Working hours /rest on nights out

[edd1974]

Can someone settle an argument who's right. Here. And I stress this isn't me.
Basically we do occasionally nights out.
Some weeks none others 2 or 3.

Theres a colleuge where I work .
He does his drops for the day.. rings office
Let's say they tell.him.ok 8am pickup magna park.
So he will drive as close as possible to collection. Time permitting.

Have a night out.

Here's the issue. He can be parked up say 7. Collection is 8am next day.
He insists on taking his 9 hours rest then starting again.
So he finishes at 7 stats at 4 am .arrives at collection at 5 for an 8 am collection and. Just parks and waits.
Been doing this for ages and been found.out.

His argument is on a night out you only need 9 hours rest.
Not my.problem if my pickup isn't untill. 8 .
After 9 hours I'm moving and want.paying.work are saying no

Is he in his rights to have 9 hrs off then set off ?
If this makes sense.
Me personally I'd have a lie in if honest.
Who's right here
Work or colleuge?

[yourhavingalarf]

Oooh good one...

I'd say work is right. There's no reason for him to get going early and then sit around for hours doing nothing until 8. If he's going to sit around he might as well do it in the lay-by and then arrive on site for 07:50.

It's the firms train set and it's up to them to run it how they want.

[The-Snowman]

Im no expert on drivers rules but I dont think anyone is actually right or wrong.

As long as his driver hours and WTD arent being compromised due to the earlier start then hes fine to do it after 9 hours off.
Although if I were the one paying the wages id also be pretty miffed at only taking 9 off so he can sit for 3 hours doing nothing (probably going back to sleep) yet still getting paid.

On balance though, I get the impression your colleague is a bit of a dick.

[Franglais]

What he is doing is legal, we can agree?
If he is finishing at the depot, does he book off at 4? Then come back in at 1 in the morning wanting pay?
.
If parking up early an employment contract should pay for minimum agreednumber of hours per day, but here he is IMHO taking the mickey.
If he hates nights out and is trying to get out of them? Change jobs.

[Mazzer2]

Can someone settle an argument who's right. Here. And I stress this isn't me.
Basically we do occasionally nights out.
Some weeks none others 2 or 3.

Theres a colleuge where I work .
He does his drops for the day.. rings office
Let's say they tell.him.ok 8am pickup magna park.
So he will drive as close as possible to collection. Time permitting.

Have a night out.

Here's the issue. He can be parked up say 7. Collection is 8am next day.
He insists on taking his 9 hours rest then starting again.
So he finishes at 7 stats at 4 am .arrives at collection at 5 for an 8 am collection and. Just parks and waits.
Been doing this for ages and been found.out.

His argument is on a night out you only need 9 hours rest.
Not my.problem if my pickup isn't untill. 8 .
After 9 hours I'm moving and want.paying.work are saying no

Is he in his rights to have 9 hrs off then set off ?
If this makes sense.
Me personally I'd have a lie in if honest.
Who's right here
Work or colleuge?

Why would you get up at 4 when there is no need? and then limit your time by wasting 3 hours waiting, any delays later in the day could result in running out of spreadover. Is he happy parking up on a Friday night having run out of spread which wouldn't have happened if he'd have started at 7. Also if tramping why use your 9 hour breaks up needlessly always pays to keep one for Friday to ensure you get home that night and not Saturday morning having had to have an eleven hour break an hour from the yard, he sounds bit of an eejit to me.

[edd1974]

we all know he's doing it to get extra hours in.
In my opinion I aim to get there an hour early. Gives me time incase. Of holdups. Plus might get loaded early.
Think it's. Moral issue.
As say I'd rather have few. Extra hours in bed

[Mazzer2]

To add this is the reason why drivers end up being micro managed because eejits like this don't have the common sense to do the job properly and be left to get on with it.

[ROG]

There are the tacho regs and the work contract
Driver may well be inside tacho regs but in this case the work contract takes priority

It would be the same if the driver was at home between shifts and told the lorry is not ready for until 8am but the driver clocks on at 4am - the company is not legally obliged to pay for the time between 4am and 8am

[Franglais]

To add this is the reason why drivers end up being micro managed because eejits like this don't have the common sense to do the job properly and be left to get on with it.

Agreed. Behave like a silly kid, and you'll be treated like one.
.
.
And so will the rest of us.

[remy]

I'm with the driver on this one. You lot are always on about crap wages yet you'd waste three hours of work time for nothing.

[Mazzer2]

I'm with the driver on this one. You lot are always on about crap wages yet you'd waste three hours of work time for nothing.

There are ways of increasing your wage but this is not one of them the office will tell him not to start before a sensible time in the future and refuse to pay him if he does which is well within their rights, subtlety is the way to boost your wages not kicking the box out of it

[the nodding donkey]

snip.....
Here's the issue. He can be parked up say 7. Collection is 8am next day.
He insists on taking his 9 hours rest then starting again.
So he finishes at 7 stats at 4 am .arrives at collection at 5 for an 8 am collection and. Just parks and waits.
Been doing this for ages and been found.out.

His argument is on a night out you only need 9 hours rest.
Not my.problem if my pickup isn't untill. 8 .
After 9 hours I'm moving and want.paying.work are saying no 

Is he in his rights to have 9 hrs off then set off ?
.....snip

No, he's taking the proverbial, to get extra hours in. Ask him if he would do the same if he was paid salary.
It's no different from parking up in a layby on your way back to the yard for an hour to hang to job out.

[milodon]

I'm with the driver on this one. You lot are always on about crap wages yet you'd waste three hours of work time for nothing.

I've never gotten a raise by taking the piss

[Carryfast]

I'm with the driver on this one. You lot are always on about crap wages yet you'd waste three hours of work time for nothing.

It's not work time.
He's needlessly turning a daily rest period into POA and a reduced daily rest period.The customer ain't going to pay for a truck being parked up for hours outside the gates before its booked tipping time.

[yourhavingalarf]

If he is finishing at the depot, does he book off at 4? Then come back in at 1 in the morning wanting pay?

Ding ding ding...

We have a winner!

[the maoster]

If they stopped paying him for those three wasted hours he’d soon stop doing it. Greed, pure and simple.

[eagerbeaver]

If he is finishing at the depot, does he book off at 4? Then come back in at 1 in the morning wanting pay?

Ding ding ding...

We have a winner!

Let me tell you my good friend who else is a winner....me. That's right folks, the greatest TN member ever has popped back in for a metaphoric piss upon the wheel of debate.

In my view nights out should be stopped. It's 2021 and many people now have homes with indoor toilets, it's about time people realised that quarter a ton of the Queen's finest(which hasn't increased for yonks) is a pitiful nightly amount for guarding the bosses lorry & contents, let alone worrying about working hours/rest on nights out.

I am not dead my old mate, but some of my brain cells are sadly. This dreadful situation is mainly my own fault though for reading too many Franglais brexit tantrums, Conor's boring wage willy waving & various other bilge. Sadly TNUK continues to offer the social media equivalent of unwanted seed at the bottom of a parrot's cage, however this is the fault of the contributor's & not the mods.

In fact the last time I saw such a collection of helmets was a number of years ago in J&S motorcycles Northwich whilst perusing the Arai section.

[remy]

I don't see it as greed, what if he got a stop off at 10am then next stop was an hour away but couldn't unload till 2pm isn't he entitled to get paid for the three hours waiting ? Maybe I've been paid by the mile too long to remember how being paid by the hour works.

[Carryfast]

I don't see it as greed, what if he got a stop off at 10am then next stop was an hour away but couldn't unload till 2pm isn't he entitled to get paid for the three hours waiting ? Maybe I've been paid by the mile too long to remember how being paid by the hour works.

If the guvnor says finish at 5 pm and start again at 7 am he obviously ain't going to pay you if you decided to start at 4 am.In fact he'll probably sack you if he'd planned you to finish at 8pm including unpaid breaks.

[Harry Monk]

I don't see it as greed, what if he got a stop off at 10am then next stop was an hour away but couldn't unload till 2pm isn't he entitled to get paid for the three hours waiting ?

He would. However in this scenario the driver appears to be starting work three hours earlier than necessary thus arriving at the collection point three hours before they open in order to get three hours' extra pay.

Which on the face of it is taking the piss. An hour or so tossed off in a lay-by once in a while pretty much goes with the territory but to do it every single day kicks the arse out of it a bit.

[remy]

Now wait just a cotton picking minute here, it appears I may have not read the OP correctly. I was under the impression that the driver did a night out then went to the pick up but if he went back to the yard that night then left the yard in the morning for the pick up then much to my chagrin I must change my vote in favour of the firm.

[remy]

I don't see it as greed, what if he got a stop off at 10am then next stop was an hour away but couldn't unload till 2pm isn't he entitled to get paid for the three hours waiting ?

He would. However in this scenario the driver appears to be starting work three hours earlier than necessary thus arriving at the collection point three hours before they open in order to get three hours' extra pay.

Which on the face of it is taking the piss. An hour or so tossed off in a lay-by once in a while pretty much goes with the territory but to do it every single day kicks the arse out of it a bit.

Thanks Mr Monk, I reread the OP and think I get it now.

[peirre]

To add this is the reason why drivers end up being micro managed because eejits like this don't have the common sense to do the job properly and be left to get on with it.

He may think he’s one of those super “Proper Drivers” I keep reading about on here if I was his boss I’d give him a can of lilt and a manky orange on Friday morning and the tell him there’s no steak dinner for him tonight

[edd1974]

Need to add/clarify.

If he's back at the yard work tell him what time to start the next day and he does. But when he has a night out he insists law says only need 9hrs rest after 9. Hrs I'm setting.off and want paying.
Must add also he's only. Youngish maybe 30.
And yet another driver who does his walk around checks then sits in his truck waiting for 20 mins to pass.

[Franglais]

Need to add/clarify.

If he's back at the yard work tell him what time to start the next day and he does. But when he has a night out he insists law says only need 9hrs rest after 9. Hrs I'm setting.off and want paying.
Must add also he's only. Youngish maybe 30.
And yet another driver who does his walk around checks then sits in his truck waiting for 20 mins to pass.

His actual age has little to do with it.
There are many youngsters (nearly everyone seems young to me now!) with a wide head on their shoulders.
Any many old farts with a silly kid's attitude to things.
Nowt wrong with being young at heart, by the way.

[lolipop]

1. Slack incompetent Boss for not querying his reason for starting early when the hours could have been used at the end of the day.
2. The blokes commonly called a [zb]

[Harry Monk]

Need to add/clarify.

If he's back at the yard work tell him what time to start the next day and he does. But when he has a night out he insists law says only need 9hrs rest after 9. Hrs I'm setting.off and want paying.

If he finishes work for the week at 1800 Friday, does he come back in at 1800 Saturday if he is permitted a reduced rest period?

[yourhavingalarf]

Let me tell you my good friend who else is a winner....me. That's right folks, the greatest TN member ever has popped back in for a metaphoric piss upon the wheel of debate.

YAY!...

The chosen one has graced us with his wisdom and knowledge. So whatever he say's is correct and the thread might as well end now.

I feel educated, humble and much much wiser (as well as a touch of indigestion but that's probably a result of too much chocolate trifle after lunch today).

[Carryfast]

Need to add/clarify.

If he's back at the yard work tell him what time to start the next day and he does. But when he has a night out he insists law says only need 9hrs rest after 9. Hrs I'm setting.off and want paying.

If he finishes work for the week at 1800 Friday, does he come back in at 1800 Saturday if he is permitted a reduced rest period?

Obviously he and everyone else would have to every alternate week if he wants to provide some credibility to his argument.Also refuse any job that stops 1 hour pay for a break when it only needs to be 45 minutes.

[remy]

Need to add/clarify.

If he's back at the yard work tell him what time to start the next day and he does. But when he has a night out he insists law says only need 9hrs rest after 9. Hrs I'm setting.off and want paying.
Must add also he's only. Youngish maybe 30.
And yet another driver who does his walk around checks then sits in his truck waiting for 20 mins to pass.

So I did read it right the first time dammit. He did have a night out so I'm going back to agreeing with him on being paid. What if he couldn't pick up till 11am then he could have a really nice long lay in then.