Hi Carl
Interesting reading the TT Little/Lewins story thanks for sharing it with us, Clover Can were based on Castleside Industrial Estate they closed down years ago, I have a photo somewhere of a line of their trailers parked in Siddle C. Cooks yard I don’t know if they took over the work or had just parked the trailers up but know doubt someone on here will know, as for Lewins removals they had a warehouse which was an old church on Watling Street which is in Leadgate near Consett .regards prattman
prattman:
Hi Carl
Interesting reading the TT Little/Lewins story thanks for sharing it with us, Clover Can were based on Castleside Industrial Estate they closed down years ago, I have a photo somewhere of a line of their trailers parked in Siddle C. Cooks yard I don’t know if they took over the work or had just parked the trailers up but know doubt someone on here will know, as for Lewins removals they had a warehouse which was an old church on Watling Street which is in Leadgate near Consett .regards prattman
Hi that adds up. I thought it was an old church, but it must have been quite large inside, but after all these years I cannot remember> I wonder if Tom had parked the trailers at Siddle’s yard when he finnished and put the Dodge Tractors in at Leadgate. Wouldn’t it be strange if they were still there today?
Carl
Hi Carl
just come across this cutting from the Commercial Motor which I cut out and kept, would have been a sad day for you I guess. regards prattman.
prattman:
Hi Carljust come across this cutting from the Commercial Motor which I cut out and kept, would have been a sad day for you I guess. regards prattman.
Hi Prattman,
I had never seen that thank you for keeping it all these years and sharing it.
Looking back now it was a sad day, but at the time I was so relieved of getting rid of the absolute stress, anxiety and worry. Now I wished I had more strength and fought on.
The advert is incorrect as it was not our entire fleet. It was the part of the fleet that was entirely owned by the company. Vehicles that were subject to financial agreements were taken and sold by British Car Auctions
Amongst there were 6 Mercedes 16ton GVW curtainside rigids A501-A506XVK
Merecedes 13 Ton GVW Boxvan B290MDC
2 or 3 ERF 32 ton ERF tractor units
There were also 3 Bedford Marsden Pantechnicons owned by my father and hired by him to the company which he sold independently
1 BMC 7-5 ton Luton which I had bought from the company
Also the receivers had sold several pantechnicon vans between 6th Jan and the auction to finance employing some staff etc to tidy things up etc. I will explain within the next day or so.
Also noticeably not on the list was th
e following fully owned vehicles
Bedford TK Breakdown
Bedford RL
Landrover
Various service vans From memory
Bedford diesel pickup.
Astra style Bedford Van (Coachskill livery)
2 Ford ■■■■■■ vans
Also various company cars
Carl
Earlier in the thread I mentioned NPT719D the Morris J2 luton having a body built by Bluebird, the caravan makers. I just recently found this photo of their stand at the Commercial Motor Show. The van in the foreground is a Commer but behind is a Morris or Austin J2
I often wondered where Dad got the idea of a J2 with Bluebird body and this is probably the answer
Finishing off the Tom Liddle Story my mind goes back to about 1980.
For a few years going into Chester Le Street from A167 up past northern bus Garage past Picktree Lane on the right hand side there used to be a clothing factory. Over the years I had noticed the back of a van which they obviously used for storage and thought no more. One day however the van had been moved round and low and behold I was one of T.T Liddle’s old ERFs. It had been painted over in a grey prime which over the years was washing off and the unmistakable Maroon paint and name had begun to gape trough the grey.
I mentioned it to my dad who immediately volunteered to go to see them to enquire if they were prepared to sell it to us. For some reason whoever he was meeting at Chester Le Street was unavailable for about a week, and we talked as to how we could restore it to new condition. We agreed we would rally it along with our two Bedford and talked as how we could paint in authentic 1950 W.H.W livery.
Dad was very enthusiastic, which was unusual as he never took much interest in our two Bedfords and I was surprised when he announced that should we buy it we thought we must bring it back into T.T. Liddle livery as it had been when new. It was something we agreed on and although our Bedford’s principle usage was as advertising it would have offered us no commercial advantage, just a tribute to Tom Liddle and his vehicles.
In the event when dad eventually got agreement that we could buy on examination he found engine, gearbox, dif and all the gauges etc. from the cab had been removed, and it was too much for us to restore.
This brings me to my thoughts on the painting of preserved vehicles. We did not own the two Bedfords we owned from new, and were never part of our 1930s fleet but we had no idea as to how they were painted from new, and we painted them authentically as they would have been painted had we operated them in 1930s and we had very similar vehicles in those days. Painting an iconic vehicle which anyone can remember in its day of use I think is wrong especially if the colours it was painted in never existed and was not appropriate for the period.
Here is a photo of Marsden’s stand at the Commercial Motor Show. Pity it was taken from this angle because the other vehicle on the stand was ours. In fact it was backed up to this one.
Like as always I never thought to take a camera and take a photograph of it. There must be one somewhere a at least Marsdens would have taken one. I live in hope that one day one might turn up. Perhaps someone on this site might have visited the show and taken one, and have it in thhe back of a drawer somewere.
Although we carried out removals from the nineteen twenties the first purpose built removal van we had was a Morris Commercial, which dad said was quite large particuarly with a tailboard load bought about 1937.
My grandfather had got to know Alfred Bell the newcastle removal contractors and they had told him about the van, saying that if they could extend their A licence they would have bought it. Bell’s told my grandfather that they had far more work than they could cope with and would have liked him to work in conjunction with them an offer he never took up, prefering to work independently.
Reading this account from 1930’s of how they operated I think he made the right choice
INTERESTING FEATURES OF TRUNK-SERVICE OPERATION. I N addition to its normal removing business, which extends throughout the British Isles, Alfred Bell (Newcastle), Ltd., runs a trunk service, both night and day, between Newcastle and London. As the majority of vehicles employed on this long-distance work is limited to 20 m.p.h., the company has opened a depot and drivers’ hostel at Tuxford, so that changes of drivers can be made in order to comply with the Road Traffic Acts. There is accommodation at this depot for some 80 men.
At the London terminus at 24, Friern Park, North Finchley, the company has extensive covered garage accommodation and a hostel, where’ it can sleep and feed approximately 40 drivers. Vdhicles of a number of other concerns are also serviced at this terminus.
The company’s fleet is made up of Albion, Garner and Bedford vehicles, although the latest vehicle to be added to the fleet is a Thornycroft, this having been purchased mainly because of its large carrying capacity. (1,500. cubic fit.). During the past year the trunk-service vehicles covered Over 800,000 miles.
The vehicles are serviced from the head depository at Higham Place, Newcastle, which has accommodation for 3,000 loads, and every vehicle, upon completion of a journey from Newcastle to London and back, passes through the, hands of the mechanics, who check over the reports handed in by the drivers. As each vehicle is in the hands of five drivers after leaving Neweaet e until its return from London and every driver is instructed to report on his log sheet any defeats or trouble that may arise, it is passible for the’ mechanicsto maintain the fleet in first-class condition and practically to ensure an absence of breakdowns
Press photos from The Northern Echo in 1973 at the opening of our new depot at Green Lane Industrial Estate Spennymoor
Long before the banning of smoking in workplaces, way back about 1974 here is a photo of some of our office staff, at their Christmas Office party.
I surpose things like that are banned today under Health & safety laws, but way back then on Christmas Eve, afternoon, most offices had staff had a booze up at work before off they went for Christmas. I wonder how may drivers, from time to time got a christmas gift! whilst giving them a lift home? There was always plenty of volunteers, who gave up their festivites in the drivers rest room to stay sober and drive their cars
Carl Williams:
Long before the banning of smoking in workplaces, way back about 1974 here is a photo of some of our office staff, at their Christmas Office party.I surpose things like that are banned today under Health & safety laws, but way back then on Christmas Eve, afternoon, most offices had staff had a booze up at work before off they went for Christmas. I wonder how may drivers, from time to time got a christmas gift! whilst giving them a lift home? There was always plenty of volunteers, who gave up their festivites in the drivers rest room to stay sober and drive their cars
With the help of Christine Henderson (Then Heale) centre striped top I think I might have identified the culprits, if ever they come on this site. In the front Ann Walton (Now Askwith) although she with Christine came to the reunion I couldn’t recognise because she had just had her hair cut short. Its strange, there I am now an ugly old man and they have never changed (How life is cruel to us poor males) christines right in black dress Pat McCabe other side in red Pauline Hood and at back Christine Ede.
To protect the innocent I must state that these beautiful young ladies would defend their honour with vigour against any advances taken by the dirty minded drivers that drove them home.
Christie Ede went on to become Christine Ball when she married Gordon an ex driver that often comes on this thread, and although ‘The evil cow’ (As us men see it) caused him much distress with their future divorce, she did give him two beautiful daughters . Ann Walton went on to marry Ian Askwith who together with his brother brian were both drivers with us over any years and are still married today.
Carl Williams:
Long before the banning of smoking in workplaces, way back about 1974 here is a photo of some of our office staff, at their Christmas Office party.I surpose things like that are banned today under Health & safety laws, but way back then on Christmas Eve, afternoon, most offices had staff had a booze up at work before off they went for Christmas. I wonder how may drivers, from time to time got a christmas gift! whilst giving them a lift home? There was always plenty of volunteers, who gave up their festivites in the drivers rest room to stay sober and drive their cars
How very dare you Carl Williams. That’s libel and I’m going to sue you. Chris
825christineh:
Carl Williams:
Long before the banning of smoking in workplaces, way back about 1974 here is a photo of some of our office staff, at their Christmas Office party.I surpose things like that are banned today under Health & safety laws, but way back then on Christmas Eve, afternoon, most offices had staff had a booze up at work before off they went for Christmas. I wonder how may drivers, from time to time got a christmas gift! whilst giving them a lift home? There was always plenty of volunteers, who gave up their festivites in the drivers rest room to stay sober and drive their cars
How very dare you Carl Williams. That’s libel and I’m going to sue you. Chris
Hi Christine,
After reading your comments I realise the error of my ways. It’s just my dirty mind that has developed of late, forgetting the pure innocent of all of our years during the seventies. Particularly after being reminded of an occasion when I gave Pat McCabe pictured in the photograph a lift to her home in st Andrew’s road Spennymoor, which I am sure was completely innocent
Carl
During the sixties and seventies we hired in a lot of van operators as sub contractors. One of these was Cracknell’s Darlington. See photo below.
Although I never personally met Mr Cracknell, he sounded quite old on the telephone and eventually sold out to Mark Robertson’s Haward and Robertson. Mark had employed Arthur Raine as assistant manager at H & R, and appointed him to run Cracknell’s which was run as an independent business, on the surface competing with H & R.
Arthur Raine in fact was chairman of the North East branch of the British Association of Removers, when I was appointed his deputy. Half term through his year of office he stood down when he emigrated to Australia. So I stood in as Chairman for the rest of his year’s term before being appointed as Chairman, in my own right.
From memory I remember Cracknell’s running both Seddon and Bedford TKs with luton bodies by Marsden, but never remember an integral like this one, and I suspect it was new to Haward and Robertson, before being painted in Cracknell livery.
Who knows someone who drove for Cracknell’s might read this and give me the answer
Taking of Cracknell’s we obviously competed with both them and H &R with removals, particularly Darlington and Newton Aycliffe area and I wonder how many people getting estimates from both, thinking they were getting competitive quotes realised that in effect they were the same business.
However we did take work at Tallent Engineering at Aycliffe that they were doing. We had worked for Tallents since they opened in Aycliffe, and when they started making Rolls twin Tub washing machine, not only did we get the job of delivering, but also the work of collecting components from different manufacturers including taking the spin tubs from Aycliffe through to Middlesbrough and back to Aycliffe after they had been galvanised.
We carried on delivering the remaining twin tubs after the Rolls washing machine companies’ demise, and then lost touch with them, for a while, as they concentrated making car parts. However no doubt we continued sending our yearly calendars, particularly to Vince Callan the Distribution Manager. One day Vince rang us to ask if we would be interested in quoting a price for taking a daily load of gas fires to Robinson Willey somewhere near Bradford, if my memory serves me right. Apparently Tallent were making the fires as subcontractors to Robinson Willey and Cracknells had been doing the work, and they had let them down once or twice, presumably through breakdowns. I think at the time they had BMC’s. With a small fleet of about 4 or 5 vehicles, it must have been difficult working with unreliable British Leyland vehicles.
We did this work for a number of years until the day we closed. Dunns of Shildon did the remainder of the transport to the likes of Ford of Dagenham, and it was the biggest part of their work. I remember each year Arnold Dunn would ask me what our price rise was to be for the following year and they would make theirs the same.
The internet is amazing I have just bought a photo of one of ours driven by my father from October 1948 off Ebay. It is in the post to me and I will be putting it on here with an incredible story and some information direct from the Commercial Motor that year thanks to their archives.
I only wish it had turned up about six years ago for my dad to see and give me his memories of the day the photo was taken.
Carl Williams:
Taking of Cracknell’s we obviously competed with both them and H &R with removals, particularly Darlington and Newton Aycliffe area and I wonder how many people getting estimates from both, thinking they were getting competitive quotes realised that in effect they were the same business.
However we did take work at Tallent Engineering at Aycliffe that they were doing. We had worked for Tallents since they opened in Aycliffe, and when they started making Rolls twin Tub washing machine, not only did we get the job of delivering, but also the work of collecting components from different manufacturers including taking the spin tubs from Aycliffe through to Middlesbrough and back to Aycliffe after they had been galvanised.
We carried on delivering the remaining twin tubs after the Rolls washing machine companies’ demise, and then lost touch with them, for a while, as they concentrated making car parts. However no doubt we continued sending our yearly calendars, particularly to Vince Callan the Distribution Manager. One day Vince rang us to ask if we would be interested in quoting a price for taking a daily load of gas fires to Robinson Willey somewhere near Bradford, if my memory serves me right. Apparently Tallent were making the fires as subcontractors to Robinson Willey and Cracknells had been doing the work, and they had let them down once or twice, presumably through breakdowns. I think at the time they had BMC’s. With a small fleet of about 4 or 5 vehicles, it must have been difficult working with unreliable British Leyland vehicles.
We did this work for a number of years until the day we closed. Dunns of Shildon did the remainder of the transport to the likes of Ford of Dagenham, and it was the biggest part of their work. I remember each year Arnold Dunn would ask me what our price rise was to be for the following year and they would make theirs the same.
hi carl,
just to comment on your mention of the rolls washing machine i believe the rolls name comes from rolls razor the company name owned by john bloom who also went on to buy out prestcold refridgeration in the sixties. My father now 92 came out of the pits to work as a salesman van driver for him in the early sixties doubling his pit wage. Known in the industry as direct selling, however it all went wrong when he began to offer a free fridge with every washing machine. John blooms moto was - its not a sin to make a profit- well he did that ok at the expense of his many creditors. Cork and Gully were selected to wind his company up which took many years .
ceetee.
ceetee:
Carl Williams:
Taking of Cracknell’s we obviously competed with both them and H &R with removals, particularly Darlington and Newton Aycliffe area and I wonder how many people getting estimates from both, thinking they were getting competitive quotes realised that in effect they were the same business.
However we did take work at Tallent Engineering at Aycliffe that they were doing. We had worked for Tallents since they opened in Aycliffe, and when they started making Rolls twin Tub washing machine, not only did we get the job of delivering, but also the work of collecting components from different manufacturers including taking the spin tubs from Aycliffe through to Middlesbrough and back to Aycliffe after they had been galvanised.
We carried on delivering the remaining twin tubs after the Rolls washing machine companies’ demise, and then lost touch with them, for a while, as they concentrated making car parts. However no doubt we continued sending our yearly calendars, particularly to Vince Callan the Distribution Manager. One day Vince rang us to ask if we would be interested in quoting a price for taking a daily load of gas fires to Robinson Willey somewhere near Bradford, if my memory serves me right. Apparently Tallent were making the fires as subcontractors to Robinson Willey and Cracknells had been doing the work, and they had let them down once or twice, presumably through breakdowns. I think at the time they had BMC’s. With a small fleet of about 4 or 5 vehicles, it must have been difficult working with unreliable British Leyland vehicles.
We did this work for a number of years until the day we closed. Dunns of Shildon did the remainder of the transport to the likes of Ford of Dagenham, and it was the biggest part of their work. I remember each year Arnold Dunn would ask me what our price rise was to be for the following year and they would make theirs the same.hi carl,
just to comment on your mention of the rolls washing machine i believe the rolls name comes from rolls razor the company name owned by john bloom who also went on to buy out prestcold refridgeration in the sixties. My father now 92 came out of the pits to work as a salesman van driver for him in the early sixties doubling his pit wage. Known in the industry as direct selling, however it all went wrong when he began to offer a free fridge with every washing machine. John blooms moto was - its not a sin to make a profit- well he did that ok at the expense of his many creditors. Cork and Gully were selected to wind his company up which took many years .
ceetee.
Hi Ceetee
You are right about John bloom and Rolls Razor Company, but although he was painted a villain in many ways this was unfair.
He brought down the price of Twin tub washing machines and made them affordable to the masses. Before he started the average machine was £150 with the market controlled by Hoover and Hotpoint who were raking in the profit. Bloom charged £39 for his cheapest machine and £59 for his deluxe one.
I always remember a Hoover rep telling dad that the motors were crap, were upon dad was able to tell him that Rolls used Hoover motors in the cheapest and Hotpoint in the better. A week later he had to apologise when he found this to be true.
Bloom rented cheap run down warehouses throughout the country, where he employed a manager at each. Self-employed salesmen were employed by these managers and the only requirement being that they had a van or estate car that could hold two machines. Giving them two machines they were sent off to the thousands of weekly enquiries from the huge adverts Bloom ran in the Sunday Newspapers, telling them to return with the money when they had sold them and get two more. More than often when our vans pulled up with loads little vans and estate cars were scattered everywhere as the salesmen waited for more machines, as they sold likes sweets.
Blooms methods were brilliant. Tallent Engineers Aycliffe made the machines and we delivered on their behalf. Once delivery was effected Tallents invoiced Rolls Razor who paid 28 days later, long after they had been paid cash by the eager buyers. Bloom had very little overheads with his biggest costs being double page weekly adverts in the like of the News of the World.
Tallents was at this time owned by a chap called Coulson who had designed the original Hoovermatic washing machine and in turn designed the Rolls. Like many we were very worried when Rolls Razor collapsed, but fortunately we were engaged and paid for by Tallent. But even then there was a time when it was thought that Tallent might also go down, and they owed us a fortune. But they pulled through.
Although, like you infer John Bloom was considered worse than the devil it wasn’t really his fault. He was destroying the businesses of Hoover and Hotpoint, both huge companies, as he took their market. At the same time, like you said he had taken over Prescold refrigeration, who had gone bankrupt, and was giving away their old stock, which he had got for a song, but had plans to produce a new range of household refrigerators which his had plans to introduce into his direct sales Rolls network. Finally Coulson was designing a new automatic washing machine, which would be light weight enough for one man to lift so his salesmen would soon be selling along with the twin tubs.
Both Hotpoint and Hoover were massive international companies and they got together and with help from the city set about destroying this upstart of a barrow boy. Bloom had no hope, and I can well understand the anger of your father, and his fellow salesmen who would have lost all the money they had due in commission. But had bloom succeeded, and trebled the size of his business this country would have gained much from his direct sales system.
Even in this internet age that would have been an ideal time for his direct selling idea, no one has ever taken up the mantle of John Bloom, and revolutionised the retail market
Carl
Built by Spurlings of Edgware London and exhibited on their stand at 1948 Commercial Motor show in our Cream/Brown livery, but unsignwitten. When dad arrived to see it at the stand it had a side door fitted on the near side, which he did not want. It had a second deck for sheep which fitted on the luton when not required and dad had tailboard and doors for the rear that could be substituted for the high cattle ramps so that it was suitable for muti-use as a van as well as livestock. Dad went down to Spurlings after the show and after they had removed the side door (Which he always said ‘Look as he might there was no evidence it ever was there).
Travelling up the A1 not far from London he was pulled in by two police officers, and when he asked them what was wrong they replied they just wanted to look at the van as it was so beautiful. When it was brought back to Spennymoor Professor Norton from Crook, who for many years had done all our sign writing, put W.H.Williams Removals & Haulage Spennymoor on the cab doors (white writing with black shading) and W.H.Williams Removals Spennymoor (Red writing with pale blue shading) on the two rear doors and tailboard that were used as alternative to cattle ramps.
Somewhere I have professional photos taken outside our garage at Marmaduke Street Spennymoor after it had been sign written. This photo must have been taken somewhere en route home from London, when he had stopped for a break. As no side doors, no sign writing
Wow Carl even the tyres had Goodyear highlighted very posh !