Gurner:
Im taking the new wagon and drag (A frame) milk tanker out for the next 3 days on farm collections.
I bet that’ll be a right pain in the udder.
Good luck, are you getting any practise in before you go to a farm in anger?
daxi:
To be fair Scanny, I have no respect for Anglian Widows, but they do have a lot of decent guy’s who work for them & I have no problem in admitting that.
there are decent guys everywhere mate but its the companies who give them a bad name. at the end of the day, i respect all HGV drivers and treat them accordingly. the A frame drivers do deserve a bit more though. they must have put some serious hours in to perfect their skills with them.
funnily enough, i am trying to put in extra hours to get the hang of blind side reversing an artic but i havent really been told anything yet 
is there some kind of exercise that i can do to practice? how do you know when to straighten up? i am getting the hang of backing in on my good side (ish) and i did manage to back across the yard and into a space without a shunt the other day but that was probably a fluke. i want to practice after work tomorrow for a while when it is quiet but i dont know what to practice yet 
Simon:
A-frame trailers take a lot of getting used to. It’s a real skill to do a good tidy job of reversing them into a spot. You don’t really need training on it though, just practice, practice and then some more practice. I know cause I can/could do it..
Only training would be thinking A-frame as a separate rigid and to think where you want it to go. Then you think which way you have to turn trailers front axles and then you turn rigid to opposite direction. After that only practice will help. Biggest mistakes are to make too wide moves with steering wheel and pull too much forward when trailer starts going to wrong direction. You just need to pull something like 20cm forward and then reverse again. I drove my license with A-frame and after that I have only occasionally driven artics but haven’t had any bigger problems with them. They are so “fast” to reverse that I usually have to pull forward becouse trailer turned too much 
I can’t comment on artics as I’m restricted to drawbars.
Personally I find them quite easy especially the ‘straight bar’
The women tend to prefer drawbars too.
They like having 2 ridgids and not one with a limp end 
Lucy:
I’ve yet to see a training school stupid enough to teach people in an A-frame though, :
Lucy,
Peter Lane Transport, from Bristol I think, trained all my drivers at Toray. Most needed one day intensive with the bloke and then lots of practice. One never could grasp it, and one other struggled and got by with difficulty later, but the good ones were brilliant.
I would have trained them myself if I had had the time. I taught myself years ago after first working out the principles involved. Mainly, as Wheelnut and Krybo have said, that they must be thought of as two rigids and that you must never pull too far forward in a corrective shunt. Again, little and often is the watchword with wheel movements. Reversing round corners was easier than a straight line, providing you could see where you were going. A useful tool is to deliberately throw it off first one way then the other with small wheel turns.
But never, NEVER, be tempted to nose it in. It is not easier, you can’t see down the sides for one thing, and can’t see where you are going at all. I believe the fities ‘old timers’ (yes, there are some older than me) did it this way, but that is because they had very heavy non-powered steering, and pas is the most useful tool in your box.
I love 'em, mainly because everyone and his dog has an artic or a caravan, but to do an A-frame, and, make it look easy, is a real adrenalin rush for a show-off merchant 
.
Salut, David.
Spardo:
as Wheelnut and Krybo have said, that they must be thought of as two rigids and that you must never pull too far forward in a corrective shunt. . A useful tool is to deliberately throw it off first one way then the other with small wheel turns.
spot on 
Spardo:
I love 'em, mainly because everyone and his dog has an artic or a caravan, but to do an A-frame, and, make it look easy, is a real adrenalin rush for a show-off merchant
I like it. 
I have driven all 3 artics, drawbars and A frames.
As stated before with the drawbars there is a lot of outswing which can complicate things.
The A frame is just case of practice makes perfect the basic trick is not to try to reverse it straight, bend it first so that you can see out of the side window or in the mirror what the first or swivel axle is doing from the position of that axle it is not too difficult to work out where the back end will be going.
I was fortunate to do a BRS drawbar driving course back in 1992. Top tip when reversing an A frame, never let the angle of bend get beyond 10% or you’ll never get it back. To keep the angle tight (and thus the degree of control at its maximum) pull forward and straighten up for a second attempt.
One top tip. Just as I’m feeling confident about it, I manage to slip back into artic thinking and manage to get myself stuck in a companys gateway this morning :lol:. Nothing was damaged bar my pride 
. Could have been a lot worse and lesson learned . Trouble is, I’m off their tomorrow as well 
. For those who are interested it’s a straight bar drawbar. No excuse apart from me not paying attention. Must try harder .
i did my test in a draw bar wagon and drag and passed 2nd time (first time failed on the motorway to close to the vehicle in front)and then got stuck doing w&d work for about a year doing deliverys to wine shops…
the problem with doing wagon and drag work is when you have to do a nasty tip you have to find somewhere safe to put the trailer, somewhere level ,somewhere some numpty doesn’t park his car in front of it then go off for a 3hour walk with his dog .
give me a artic anyday
jon
Liberace:
: . For those who are interested it’s a straight bar drawbar. No excuse apart from me not paying attention. Must try harder
To all intents and purposes it is an artic then. So how could you get it wrong? Long unit, short trailer that’s all.
Salut, David.
jonboy:
the problem with doing wagon and drag work is when you have to do a nasty tip you have to find somewhere safe to put the trailer, somewhere level ,somewhere some numpty doesn’t park his car in front of it then go off for a 3hour walk with his doggive me a artic anyday
jon
If it’s an A-frame it’s no more problem than with an artic. Just pull the bar round with a chain or strap to the right angle, couple up and depart . If anything it’s easier than an artic where you would probably have to wind up the trailer to get your unit in at right angles.
Salut, David.
Liberace:
One top tip. Just as I’m feeling confident about it, I manage to slip back into artic thinking and manage to get myself stuck in a companys gateway this morning
get the horse through and the carriage will follow
pased my test in wag+drag easiest thing ive ever driven 
reversing is a piece of cake(first time in the hole ,no shunts )
never driven one since just close coupled artics (ussually45’triaxles )how different were they
soon got the hang of it though ,like everyone says "practice “etc,etc,etc
that would explain my reversing then
and why is it when you reverse or are looking for somewhere you turn the radio down? 
and if youve got 2” either side itll go straight in ,
empty bay either side ,everyone thinks youve let the guide dog reverse it
Spardo:
Liberace:
: . For those who are interested it’s a straight bar drawbar. No excuse apart from me not paying attention. Must try harderTo all intents and purposes it is an artic then. So how could you get it wrong? Long unit, short trailer that’s all.
Salut, David.
See the bit about me not paying attention .
knight:
I passed my test in a W&D so I found artics a pain to drive at first.
won`t passing your test in a W&D leave you with a 102 restriction on your licence? and therefore not legal to drive a normal artic combo?
peirre:
knight:
I passed my test in a W&D so I found artics a pain to drive at first.won`t passing your test in a W&D leave you with a 102 restriction on your licence? and therefore not legal to drive a normal artic combo?
If you had an old drawbar licence you get the cat 102, if you take your C+E test in a drawbar now you get the full licence so can drive any articulated vehicle, its because of the way they re-organised the categorys.
I drive wagon and drag, the trailer has a 35ft body, unit has a 18ft body, making it maximum length 63ft. just to complicate things a bit more, i normally run at 10ft overhang of the trailer, and also about 6 ft overhang of the back of the unit. To say things can get interesting is an understatement. need to watch out for traffic lights with the rear swing out. when you turn, the overhang moves over about 10ft. But its still easier to reverse than a A frame
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dean36014:
I drive wagon and drag, the trailer has a 35ft body, unit has a 18ft body, making it maximum length 63ft. just to complicate things a bit more, i normally run at 10ft overhang of the trailer, and also about 6 ft overhang of the back of the unit. To say things can get interesting is an understatement. need to watch out for traffic lights with the rear swing out. when you turn, the overhang moves over about 10ft. But its still easier to reverse than a A frame[/img]
Nice truck dean36014 and how close is that middle caravan
to the back one as it looks like it’s resting on the window of
the back one also welcome to TruckNet UK .