The driving instructor only made one valid point about false sense of security. Other than that, he’s just a tadger. 
Anyway, you can stick your ABS, 4 airbags and 4 stars NCAP up yer hole. 
I’ll have nae ABS, nae airbags, nae NCAP stars. (well ABS can mean longer stopping distances on fresh snow / loose surfaces / gravel and the other two are only useful if you crash.
But I have these on again for the winter:
DSCF4623.JPG by macplaxton, on Flickr
macplaxton:
I’ll have nae ABS, nae airbags, nae NCAP stars.
sounds like my preference but i got a huge amount of grief from a lot of people for wanting to disable the drivers airbag when i swap the steering wheel. on my previous 2 cars the ABS locked up on a wet road so i wound up cadence braking anyway, because of the ABS which was not showing any faults 
as for the NCAP rating, its a modified car so that is out the window anyway
macplaxton:
The driving instructor only made one valid point about false sense of security. Other than that, he’s just a tadger.Anyway, you can stick your ABS, 4 airbags and 4 stars NCAP up yer hole.
I’ll have nae ABS, nae airbags, nae NCAP stars. (well ABS can mean longer stopping distances on fresh snow / loose surfaces / gravel and the other two are only useful if you crash.
But I have these on again for the winter:
DSCF4623.JPG by macplaxton, on Flickr
Vredestein is very good brand for Winter and all season ones. I have Quatrac four season ones 
And as for my car being safe, I will be safer when your Snowtrac’s will give you too much of false sense of security, LOL
ajt:
Whats the difference between a summer tyre and a ‘normal’ tyre?
First the thread is different - deeper and designed to work in a way that the gaps change its size, therefore the bits of ice would not stuck in your gaps, but they will be crushed and removed.
Second: the rubber is different. Altough 7 degree is a set norm and it’s not always exactly 7 degree, the typical summer tires are getting hard and less elastic in lower temperatures. And the tire has to be elastic to give you grip, otherwise you can just fit plastic rings instead of rubber tires…
merc0447:
I’ve never had trouble on summer tyres in the snow
yet for some reason it’s illegal to drive on summer tyres in winter in many countries.
orys:
muckles:
Washwipe:
Winter tyres are just not for snow, we run with winter tyres on the vans we run from November through to March, the grip on wet roads compared to standard tyres is immense, standard tyres do not operate so well at low temps but winter ones are a different compound making them supple below 7 degrees, it’s just not about having traction to drive, you need to stop also, being able to stop even a foot sooner can mean you live another day.This is the point people don’t seem to get, they are for the colder temperatures of winter not just snow. But I would say the instructor might have a point about fitting them giving a false sense of confidence, which will actually defeat the point of having them if you still don’t allow for the conditions because you think your tyres will get you out of trouble. It’s the same reason I see more 4x4s buried in hedges than 2wd cars when it snows.
That’s true. But if we follow that logic, then maybe we all start drive Reliant Robins, then we all become very careful drivers to avoid rolling it over…
Thank you, I will rather drive my car with all season tires, four wheels, ABS, 4 airbags and 4 stars NCAP.
Actually Ory’s I wasn’t really suggesting that we should all drive through the winter in a reliant robin on bald tyres, just making a point about what the instructor said and my observations of what happens when people are stupid enough to believe the advertising hype.
To be honest there is no helping people with that sort if mind set, so you probably are better off with your tyres and NCAP rating. To keep you safe not from your own foolishness, but to avoid or to give you some protection from the over confident idiots when they run out of talent.
muckles:
Actually Ory’s I wasn’t really suggesting that we should all drive through the winter in a reliant robin on bald tyres, just making a point about what the instructor said and my observations of what happens when people are stupid enough to believe the advertising hype.To be honest there is no helping people with that sort if mind set, so you probably are better off with your tyres and NCAP rating. To keep you safe not from your own foolishness, but to avoid or to give you some protection from the over confident idiots when they run out of talent.
I know YOU didn’t, I just played around with dragging this way of thinking to the point of absurd. On that level you are, we agree perfectly.
I fitted the winter tyres to my bmw a few weeks ago when they warned of snow.
Only to the back mind… Not paid enough for 4 tyres, so as long as I can go and stop, I’ll manage the turn 
I have General Grabber AT tyres on mine. Think they are made for summer and winter use.
The “Driving Instructors” advice about fitting seasonal tyres is very valid with respect to driving to the road conditions at present.
His comment about it being “Political”… I would guess is in reference to Road gritting which has… over the years been reduced dramatically for “Financial” reasons.
Saving on road salt you see. The knobs. It’s causing more disruption on the roads than the white stuff and ice should.
Road grit only works down to temperatures of -10C. Gritting is a wholly pointless activity after this point.
exactly, I did a 500km trip from hallsberg, sweden to helsinki on monday and tuesday. it was -15 to -20 and as I was in a hurry, 130kph was the speed usually with no gritting anywhere, as it would be hazardous at those temperatures.
Solly:
@orysThe “Driving Instructors” advice about fitting seasonal tyres is very valid with respect to driving to the road conditions at present.
It was MINE advice to fit seasonal tires. The “driving instructor” claims that summer are better
milodon:
exactly, I did a 500km trip from hallsberg, sweden to helsinki on monday and tuesday. it was -15 to -20 and as I was in a hurry, 130kph was the speed usually with no gritting anywhere, as it would be hazardous at those temperatures.
Yes, exactly. You have nicely beaten snow, then you grit it during the day to melt it and then when temperature lowers, where you used to have nice snow, which is pleasure to drive, you have ice.
Bulgarian TIR driver, who caused traffic chaos in Serbia, may be fined more than BGN 13,000
11 December 2012 | 11:31 | FOCUS News Agency
Home / Southeast Europe and Balkans
Belgrade. Bulgarian heavy-freight TIR truck driver, who a couple of days ago overturned on the Subotica-Belgrade motorway and caused an 11-kilometres traffic jam for more than 20 hours, was driving with summer tyres, reports Serbian Kurir daily, citing anonymous sources from the Serbian Interior Ministry.
According to the newspaper, if the expert’s analysis proves that the truck was with summer tyres, the driver may be fined up to MKD 800,000 (or more than BGN 13,000).
“If it is proved that the truck was with summer tyres the driver will have to pay a fine under the Road Safety Act. What is known for sure at the moment is that the vehicle was driving at a speed that was not suitable for the road conditions and overturned while trying to go round a snow-cleaning vehicle,” newspaper’s sources said.
Bulgarian TIR driver, who caused traffic chaos in Serbia, may be fined more than BGN 13,000. focus-fen.net/index.php?id=n294481
milodon:
exactly, I did a 500km trip from hallsberg, sweden to helsinki on monday and tuesday. it was -15 to -20 and as I was in a hurry, 130kph was the speed usually with no gritting anywhere, as it would be hazardous at those temperatures.
I have been in a similar position. One morning last winter it was around -15 where I live in the Highlands and I was driving to work the O/H was going ballistic at me for doing 50-60 mph whilst it was frosty so I showed her an emergency stop on a dry road at -15 (would have put her through the windscreen if she did not have her seatbelt on). Salt is usless below -7, infact as other people have said it actuall becomes a nusance.
billybigrig:
Bulgarian TIR driver, who caused traffic chaos in Serbia, may be fined more than BGN 13,000
11 December 2012 | 11:31 | FOCUS News Agency
Home / Southeast Europe and Balkans
Belgrade. Bulgarian heavy-freight TIR truck driver, who a couple of days ago overturned on the Subotica-Belgrade motorway and caused an 11-kilometres traffic jam for more than 20 hours, was driving with summer tyres, reports Serbian Kurir daily, citing anonymous sources from the Serbian Interior Ministry.
According to the newspaper, if the expert’s analysis proves that the truck was with summer tyres, the driver may be fined up to MKD 800,000 (or more than BGN 13,000).
“If it is proved that the truck was with summer tyres the driver will have to pay a fine under the Road Safety Act. What is known for sure at the moment is that the vehicle was driving at a speed that was not suitable for the road conditions and overturned while trying to go round a snow-cleaning vehicle,” newspaper’s sources said.Bulgarian TIR driver, who caused traffic chaos in Serbia, may be fined more than BGN 13,000. focus-fen.net/index.php?id=n294481
Good they are having to pay over the world for not using winter tires
This is a Lithuanian guy with summer tires having to pay a fine of 20 000nok = £2200 according to google. and are not allowed to move the truck before he have winter tires…
adressa.no/nyheter/sortronde … 806193.ece
I’m so happy they are finally starting to do something with people that use the wrong equipment when it’s winter. The fine a bit to small if you ask me but maybe it feels a bit in the pocket
And here is Finnish law enforcement at work. As you can see Finnish Police also using tractors running solo
Hi all.Icee.I just read that report.He was also obliged to buy sets of chains.RESULT,maybe they will slowly start to learn[or not come up here in the winter].
Orys.For your information the snowscooter police provide a valuable service.They police snowscooter drivers,help the people in outlying villages who maybe snowed in and help the forest rangers and farmers with the animals.
Also they monitor hunters and fishermen.
He may be running solo but i bet he has no problem getting traction.
hutpik:
Hi all.Icee.I just read that report.He was also obliged to buy sets of chains.RESULT,maybe they will slowly start to learn[or not come up here in the winter].
Orys.For your information the snowscooter police provide a valuable service.They police snowscooter drivers,help the people in outlying villages who maybe snowed in and help the forest rangers and farmers with the animals.
Also they monitor hunters and fishermen.
He may be running solo but i bet he has no problem getting traction.
I know, I know. We also have snow scooters in Poland (or quads) that do the same job.
I was refering to the reindeer. Usually you see Reindeers (at least here) pulling the sledges full of presents, and this one runs solo and has Police livery… And I thought that it might be Finnish - winter equivalent of this:
