kernan_d:
Correct me if I’m wrong but once your driving time is up regardless of spread that’s you finished? So our Supertrucker gets to within 30 minutes of yard, ring the other half, she I presume pops in her card and continues the journey to the yard while Supertrucker drives the car back to the yard (place of work) all on TV.
All perfectly legal - he can go where he wants in his own car once his hours are up- it would have been an issue if it had been a company vehicle.
My issue is they used two trailers that were unsuitable for the job, a neck-two-bed-four with a 4 axle unit is way overkill for a 46 tonne crusher, and the navy boat on a 4 axle low loader when it would have sat far better on a stepframe.
nick2008:
Not only that .
Driving with a defective trailer knowingly that it’s leaking hydrologic fluid that operates the suspension that can significantly alter the characteristics of the handling if the vehicle and stability of the load.
Like I said
COWBOYS
Not a fan of this programme but hydraulics have a reservoir, if its only a small leak and theres plenty still left in reserve theres no harm done driving it back to the yard and most likely will saves hours stuck by the roadside waiting for a repair that isnt needed immediately…
nick2008:
Not only that .
Driving with a defective trailer knowingly that it’s leaking hydrologic fluid that operates the suspension that can significantly alter the characteristics of the handling if the vehicle and stability of the load.
Like I said
COWBOYS
Not a fan of this programme but hydraulics have a reservoir, if its only a small leak and theres plenty still left in reserve theres no harm done driving it back to the yard and most likely will saves hours stuck by the roadside waiting for a repair that isnt needed immediately…
Doing well if you know it’s going to last the journey,most leaks start small,could easily of popped the hose completely,wishful thinking,it’ll be right,school of thought sooner or later bites you,
kernan_d:
Correct me if I’m wrong but once your driving time is up regardless of spread that’s you finished? So our Supertrucker gets to within 30 minutes of yard, ring the other half, she I presume pops in her card and continues the journey to the yard while Supertrucker drives the car back to the yard (place of work) all on TV.
All perfectly legal - he can go where he wants in his own car once his hours are up- it would have been an issue if it had been a company vehicle.
I don’t think that quite correct, any traveling time that isn’t to or from your regular place of work is counted as Duty Time and should be recorded.
Travelling time Where a vehicle coming within the scope of the EU rules is neither at the driver’s home nor at the employer’s operational centre where the driver is normally based, but is at a separate location, time spent travelling to or from that location to take charge of the vehicle may not be counted as a rest or break, unless the driver is in a ferry or train and has access to a bunk or couchette.
The precedence was set in the case against Skills Motor Coaches Ltd and some of their drivers.
Although it might set up for the telly to show that his missus can also drive a truck.
He wasn’t travelling to take charge of the vehicle
His wife however should have booked the time travelling to collect the vehicle, wether she did or not is unknown
I’m pretty sure they said you can drive 10 hours a day so dozy when you go to court say your a supertrucker and the telly says you can drive 10 hours a day
kernan_d:
Correct me if I’m wrong but once your driving time is up regardless of spread that’s you finished? So our Supertrucker gets to within 30 minutes of yard, ring the other half, she I presume pops in her card and continues the journey to the yard while Supertrucker drives the car back to the yard (place of work) all on TV.
No that’s not correct, when your driving time is up you can still work as long as you’ve got some available working time left, what you cannot do is drive a vehicle that’s in-scope of EU regulations.
Driving the car back to base/home would be other work, so as long as he can get back before he needs to start a daily rest period it would be legal.
He wasn’t travelling to take charge of the vehicle
Travelling time
Where a vehicle coming within the scope of the EU rules is neither at the driver’s home nor at the employer’s operational centre where the driver is normally based, but is at a separate location, time spent travelling to or from that location to take charge of the vehicle may not be counted as a rest or break, unless the driver is in a ferry or train and has access to a bunk or couchette.
While I agree the regs to say take charge, they also say to or from the location the vehicle has been left.
Driving the car back to base/home would be other work,
Would it? , I have yet to see anything that says once booked off and free to dispose of your time as you see fit, that there is any restriction as to where you can drive your own car too or from… I stand to be corrected - but in this case he booked off work away from base and got into his private car and went home via his wifes place of work to collect her - the Skills Coaches precedence doesn’t apply as he wasn’t travelling in a company vehicle or to take charge of a vehicle
He wasn’t travelling to take charge of the vehicle
Travelling time
Where a vehicle coming within the scope of the EU rules is neither at the driver’s home nor at the employer’s operational centre where the driver is normally based, but is at a separate location, time spent travelling to or from that location to take charge of the vehicle may not be counted as a rest or break, unless the driver is in a ferry or train and has access to a bunk or couchette.
While I agree the regs to say take charge, they also say to or from the location the vehicle has been left.
which means if the vehicle was moved while he was on daily rest and he was still at the original location then any travelling he did to collect the vehicle would be in scope. or when if he travelled back in the morning from home to where he parked it away from base that time would also be in scope.
But going home from where he was in his own car is perfectly legal, In the morning the truck was at its operating centre so he doesn’t need to record the time going to the yard from his home
Driving the car back to base/home would be other work,
Would it? , I have yet to see anything that says once booked off and free to dispose of your time as you see fit, that there is any restriction as to where you can drive your own car too or from… I stand to be corrected - but in this case he booked off work away from base and got into his private car and went home via his wifes place of work to collect her - the Skills Coaches precedence doesn’t apply as he wasn’t travelling in a company vehicle or to take charge of a vehicle
The fact that he wasn’t driving a company vehicle makes not one iota of difference, from memory the drivers in the Skills Coaches case was not travelling in a company vehicle they were left to make their own way to and from the vehicles they were driving.
To make it legal for him to drive home without booking the travelling time as other work he would have to return to the place he gave up charge of the vehicle and restart the journey back to base/home after his daily rest period was completed.
Any time spent travelling to a location to take charge of a
vehicle falling within the scope of this Regulation, or to return
from that location, when the vehicle is neither at the driver’s
home nor at the employer’s operational centre where the
driver is normally based, shall not be counted as a rest or
break unless the driver is on a ferry or train and has access to a
bunk or couchette
Skills Motor Coaches Ltd operates passenger coaches from Nottingham and employed Messrs Farmer, Burley and Denman as drivers. The Vehicle Inspectorate contended that periods of time spent by Farmer and Burley in driving by car from their home or the coach depot to the point where they took over a coach should have been recorded manually on the coach’s tachograph sheets. Similarly Denman, who on one occasion had done driving work which qualified as a regular national service falling outside the scope of the tachograph regulations before taking over a ‘tachograph’ coach should have recorded that earlier period of driving work on the tachograph sheets for that vehicle.
It was contended by the company and drivers that a driver who travelled from his home to the pick-up point for a vehicle could freely choose how he travelled so that time thus spent must be regarded as being freely disposed and forming part of a rest period. The court rejected that argument and held that time spent on activities having a bearing on driving, such as time spent reaching the pick-up point for a tachograph vehicle, would affect his state of tiredness and must be regarded as forming part of ‘all other periods of work’ within Article 15 of Regulation No. 3821/85.
The important bit of the legislation is the “Taking over a vehicle” - in this case he wasn’t travelling to take over a vehicle
To make it legal for him to drive home without booking the travelling time as other work he would have to return to the place he gave up charge of the vehicle and restart the journey back to base/home after his daily rest period was completed.
That’s a new one on me, so your saying that in the morning he would have to get in his private car- drive 30 minutes in the opposite direction to the yard , to a place where his truck no longer is, as it has quite legally been moved by another driver, then book on as in scope and then drive back past his house to the yard where the truck now is?
Please show me where that is written, because I have never seen it,
Edit: To make clear… he is fully legal to drive home in his private car that night, if the truck hasn’t been moved and is still away from base then when he travels back in the morning that time does come into scope,
Rikki-UK:
The important bit of the legislation is the “Taking over a vehicle” - in this case he wasn’t travelling to take over a vehicle
It doesn’t matter whether the driver is travelling to take charge of the vehicle or travelling from a location where he was in charge of the vehicle it cannot be counted as rest.
any time spent by a driver travelling to or from a location, which is not the driver’s home or
the employer’s operational centre and where the driver is supposed to take over or to leave a
vehicle in the scope of the Regulation, regardless of whether the employer gave instructions
as to when and how to travel or whether that choice was left to the driver, should be recorded
as either ‘availability’ or ‘other work’ depending on the Member State’s national legislation;
and
any time spent by a driver driving a vehicle, which is out of scope of the Regulation, to or
from a location, which is not the driver’s home or the employer’s operational centre and
where a driver is supposed to take over or to leave a vehicle which falls within the scope
of the Regulation should be recorded as ‘other work’
Skills Motor Coaches Ltd operates passenger coaches from Nottingham and employed Messrs Farmer, Burley and Denman as drivers. The Vehicle Inspectorate contended that periods of time spent by Farmer and Burley in driving by car from their home or the coach depot to the point where they took over a coach should have been recorded manually on the coach’s tachograph sheets. Similarly Denman, who on one occasion had done driving work which qualified as a regular national service falling outside the scope of the tachograph regulations before taking over a ‘tachograph’ coach should have recorded that earlier period of driving work on the tachograph sheets for that vehicle.
It was contended by the company and drivers that a driver who travelled from his home to the pick-up point for a vehicle could freely choose how he travelled so that time thus spent must be regarded as being freely disposed and forming part of a rest period. The court rejected that argument and held that time spent on activities having a bearing on driving, such as time spent reaching the pick-up point for a tachograph vehicle, would affect his state of tiredness and must be regarded as forming part of ‘all other periods of work’ within Article 15 of Regulation No. 3821/85.
The important bit of the legislation is the “Taking over a vehicle” - in this case he wasn’t travelling to take over a vehicle
So are you saying the 2001 court case take precedence over the 2006 EU driver hours regulations?
To make it legal for him to drive home without booking the travelling time as other work he would have to return to the place he gave up charge of the vehicle and restart the journey back to base/home after his daily rest period was completed.
That’s a new one on me, so your saying that in the morning he would have to get in his private car- drive 30 minutes in the opposite direction to the yard , to a place where his truck no longer is, as it has quite legally been moved by another driver, then book on as in scope and then drive back past his house to the yard where the truck now is?
Please show me where that is written, because I have never seen it,
It’s not written but the fact that travelling time cannot be counted as rest is written (see my previous post).
By going back to the location where the driver left the vehicle he could reasonably argue that he travelled home and back in his own time.
I’m only saying that this is the only legal way to do it, I’m not saying most drivers would do this
travelling to or from a location, which is not the driver’s home
which is not the driver’s home
he went home in his private car- sorry in both paragraphs its clear he is perfectly entitled to do that.
Neither the regulations nor the EU guidance note make any mention of the mode of travel, they both make it clear that time spent travelling to or from a vehicle that’s in-scope of EU regulations and is not at the drivers home or usual base cannot be counted as rest.
The Skills Coaches case also made it clear that a drivers time travelling to or from a vehicle that’s in-scope of EU regulations cannot be counted as rest.
Rikki-UK:
The important bit of the legislation is the “Taking over a vehicle” - in this case he wasn’t travelling to take over a vehicle
It doesn’t matter whether the driver is travelling to take charge of the vehicle or travelling from a location where he was in charge of the vehicle it cannot be counted as rest.
any time spent by a driver travelling to or from a location, which is not the driver’s home or
the employer’s operational centre and where the driver is supposed to take over or to leave a
vehicle in the scope of the Regulation, regardless of whether the employer gave instructions
as to when and how to travel or whether that choice was left to the driver, should be recorded
as either ‘availability’ or ‘other work’ depending on the Member State’s national legislation;
and
any time spent by a driver driving a vehicle, which is out of scope of the Regulation, to or
from a location, which is not the driver’s home or the employer’s operational centre and
where a driver is supposed to take over or to leave a vehicle which falls within the scope
of the Regulation should be recorded as ‘other work’
But the driver was traveling to his home, so no need to record other work or availability. Grey area if he stopped for a swift half, but if he went straight home, the regulations allow for that
