kcrussell25:
albion:
robbo99:
kcrussell25:
I am paye for the reasons above so not affected but did wonder something if anyone has any thoughts.If in 5 years time for example the tax man decides that ltd driver was employed and owes x amount in back tax will ltd driver have a claim against the various companies they have worked for for unpaid holiday, pension, ssp etc?
Obviously depending on the company still trading but surely if its the ruled that the driver was employed for tax reasons then surely they get the associated benefits?
In an ideal world I would say that the worker should be entitled to benefits you mention if it was found that the worker was deemed to be an employee and not a legitimate Ltd Co for the work he carried out.
In the real world, I wonder how much time and money it would cost to recover benefits especially if the worker had worked for many agencies over the 5 year period, especially for odd days / odd weeks work carried out. It would probably take a worker to go through the courts as a test case to get a ruling.
The Pimlico Plumbers ruling is being appealed through the courts and will probably take years to settle.Just to clarify, my drivers are PAYE and I have no-one, nor would I, who is self-employed work for me.
However, if I was Charlie from Pimlico, I’d be getting my highly paid accountant to shovel as much as poss into pensions, wifes pension, Cayman Islands, latest tax wheeze, pay myself dividends of a few zillion and then say there you go, I’m finishing my company and there’s £3.50 left after paying suppliers, pay any outstanding holiday/SSP/pension out of that and laugh all the way to my mansion in the Bahamas. He doesn’t need to work, he could finish if he wanted to.
The pimlico is different from what I asked because they are disputing status, side note I believe him to be an employee on a tax fiddle who suddenly wanted to be an employee when it suits.
My question was that if hmrc decides you are an employee the debate is over (unless either side wants a long and expensive fight) so I would expect that to be beyond doubt. I agree it is likely to not be worth for odd day/week bookings but I know some drivers who are “permanent” but employed ltd, still see it advertised on Facebook. In that case I think it would be well worth chasing. I think moneyclaim online is quite cheap and easy and whilst Albion rightly says the owner of Pimlico could stop tomorrow a lot of companies wouldn’t want to. Could it actually put some out of business for these bills going back a few years?
For HMRC to make a decision on someones employment status (IR35) then that is their view of a workers status, ie employee or Director of a stand alone Ltd Company. A worker can’t just make a claim to money claim online against an ex or current employer just because HMRC demand a payment of back dated tax / ni from the worker due to him / her being classed as an employee. These matters have to go through Tax Tribunals and can go all the way through the court system right to the top. Uber, Pimlico Plumbers, Ryan Air Pilots, Christa Ackroyd, (ex BBC look North presenter) and many other examples prove the many grey areas involved in deciding someones employment status. When a test case has gone the full rounds, (and if the worker loses), then that would be the time to try to recover any monies owing for holiday pay and so on but as stated being owed it and recovering it are two different matters.