44 Tonne Ton:
What is it that you guys don’t get about flashing in being bad practise? If you give a flash, and I used to, the [zb] invariably give you a close up of their back door rather than driving on a bit further and leaving me some braking distance. So for a while I tried something different and waited until I had some braking room in front of me before flashing them in. That was when I stopped giving a flash because 95% of the [zb] didn’t wait for it and proceeded to show me the “if you can’t see my mirrors then I can’t see you” sticker!
Anybody who regards encouraging tailgating as some sort of courtesy thing is putting lives at risk and should think about handing their licence in. I can’t believe on a PROFESSIONAL drivers forum there’s blokes defending this dangerous habit.
Like you say, you flash/flashed someone in when YOU thought it was safe for them to return to the lane in front of you, which would be at least a lorry length past you, not much wrong with that, but you’re right again, for some reason people can’t wait for that, they have to pull in as soon as there’s the slightest gap and fill your screen with their backdoors, during my spell on the road over there at the beginning of the year, I never bothered, or more correctly, never got the chance to flash people in, before I’d even thought about it they were in already, I have to tell you it scared the life out of me, I felt really vunerable, I tried slowing down a bit and then I got the dirty looks as people came past, because I dared to get in their way
Carryfast, you’re missing the point mate, it isn’t slow speeds that cause bunching, it isn’t limiters either, it’s the drivers, they don’t have to sit 3ft off the back of the lorry in front
44 Tonne Ton:
What is it that you guys don’t get about flashing in being bad practise? If you give a flash, and I used to, the [zb] invariably give you a close up of their back door rather than driving on a bit further and leaving me some braking distance. So for a while I tried something different and waited until I had some braking room in front of me before flashing them in. That was when I stopped giving a flash because 95% of the [zb] didn’t wait for it and proceeded to show me the “if you can’t see my mirrors then I can’t see you” sticker!
Anybody who regards encouraging tailgating as some sort of courtesy thing is putting lives at risk and should think about handing their licence in. I can’t believe on a PROFESSIONAL drivers forum there’s blokes defending this dangerous habit.
Like you say, you flash/flashed someone in when YOU thought it was safe for them to return to the lane in front of you, which would be at least a lorry length past you, not much wrong with that, but you’re right again, for some reason people can’t wait for that, they have to pull in as soon as there’s the slightest gap and fill your screen with their backdoors, during my spell on the road over there at the beginning of the year, I never bothered, or more correctly, never got the chance to flash people in, before I’d even thought about it they were in already, I have to tell you it scared the life out of me, I felt really vunerable, I tried slowing down a bit and then I got the dirty looks as people came past, because I dared to get in their way
Carryfast, you’re missing the point mate, it isn’t slow speeds that cause bunching, it isn’t limiters either, it’s the drivers, they don’t have to sit 3ft off the back of the lorry in front
So logicically he’ll have to back off to keep his seperation distance or try to overtake at whatever zb speed differential the limiter calibrations on the two trucks will allow.If he backs off then the one behind him has to back off even more to protect his seperation distance and so it continues all down the line until some idiot ploughs into the last truck,which has been ground down to 60 kmh or less,at 90 kmh .At least try and sell it to those yanks first. .
there must be some really cushy jobs out there if this debate is everyones biggest concern just now
yes i do flash other drivers in. partly out of courtesy as others have already mentioned but mainly to let them know that i am happy with the clearance they have allowed which is completely different to letting them know that they are past me
just out of interest. those that are against it. do you flash vehicles out from the left ie joining the carriageway, changing lane etc? the message you are conveying is exactly the same either way. yes, i have seen you and i am happy for you to carry out your manoeuvre. you cant be for one and against the other
scanny77:
there must be some really cushy jobs out there if this debate is everyones biggest concern just now
yes i do flash other drivers in. partly out of courtesy as others have already mentioned but mainly to let them know that i am happy with the clearance they have allowed which is completely different to letting them know that they are past me
just out of interest. those that are against it. do you flash vehicles out from the left ie joining the carriageway, changing lane etc? the message you are conveying is exactly the same either way. yes, i have seen you and i am happy for you to carry out your manoeuvre. you cant be for one and against the other
In most cases,unless you’re able to change lanes,you would’nt flash someone out unless the speed differential is low enough and seperation distance is high enough to let them in without compromising the seperation distance between you and them when they come out in front.So the answer is probably the opposite to your question in that it’s safer to flash something in which is travelling at a relatively higher speed than to flash something out which is travelling at a relatively lower speed.
each circumstance is different. sometimes they are joining faster than you, sometimes slower, sometimes you can move over, or not etc etc etc but the common factor is that they are joining ahead of you and you are in a better position to assess the situation than they are, especially if they are joining a carriageway since you are already on it and aware of the traffic flow. the message is always the same though. “i am happy for you to carry on” which is not the same as giving some indication of the length of someones vehicle. the perspective is completely different
i still dont see what the big deal is and why people are getting so worked up about it. while this practice is technically illegal, the fact is that it is socially acceptable and universally recognised throughout the road network and its users. even if every member here ceased to do it, other motorists wouldnt so bickering here is not going to achieve anything
scanny77:
there must be some really cushy jobs out there if this debate is everyones biggest concern just now
yes i do flash other drivers in. partly out of courtesy as others have already mentioned but mainly to let them know that i am happy with the clearance they have allowed which is completely different to letting them know that they are past me
just out of interest. those that are against it. do you flash vehicles out from the left ie joining the carriageway, changing lane etc? the message you are conveying is exactly the same either way. yes, i have seen you and i am happy for you to carry out your manoeuvre. you cant be for one and against the other
In most cases,unless you’re able to change lanes,you would’nt flash someone out unless the speed differential is low enough and seperation distance is high enough to let them in without compromising the seperation distance between you and them when they come out in front.So the answer is probably the opposite to your question in that it’s safer to flash something in which is travelling at a relatively higher speed than to flash something out which is travelling at a relatively lower speed.
The post that Carryfast has answered is part of the problem, flashing vehicles out to join the carriageway could be classed as inviting someone into a danger zone, to me you should stick to driving your own vehicle properly and stop being the worlds policeman, so what if the bloke is driving .3 over the speed limit, let him past, he wont affect you then, if you cannot safely overtake back off, relax and get there less stressed.
I have mentioned many times that I rarely flash anyone back in, as the space they want to invade is still my space. I will decide when to flash and many modern drivers are already back in my lane, inches from my bumper before I am ready for that.
New mercman mentioned that people should be able to drive with limiters as they came in during the 90s. Well norman Lewis ran with them much earlier than that and my 1984 MAN 22.321 had a top speed limiter set at 85kmh. We were busy and didn’t mess about, but Normans motors were seen all over Europe for many years, the speed limit was 80kmh with ADR and in most of Europe that was it for general too
scanny77:
there must be some really cushy jobs out there if this debate is everyones biggest concern just now
You must have a really cushy number then Scanny
by scanny77 » Tue Sep 28, 2010 5:27 pm
yes i do flash other drivers in. partly out of courtesy as others have already mentioned but mainly to let them know that i am happy with the clearance they have allowed which is completely different to letting them know that they are past me
just out of interest. those that are against it. do you flash vehicles out from the left ie joining the carriageway, changing lane etc? the message you are conveying is exactly the same either way. yes, i have seen you and i am happy for you to carry out your manoeuvre. you cant be for one and against the other
by scanny77 » Tue Sep 28, 2010 6:50 pm
each circumstance is different. sometimes they are joining faster than you, sometimes slower, sometimes you can move over, or not etc etc etc but the common factor is that they are joining ahead of you and you are in a better position to assess the situation than they are, especially if they are joining a carriageway since you are already on it and aware of the traffic flow. the message is always the same though. “i am happy for you to carry on” which is not the same as giving some indication of the length of someones vehicle. the perspective is completely different
i still dont see what the big deal is and why people are getting so worked up about it. while this practice is technically illegal, the fact is that it is socially acceptable and universally recognised throughout the road network and its users. even if every member here ceased to do it, other motorists wouldnt so bickering here is not going to achieve anything
scanny77:
there must be some really cushy jobs out there if this debate is everyones biggest concern just now
yes i do flash other drivers in. partly out of courtesy as others have already mentioned but mainly to let them know that i am happy with the clearance they have allowed which is completely different to letting them know that they are past me
just out of interest. those that are against it. do you flash vehicles out from the left ie joining the carriageway, changing lane etc? the message you are conveying is exactly the same either way. yes, i have seen you and i am happy for you to carry out your manoeuvre. you cant be for one and against the other
Don’t come on here teaching your granny tae ■■■■ eggs! The ink is still wet on your brief! It is NOT the same situation at all. If I have a truck, (and only a truck not cars, vans, bikes or anything else) trying to join from a slip road I assess the situation. If I think I can help him join the main road safely that is what I will do. I will move over if there is room to my right to allow the truck to slot in SAFELY. Alternatively, I will back off to allow space for him to move into the space in front of me. In both cases I will flash to let him know I have seen him and will accomodate him. That is courtesy and commonsense in my opinion. You say you flash others in to let them know you’re happy with the clearance you have. In my experience the vast majority do not leave sufficient clearance which leads me to question your judgement but don’t fret about it petal you’re in the MAJORITY!
scanny77:
there must be some really cushy jobs out there if this debate is everyones biggest concern just now
yes i do flash other drivers in. partly out of courtesy as others have already mentioned but mainly to let them know that i am happy with the clearance they have allowed which is completely different to letting them know that they are past me
just out of interest. those that are against it. do you flash vehicles out from the left ie joining the carriageway, changing lane etc? the message you are conveying is exactly the same either way. yes, i have seen you and i am happy for you to carry out your manoeuvre. you cant be for one and against the other
In most cases,unless you’re able to change lanes,you would’nt flash someone out unless the speed differential is low enough and seperation distance is high enough to let them in without compromising the seperation distance between you and them when they come out in front.So the answer is probably the opposite to your question in that it’s safer to flash something in which is travelling at a relatively higher speed than to flash something out which is travelling at a relatively lower speed.
The post that Carryfast has answered is part of the problem, flashing vehicles out to join the carriageway could be classed as inviting someone into a danger zone, to me you should stick to driving your own vehicle properly and stop being the worlds policeman, so what if the bloke is driving .3 over the speed limit, let him past, he wont affect you then, if you cannot safely overtake back off, relax and get there less stressed.
I have mentioned many times that I rarely flash anyone back in, as the space they want to invade is still my space. I will decide when to flash and many modern drivers are already back in my lane, inches from my bumper before I am ready for that.
New mercman mentioned that people should be able to drive with limiters as they came in during the 90s. Well norman Lewis ran with them much earlier than that and my 1984 MAN 22.321 had a top speed limiter set at 85kmh. We were busy and didn’t mess about, but Normans motors were seen all over Europe for many years, the speed limit was 80kmh with ADR and in most of Europe that was it for general too
Which is why all over Europe we’re finding out that the logical conclusion to excessively low speed restrictions and limiters means truck overtaking bans just like on miles of German motorways.So when they’ve successfully managed to sell the idea of running at 50 mph to the yanks newmercman will be able to relax even more and get there even less stressed than he does at present running at 64 mph.
i dont drive any truck at the moment as im in the process of getting my class 2 but as long as ive had my licence and have been driving wether it was a car or van i have always flashed trucks in, with all the [zb] most lorry drivers have to put up with on a day to day basis i just consider it the least i can do…
mark41:
i dont drive any truck at the moment as im in the process of getting my class 2 but as long as ive had my licence and have been driving wether it was a car or van i have always flashed trucks in, with all the [zb] most lorry drivers have to put up with on a day to day basis i just consider it the least i can do…
Jeez, smell the coffee! I DON’T NEED ANYBODY TO FLASH ME IN AND I WON’T BE FLASHING YOU IN WHEN YOU JOIN US ON HEAVIES!
mark41:
i dont drive any truck at the moment as im in the process of getting my class 2 but as long as ive had my licence and have been driving wether it was a car or van i have always flashed trucks in, with all the [zb] most lorry drivers have to put up with on a day to day basis i just consider it the least i can do…
If you’re driving a car or van why are you driving the zb thing so slowly that a truck needs to go to all the aggro of overtaking you.
mark41:
i dont drive any truck at the moment as im in the process of getting my class 2 but as long as ive had my licence and have been driving wether it was a car or van i have always flashed trucks in, with all the [zb] most lorry drivers have to put up with on a day to day basis i just consider it the least i can do…
Fair Play mate, better than most car/van drivers who speed up when we’ve got half way past, and come to that some of our fellow truckers who realise they aren’t on the limiter till you’ve got cab to cab and then they sit nose to nose with you for miles.
mark41:
i dont drive any truck at the moment as im in the process of getting my class 2 but as long as ive had my licence and have been driving wether it was a car or van i have always flashed trucks in, with all the [zb] most lorry drivers have to put up with on a day to day basis i just consider it the least i can do…
If you’re driving a car or van why are you driving the zb thing so slowly that a truck needs to go to all the aggro of overtaking you.
its not so much as overtaking me its more me letting them in(joining motorways,middle lane when they r overtaking another lorry,out of side roads etc… ) instead of acting like most smaller vehicle drivers and ignoring what the truck is doing or cutting you up…
@44 tonne ton…thats ok i understand you probably got burnt before and now you dont want to play nice…
mark41:
i dont drive any truck at the moment as im in the process of getting my class 2 but as long as ive had my licence and have been driving wether it was a car or van i have always flashed trucks in, with all the [zb] most lorry drivers have to put up with on a day to day basis i just consider it the least i can do…
If you’re driving a car or van why are you driving the zb thing so slowly that a truck needs to go to all the aggro of overtaking you.
its not so much as overtaking me its more me letting them in(joining motorways,middle lane when they r overtaking another lorry,out of side roads etc… ) instead of acting like most smaller vehicle drivers and ignoring what the truck is doing or cutting you up…
That means you’re flashing them out not flashing them in. But cars etc should try to get in lane 3 and gone long before the truck needs to pull out anyway in the case of motorways unless it’s only 2 lanes in which case if you flash them out you’ll end up lumbered either behind the one/s overtaking until it’s/they’ve got by or bottled up in lane 1 behind the one entering from the entry slip,which would’nt have been such an issue in the days before limiters because the speed differentials between cars etc and trucks were’nt so great,which is one of the points I’ve been trying to make and it’s probably one of the reasons why most light traffic,understandably,does’nt like to co operate with trucks.
I flash people (trucks) out of slip roads if they’re close to me, I also flash people in who overtake me. Some people flash me in when I overtake them, some don’t. I don’t fret over it either way, one thing I will say though is if you haven’t flashed me in and at some point further along the road due to a hill or something else you find yourself creeping past me then don’t expect any help from me, be it a flash in or me backing off because you’ve run out of steam.
Someone posted on another thread that they do the “half and half” method in as much as if someone gets halfway passed and then struggles they will then back off. I too do this if need be, puts maybe .5 of a second on my day and saves raised blood pressures all around. I also back off if I’m catching an obviously heavy truck at the top of a hill purely 'cos I can’t be bothered to spend the next 5 miles in a futile side by side race.
The one thing that irritates me no end though is when I’ve passed someone on the flat or uphill and on the next downhill bit he sits behind me until we’ve nearly reached the flat part before he pulls out and lets gravity do it’s stuff, I then feel kind of obliged to back off to let him pass. Maybe I should just say “stuff him” and keep it pinned. Most people seem to anyway.
BTW, none of the above applies if you drive for Elldis. If you do, then you’ll get no help from me under any circumstances.
It seems that many people have forgotten that in the UK we drive on the left and give way to traffic from the right, give way signs are on the slip roads.
Wheel Nut:
It seems that many people have forgotten that in the UK we drive on the left and give way to traffic from the right, give way signs are on the slip roads.
But there’s nothing wrong with a flash and moving over,if lane 2 is clear,before an entry slip to help traffic to merge easier.
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