Whenever I asked Dad which was his favourite van he always said CDJ.
CDJ was our second petrol Bedford SB which was registered 1953 and bought second hand from Crosby Springs, who made springs for divan beds when it was two years old.
Although we had owned NUP from new CDJ had bodywork by Marsden of Warrington who built so many van bodies for us over the years.
Dad said CDJ was a lovely van to drive feeling small against NUP and HTH that felt numb.
Unfortunately I very much doubt I will ever have a photo of CDJ as we certainly never took any and as it was sold in 1963 it’s doubtful any will turn up. However on the internet I have located another Marsden SB of similar vintage which gives some idea of how it would have looked and underneath I show a photo of HTH which illustrates how it was painted.
The van shown which was owned by Bourne Bros is smaller, although I am sure was an SB Bedford. CDJ was higher with the centre panels on the side of the body being higher running level with the top of the cab and HTH had a 4ft 6in drop well which seems to have been cropped on Bourne’s.
As I said we sold CDJ in 1963 as it was replaced by 367MPT, and it was sold to Hunts Bros sale room at Darlington. This was before plating and testing and it was chosen for sale as it was by far the most well-worn of the SBs and needed a major chassis overhaul.
After about three years dad was talking to one of Hunts who were saying what a great van it was as they never had spent a penny on it and it had been no trouble. When we had it the track rod ends and kingpins were in very poor condition and dad wondered how the wheels were staying on.
Hunts kept CDJ for about 5 years until they sold the removal side of their business to Mark Robertson of Hayward and Robertson Darlington, and he scrapped CDJ.
Carl
This morning i met another ex driver Harry Wilkinson who lives in Ferryhill & have told him about the site so hopefully he will join in the chat & maybe some stories.He retired aged 53 years as his wife had a stroke aged 48 years.
Eddie i hope the hospital gets you sorted it’s not good keeping you waiting.
Gordon.
Carl Williams:
Whenever I asked Dad which was his favourite van he always said CDJ.
CDJ was our second petrol Bedford SB which was registered 1953 and bought second hand from Crosby Springs, who made springs for divan beds when it was two years old.
Although we had owned NUP from new CDJ had bodywork by Marsden of Warrington who built so many van bodies for us over the years.
Dad said CDJ was a lovely van to drive feeling small against NUP and HTH that felt numb.
Unfortunately I very much doubt I will ever have a photo of CDJ as we certainly never took any and as it was sold in 1963 it’s doubtful any will turn up. However on the internet I have located another Marsden SB of similar vintage which gives some idea of how it would have looked and underneath I show a photo of HTH which illustrates how it was painted.
The van shown which was owned by Bourne Bros is smaller, although I am sure was an SB Bedford. CDJ was higher with the centre panels on the side of the body being higher running level with the top of the cab and HTH had a 4ft 6in drop well which seems to have been cropped on Bourne’s.
As I said we sold CDJ in 1963 as it was replaced by 367MPT, and it was sold to Hunts Bros sale room at Darlington. This was before plating and testing and it was chosen for sale as it was by far the most well-worn of the SBs and needed a major chassis overhaul.
After about three years dad was talking to one of Hunts who were saying what a great van it was as they never had spent a penny on it and it had been no trouble. When we had it the track rod ends and kingpins were in very poor condition and dad wondered how the wheels were staying on.
Hunts kept CDJ for about 5 years until they sold the removal side of their business to Mark Robertson of Hayward and Robertson Darlington, and he scrapped CDJ.
Carl…Would this photo be more like the van your on about it as a longer dropwell.
Eddie
edworth:
Carl…Would this photo be more like the van your on about it as a longer dropwell.
Eddie
Hi Eddie
Yes thats more like
Carl
goggietara:
Carl
This morning i met another ex driver Harry Wilkinson who lives in Ferryhill & have told him about the site so hopefully he will join in the chat & maybe some stories.He retired aged 53 years as his wife had a stroke aged 48 years.
Eddie i hope the hospital gets you sorted it’s not good keeping you waiting.
Gordon.
Carl Williams:
Whenever I asked Dad which was his favourite van he always said CDJ.
CDJ was our second petrol Bedford SB which was registered 1953 and bought second hand from Crosby Springs, who made springs for divan beds when it was two years old.
Although we had owned NUP from new CDJ had bodywork by Marsden of Warrington who built so many van bodies for us over the years.
Dad said CDJ was a lovely van to drive feeling small against NUP and HTH that felt numb.
Unfortunately I very much doubt I will ever have a photo of CDJ as we certainly never took any and as it was sold in 1963 it’s doubtful any will turn up. However on the internet I have located another Marsden SB of similar vintage which gives some idea of how it would have looked and underneath I show a photo of HTH which illustrates how it was painted.
The van shown which was owned by Bourne Bros is smaller, although I am sure was an SB Bedford. CDJ was higher with the centre panels on the side of the body being higher running level with the top of the cab and HTH had a 4ft 6in drop well which seems to have been cropped on Bourne’s.
As I said we sold CDJ in 1963 as it was replaced by 367MPT, and it was sold to Hunts Bros sale room at Darlington. This was before plating and testing and it was chosen for sale as it was by far the most well-worn of the SBs and needed a major chassis overhaul.
After about three years dad was talking to one of Hunts who were saying what a great van it was as they never had spent a penny on it and it had been no trouble. When we had it the track rod ends and kingpins were in very poor condition and dad wondered how the wheels were staying on.
Hunts kept CDJ for about 5 years until they sold the removal side of their business to Mark Robertson of Hayward and Robertson Darlington, and he scrapped CDJ.
Hi Gordon,
Keep up the good work telling people about the site.
I hope Harry joins and adds some memories. That’s what makes things interesting
Carl
Our first ever artic was a 1946 Bedford O model with an van trailer bought second hand from a removal company, Wards of Harrogate about 1949.
The trailer was older than the tractor, most probably pre-war and in those days there was no 5th wheel coupling and it was bolted onto the tractor unit. To detach the trailer four bolts had to be undone.
The trailer was made by a company called Eagle, and the major fault was it had no brakes, so the driver was relying on the tractor unit’s brakes (Which on the old O series would be suspect at least) and also relying on the trailer keeping straight.
Although in those days it was legally limited to 20 mph, and there was not so much traffic on the road, dad said it was not unknown to reach 40 travelling down to Bristol with a ten ton load on, if no police were about. So driving must have kept your nerves on end.
Dad told the story of how he went to the Commercial motor Show to look for the Eagle stand to enquire about fitting brakes to the trailer. Asking someone if they could direct him to the stand he looked up and there was a large Eagle.
The cost of fitting brakes was prohibitive so that when he sold the artic it still had no brakes.
Here are a couple of Eagle brochures I found on the internet.
Carl Williams:
Our first ever artic was a 1946 Bedford O model with an van trailer bought second hand from a removal company, Wards of Harrogate about 1949.
The trailer was older than the tractor, most probably pre-war and in those days there was no 5th wheel coupling and it was bolted onto the tractor unit. To detach the trailer four bolts had to be undone.
The trailer was made by a company called Eagle, and the major fault was it had no brakes, so the driver was relying on the tractor unit’s brakes (Which on the old O series would be suspect at least) and also relying on the trailer keeping straight.
Although in those days it was legally limited to 20 mph, and there was not so much traffic on the road, dad said it was not unknown to reach 40 travelling down to Bristol with a ten ton load on, if no police were about. So driving must have kept your nerves on end.
Dad told the story of how he went to the Commercial motor Show to look for the Eagle stand to enquire about fitting brakes to the trailer. Asking someone if they could direct him to the stand he looked up and there was a large Eagle.
The cost of fitting brakes was prohibitive so that when he sold the artic it still had no brakes.
Here are a couple of Eagle brochures I found on the internet.
I have managed to make the Eagle brochure bigger
I wonder how Eddie Stobart drivers who complain on the ‘Fairy Tale’ TV series, driving their Scannia sleeper cabs, with cab heaters, cruise control etc. would like to make a 600+ return journey with a primitive Bedford O Model, without trailer brakes, speed limit 20MPH (no Motorways), and probably achieving the same efficiency as they do today, would cope.
I think travelling with drivers in those days in 40’s and 50’s would have created a really interesting television series with the problems that they would encounter.
One thing those drivers wouldn’t be able to listen to their built in radios, not just because they didn’t have them, but because they would be too interested in listening to the engine note in case anything went wrong. And if they had problems they were on their own and would have to sort things out.
Dad always told the story of one night he was returning from Stockton with Bedford O Model artic, followed by two of the old tonner Bedfords (Pre War) when on going through the bridge at Metal Bridge (Near Ferryhill) found the road ahead of them solid frozen ice.
He said the artic was dreadful in ice, to say the best, but on this occasion it wouldn’t move on its journey up the bank towards Thinford.
He says that he and the other drivers emptied all the bins from the houses near Metal Bridge onto the road. (In those days with coal fires people put the ashes into the bins) and still just got a few yards and he said the three of them got their shovels out of the cabs and almost had to dig their way up to Thinford.
Incidentally he also told the story of in the early days of the Thinford Roundabout on the A167 then the A1 a wagon (I don’t know who’s) had turned over loaded with nails, and for months after it was not uncommon to pick one up in the tyres and end with a puncture.
It’s time like this I wish I had taken more notice when I was young and my Grandfather told me of his early years. In fact I wish I had written down what he said with the reg no’s and description of the vehicles.
Strangely amongst his various work my great Grandfather was a professional photographer and sent my grandfather when he was in his early teens to stay in Newcastle to study colour photography, which was in its infancy. Yet we still have no photos of the vehicles.
I know my Grandfather’s first vehicle was a 1920 Ford T Model 1 tonner and believe the reg no was J9629. It had been built in America, was left hand drive and had solid wheels. It came cab less and the cab with half doors and no windows and body was built by Herbert Raine, the founder of H.Raine and Sons the Spennymoor Coachbuilders.
It must have been scrapped because when I was very young they still had the log book, until my dad, amongst so many things threw it out.
Found this brochue on Ford Model T 1 ton truck 1920
I have managed to find a photo of 1920 Ford Model T 1 ton truck.
Tis is American, but so was my Grandfather’s and it seems to have solid tyres
My Grandfather’s cab was built by Herbert Raine of Spennymoor, but overall it will not have been too much different.
Where is everyone? Never heard from Gordon or Colin, Eddie how are you? Have you heard from James Cook Hospital yet?
Peter, You promised to post some photos. You even haven’ posted a photo of your Foden . Give us an exclusive on this thread before it’s seen elsewhere, and let us know how you are progressing with your Bedford.
Here is a quiz
In my memory we had two Bedford pantechnicons which were never painted and lettered.
Both were bought second hand many years apart.
Both ran about 2 to 3 years.
Both painted just one coat I suspect.
Plain cream no lettering or name at all.
Does anyone know the answer?
Come on Peter this should test even your memory.
Hi Carl
I am still here still trying to find photos i said i would. I will put the photos of our foden and bedford on asap sorry for the delay The Bedford has had one side reframed after 65 years it wasnt too bad but I decided to repair it before it got any worse. Very good workmanship by Marsdens when they built it.I can remember both bedfords wwith no signwriting on but cant remember the regs numbers at the moment but it will come back to me when i get my brain into gear. Eddie how are you? please get in touch.
Peter
pbsummers:
Hi Carl
I am still here still trying to find photos i said i would. I will put the photos of our foden and bedford on asap sorry for the delay The Bedford has had one side reframed after 65 years it wasnt too bad but I decided to repair it before it got any worse. Very good workmanship by Marsdens when they built it.I can remember both bedfords wwith no signwriting on but cant remember the regs numbers at the moment but it will come back to me when i get my brain into gear. Eddie how are you? please get in touch.
Peter
Hi Peter,
As you say the workmanship of Marsden was excellent, and they had a knack of building to the minimum specification that was possible, which made them much cheaper than other bodybuilders, but as your van is evidence they built adequately to last.
In 1946 Sherwood and Wynn built the body for dad and granddad on GPT and it was built like a battleship as was all the other work they did for them including the artic, but they were dreadfully expensive (and looking at their work you could see why), and when dad took CDJ to show Noble what he wanted he said ‘That buggar will drop to pieces’ but it certainly didn’t. Sherwood’s were a relic from the past and Marsden were so advanced for their time.
Another problem you never will come up with is leaking roof, we never did with their work. In pre fibreglass days I remember dad always on with NUP and TPT in particular trying to stop them raining in. I remember him painting the top of NUP with Bitumastic (a type of tar.)
In fairness Sherwood and Wynn or Spurlings never rained in but neither did Marsden who were charging about half as much for their bodies.
I remember sitting in the cab of the old Bedford 15cwt(KMM) that had been built by Locomotors at Uxbridge, and seeing every bit of the cab was screwed together with countersunk screws covered so that they hardly showed. Where they thought they might need loosening from time to time brass screws were put in with brass washers. Even in the forties and fifties they took so much pride in their work and it’s wonderful that something built, like your Bedford 65 years ago look like they will last for posterity.
Carl
My Grandfather told of a new Morris commercial Z type he bought in 1926, saying it was so much trouble that it had to go back to the factory in Birmingham, and the engine completely stripped and rebuilt at only two or three months old.
It was his first non-Ford Model T, and I think he bought it as it was bigger than the 1 ton model Ts. Dad said that every year he had bought a new vehicle meaning that in those days in the early twenties he never had a vehicle over 3 years old. However I suppose the designs were advancing so rapidly in those early years.
I remember dad said the Z type ran for a long time in grey, and was christened the grey ghost. My grandmother took dad for a few weeks holiday to her sister’s in St Albans and when they came back my grandfather collected them from Durham Station in the Z type and had painted it blue. (No cream and brown in those days as the Ford Model Ts had all been black.
I think the z type was the first vehicle he had a cattle truck conversion to the drop sided body. The drop sides were quite high with a big chock rail round the top and an open top cattle truck style body that dropped on top of the chock rail. It could then be used as a cattle truck, drop sided, or platform (With the drop sides). When I was born I remember, vaguely three Bedford 2 tonners were still running well into the fifties with this multifunctioning set up.
The Morris Commercial was a total disaster, being very unreliable, and was soon replaced by his first Chev 2 tonner. A sign of the problems to face British Leyland about 40 years on. Yet he soon bought another Morris Commercial and it seems when I look back that we always seemed to have had one, at least in the fleet.
I have looked for a long time and have found a photo of a Morris commercial Z type, dating back to 1926, which should give some indication of what it might have looked like.
Thank you for letting me put pic of Foden on your thread Carl. Originally owned by William Beardmore and Sons of Glasgow who sold it to Jimmy Irvin, a showman in Glasgow from whom we purchased it in 1981 as a chassis cab. We drove it back from Glasgow and after a few months started to strip it down. Up until he died suddenly in 1991 dad helped Barry and I to refurbish many parts. It was then decided to use a professional vehicle restorer (big mistake) to finish the vehicle. He did do some work on it but was taking him a long time. We then found out that he was working on another vehicle at the opposite end of the country whilst he was saying that he was working on ours so we asked for the vehicle to be returned. On inspection we were very disappointed at the fitment of the windscreens and doors. On us fitting the windscreens we found the appertures were 2" too big and the door appertures were 2 1/2" too big. This left us very disheartened and felt we couldn’t do anything for years. It wasn’t until 2008 I decided that we would have to do something and worked out where the previous coach builder had gone wrong and most of the cab was stripped down, rebuilt and re-pannelled by ourselves. The engine only needed a service (oil and filters)and all the brakes were overhauled. The chassis was shotblasted and repainted. Lots of other work was done but I don’t want to bore you. We asked Steve Sugden from Merrington to do the paintwork and Gardiners of Spennymoor built the body. It was then painted and signwritten in memory of our dad.
It’s a Foden FG6/12, S18 cab, powered by a Gardner 6LW through a 4 speed gearbox and a single drive axle. It has only done 37500 miles from new.
Take care everyone Peter
pbsummers:
Thank you for letting me put pic of Foden on your thread Carl. Originally owned by William Beardmore and Sons of Glasgow who sold it to Jimmy Irvin, a showman in Glasgow from whom we purchased it in 1981 as a chassis cab. We drove it back from Glasgow and after a few months started to strip it down. Up until he died suddenly in 1991 dad helped Barry and I to refurbish many parts. It was then decided to use a professional vehicle restorer (big mistake) to finish the vehicle. He did do some work on it but was taking him a long time. We then found out that he was working on another vehicle at the opposite end of the country whilst he was saying that he was working on ours so we asked for the vehicle to be returned. On inspection we were very disappointed at the fitment of the windscreens and doors. On us fitting the windscreens we found the appertures were 2" too big and the door appertures were 2 1/2" too big. This left us very disheartened and felt we couldn’t do anything for years. It wasn’t until 2008 I decided that we would have to do something and worked out where the previous coach builder had gone wrong and most of the cab was stripped down, rebuilt and re-pannelled by ourselves. The engine only needed a service (oil and filters)and all the brakes were overhauled. The chassis was shotblasted and repainted. Lots of other work was done but I don’t want to bore you. We asked Steve Sugden from Merrington to do the paintwork and Gardiners of Spennymoor built the body. It was then painted and signwritten in memory of our dad.
It’s a Foden FG6/12, S18 cab, powered by a Gardner 6LW through a 4 speed gearbox and a single drive axle. It has only done 37500 miles from new.
Take care everyone Peter
Hi Peter,
The Foden certainly looks beautiful, probably as good as the day it was put on the road, new. You must be very proud of your efforts and results.
When I bought ENK706 in about 1974 I had my grandfather with me and it took about 6 years to get it on the road and many times I regretted buying it. Like you did we orriginally approached Royle from Staindrop and I remember him quoting £10,000 to bring it back to new condition. (He was used to doing old Rolls Royces not goods vehicles). Originally I thought it could have been done in our workshops, but we never had time, and then we took it to a training school for vehicle mechanics at Darlington that we had shares in who proposed to adapt it as a project but they kept it for months and did nothing. Can you remember seeing it when we brought it back? It was in a worse state than it had been when we originally brought it back from the field where we found it.
So although my personal mechanical abilities are non-existent, I can understand the pressure and worry you would go through getting the components etc., and then on top of that you had the additional problem of finding time and doing the work.
It must have been about the time you got the Foden that dad and I located one of Tom Liddle’s old ERFs. As we were trying to locate the owner, we talked about the renovation. Looking at it it looked in very good condition, with only a coat of grey paint over the original maroon. We thought we would have just have minor cosmetic work and a repaint, plus minor mechanical repairs. We decided if we got it, it would be wrong to paint it in WHW colours, and decided to repaint it in Tom’s livery as a tribute to him. However when dad went to arrange to buy it he found the engine, gearbox and dif were gone, and we decided it was too much work.
Credit to you Peter for a wonderful piece of workmanship
Carl
Hi Carl ~Thank you for your comments on our Foden. Yes it was hard work and difficult with lots of parts missing (lost by restorer) but, being an engineer (brain surgeon to you Eddie), I manufactured lots of lost parts myself. I have to admit we are pleased with the finished result.
You previously mentioned KMM, the 15cwt Bedford CA. I can remember it very well but the only time I can remember going out in it was with your grandad. It was in December and you used to deliver Christmas post (mainly parcels) for the Post Office in Spennymoor. All I can remember is that the postmen loaded up the van in order of deliveries and the list was given to your grandad. He proceeded to drive round the route with me getting in and out of the van to deliver to each house whilst he sat in the driving seat. I think I was only 9-10 years old at the time. I don’t think it would be allowed in these days. But those days were happy days.
Peter
Hope all previous contributers are well. Long time no hear.
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