Heathrow he would resign his seat and contest it as an Independant. He resigned in October 2016 and lost the by-election to the Lib Dems in December 2016. Goldsmith fought the by-election purely on the expansion of Heathrow but the Lib Dems fought it on Brexit and the local principles changed. Richmond Park was the number one Remain constituency in the country with 70% voting to remain.

You really need to learn to read past the headlines CF, there is a big wide world out there if only you could see past your pre-conceived ideas.

You seem to have conveniently missed the point that the LibDems are also anti Heathrow expansion.Which obviously counts out that as an explanation for Goldsmith’s previous massive Con majority.

In which case all you’ve proved is what I’ve said that firstly the remainers aren’t prepared to accept the referendum vote for Brexit and will do everything in their power to over turn it.May obviously being one of them.

Which leaves the inconvenient questions why did the Cons go back on their promise not to expand Heathrow.Bearing in mind Goldsmith’s position of being both anti Heathrow expansion and pro Brexit with,just like now,the result of that move being totally predictable ?.IE the Con remainers predictably voted accordingly when he carried out his promise of resigning his seat.

On that note I guess that you’re also now going to say that Raab’s seat was never a ‘safe’ Con seat. :unamused: In which my bet is he’ll also have a his 28,000 + majority overtuned in favour of LibDem with,like Richmond Park,the Labour vote probably also voting tactically with the LibDems to add to the remain Con vote. :open_mouth: With at least myself as one of the 5,000 + UKIP vote here now being even less prepared than before to ditch my anti EU principles by voting for him.While Kingston and Twickenham returning to LibDem is also a foregone conclusion to add to Richmond Park.Bearing in mind that the Richmond and Twickenham Remain referendum vote covers two seperate parliamentary seats.IE we can probably subtract at least three present Con seats,from its present majority before the election even starts.

The fact is the Cons are an ideologically pro EU federalist Party despite all their pretence otherwise and anyone who really thinks that May will deliver Brexit is deluded.The fact that she’s a remainer,who’s successfully delayed Brexit by at least a year and now dissolved a perfectly viable government,which could/should have delivered it,in the knowledge that this will be a Remain v Brexit General Election,which the remainers will inevitably win,just confirming that fact. :unamused:

Ironically my personal view now being that it’s better to stick to my principles by voting UKIP than believe May’s lies.While it’s probably easier to fight the EU federal project from within anyway allied with other European nationalist groups.Than to rely on the pathetic Brit Brexit agenda characterised by people of the calibre of Carswell and Boris Johnson.When we inevitably end up with the predictable Con minority remain government after May’s re run of the referendum on constituency boundary lines,just as May and her remain cronies intended from the start.

I think that Mrs May wanted to remain but accepts the vote so is just doing that.This lady is a very strong woman.You lorry lads have turned round somewhere in the wrong street and and get out of it.Shut your chops and let her get us going the right way