lmao spardo 
paul b:
don’t you think denis (dennis,denise?) driving em down the road a fifty mph would frighten em enough?
it regularly frightens the [zb] out of the grockles I meet on single track loads
Cattleman:
lmao spardo
What?? 
Salut, David.
jd_123:
paul b:
so it’s not the fact that theres hundreds of wagons coming over every week to do uk work with huge fuel tanks full of fuel bought at a fraction of the cost of uk fuel thats the problem, it’s down to the fact that joe bloggs haulage didn’t buy a hungarian haulage firm ten years ago?According to a dft survey regarding foreign trucks.
Average distance travelled per round trip within GB is 640 kilometres. Over two thirds (68%) is on motorways.
Most drivers spend only a short period of time in GB, on average less than 2 days, with a sixth (16%) returning on the same day and four fifths (83%) spending less than 3 days in GB.
Around 20 per cent of foreign registered HGVs entering GB made at least one trip to GB per week, accounting for three-fifths (62%) of all trips.
A large majority (90%) of trips are made by EU-based operators and by drivers resident in the EU.
I’m sure there’s another survey from them stating that domestic freight transported by GB mainland trucks rose during 2004. From these figures, it appears that the vast majority of foreign trucks are tipping a load/reloading and straight home again. Nothing to do with cabotage. I’m not saying cabotage does’nt happen, but its on a far smaller scale than some people like to think.
Even if what you say about cabotage is true this still affects our share of the market for international work.
The results of another report carried out by the DFT make interseting reading when you bear in mind there only around 420,000 registered HGV’s in this country.
Department for Transport:
Road Goods Vehicles Travelling to Mainland Europe
Quarter 2 2005The total number of UK registered vehicles travelling to mainland Europe increased by 5% to 130,800.
The total number of foreign registered vehicles rose by 5% to 377,000
From the 10 accension states
Poland has 31% (up 36% in the last year)
the Czech republic
Hungary
Slovakia account for 25% (up 87% since quarter 2 2004)
So we have a vehicle park of 420,000 & in the first half of the year there has been 377,000 foreign vehicles in this country
So no competion there then (especially when you deduct all the fuel run motors & household removal jobs that went over “the water”)
Statistics, ■■■■ lies and all that 
You can prove everything you want with a survey
Wheel Nut:
Statistics, ■■■■ lies and all thatYou can prove everything you want with a survey
It’s not a “survey” it’s figures given by the crossing operators to the DFT
paul b:
something i’ve noticed in the last few weeks is how many foreign registered 7.5 tonners they have been on the roads, makes you wonder.
They are used beacuse they are exempt from the various Saturday, Sunday and Public Holiday restrictions across Europe, which there are many more of during the summer months. It is why you see more of them at this time of year because they can keep going when the big uns are parked up. They are mostly carrying express stuff or garments and they tend to be in and back out again.
No conspiracy theory, just good operational sense. 
north surrey haulage:
Even if what you say about cabotage is true this still affects our share of the market for international work.
True, but that has nothing to do with fuel prices. UK trucks are using the same juice. Their advantage is cheaper wages. Perhaps some form of tax/road toll for foreign trucks would work but that will take the muppets several years just to draw the proposal up. Look what happened the LRUC.
Its time they just dropped the fuel prices for now and give GB hauliers a bit of slack. How much are you paying now, nearly £1.00 including V.A.T.? I think my boss is paying approx 70p-75p which includes V.A.T. at 21%.
sorry spardo - was laughing at the bathroom scales comment!
Coffeeholic:
paul b:
dennis, totally off subject, but how do you know what weight you’ve got on when carrying livestock?Maybe, if the beasts were a bit heavy, giving them a fright could make them lose weight quickly. Messy but effective.
Just show em the STUN GUN! 
Spardo:
jd_123:
[. Then you have the ‘return load’ culture. Firms refusing to come home empty so they will haul 20 tonnes for peanuts.Not disagreeing with anything you wrote JD but I can’t remember a time in the last 40 years that this specific complaint wasn’t being voiced. I used to puzzle over it then and the only thing I can think of is that rates to customers haven’t been undercut, it’s just the rate that the prime haulier passes on to the backloader - obviously he has to make a profit. Thus hauliers are not neccessarily being undercut on their own home traffic.
Of course if backloaders were regularly targetting customers directly, that would make a difference, but that doesn’t seem to be the case. The big backloaders set up in their customers’ areas and thus maintain viable rates.
If this wasn’t the case the whole job would have collapsed completely years ago.
Salut, David.
Whats a backload ■■? Surely its a load regardless. It has a point of origin and a point of destination so therefore its a load!! So these people who offer crap rates cos its a “backload” want excorcising out of the industry.
Passed a Texaco garae this morning near Whitchurch, 99.9 p per litre for Diesel!!! 
If your using nrly 1000 ltrs a week ( which if you are generating 3000kms per week and are averaging 3 kms per Litre or 8.25 miles to a gallon) then I think many hauliers will fold, especially thos who subcontract to larger hauliers and do not have customers of their own to pass the costs on. Unless they are very good and give you an increase!
I cant see how anyone can survive when they are only pulling in average £1700 (good week), more likely £1500! 2/3rds of that would have gone on fuelSo its looking very grim indeed.
If anyone is doing it different then lets share it with the group
@WheelNut, be interested to see the rates form 20 years ago!!
Fuel in Ireland has increased alot too, I was getting it for 58 pence plus VAT 3 YRS AGO!!
Those ‘hundreds of wagons’ are not all foreign, you know!!! Although we are a Dutch registered company, we are basically British… and woe betide us if we came back into the UK without filling our 1500 litre tanks to the neck!! That would last me a week until I went out again. In fgact, it was well known on our firm that unless they were desperate, if you had full tanks, you had no chance of shipping out till you was down to at least a quarter!!
So Your firm, is it based in Holland ? or do you have a depot here in the UK ? Who do you work for ? Is any UK fuel bought here ?
routier:
Spardo:
jd_123:
[. Then you have the ‘return load’ culture. Firms refusing to come home empty so they will haul 20 tonnes for peanuts.@WheelNut, be interested to see the rates form 20 years ago!!
Fuel in Ireland has increased alot too, I was getting it for 58 pence plus VAT 3 YRS AGO!!
In no particular order.
Hull to Slough £380, weekend rate £440
Erith to Hull £10.50 per tonne
Hull to Wrexham £385 (special rate)
Hull to Liverpool £240
Liverpool to Hull £220 back load rate
Glasgow to Manchester £9 per tonne
Hull to Grimsby, £80 bridges paid
Local collections around Hull, £30 per load
Newtonards to Leeds £18 per tonne.
Container rates were £0.82 per mile traction only, paid on AA milage plus 7% and no trailer hire,
All these rates are random
Hull to Slough £380
Ive just picked one, the above from 20 years ago when fuel and the rest of the operating costs both fixed and variable were a lot lot lower!! Now you would be lucky to get that going from North Wales to Northern France (£360) you pay the ferries, off the Coolload website 2 years ago! Probably worse now!
We need to do something, really we do because the rates are on a continual decline whilst everything else goes up! 
Dread to see where the UK haulage industry is in the next 5 years.
I’ve just run Hull to Slough through Auto route and it comes out at 217 miles,
for that I would be paid £240
Unless of course that £380 is for the round trip, then it would be £480 
Tramper:
for that I would be paid £240
Unless of course that £380 is for the round trip, then it would be £480
Are you direct or subby ?
Well thats CRAP! These are rates from 20 years ago!!! when fuel was around the 30 pence barrier! Vehicles were not costing £70,000 and now we paying more to earn less, 20 yrs ago we were paying less to earn more!!!
If your truck does 3 km /ltr then you would spend £110 on fuel which is more than a third! If you employed a driver then theres nrly £200 gone so how dya pay for your insurance/truck/repairs/tax liabilities/ etc etc on whats left ■■? And Imagine if yer had a blow ourt /broke down!!!
Those figures posted earlier on for cabotage , I wonder if they are true! I think a lot of people may go bust esp at those rates!
Tramper:
for that I would be paid £240
Unless of course that £380 is for the round trip, then it would be £480
217 miles - £380 ! thats £1.75 a mile 
it must be a price for the round trip !!
( and for 217 miles I’d be looking for £260 )
so basically everyone was earning an absolute mint twenty years ago because of caorse the cost living was a lot lower then as well, strange how all those that were making all that money are now working for eight quid an hour!
i think somethings a miss 
paul b:
so basically everyone was earning an absolute mint twenty years ago because of caorse the cost living was a lot lower then as well, strange how all those that were making all that money are now working for eight quid an hour!
i think somethings a miss
The company I pulled for were taken over Paul, they cut the rates to a minimum and employed their own drivers through Lex Transfleet, since then the boss has died and the new owner is being investigated as stated in Commercial Motor a couple of months ago. He has since been banned from being a director of any company for 10 years and owes many thousands of pounds to people like you, and me
My unit and trailer cost £70,000 in 1986
So all you quid-per-mile owner driver’s 
…
Considering the current fuel prices, are you still going to be recommending that new wannabe owner driver’s should start up and give it a go even though many of you have admitted - in a round about way - that the cost of diesel is killing you off ?
I’m just wondering who’s seen the light, as it was only 2 months back that most of you were recommending to topcat, wharty and richiessex that it was the way forward . Bad advice imho .