tonyhogi:
All these excuses that it wont be flexible to work is always from the greedy operator & like anything they’d have to work round any changes if it happens
And that same flexibility suits the driver too, especially when he can extend his working day by 3 hours and get home on the wife’s birthday or to watch football, the kids party or just to see his boyfriend.
If it isn’t broke don’t try to fix it.
I personally think the recognised 15 hour day needs looking at as even the 13 hours is more than any other industry anyway. I can’t cope with 9 hours rest either…10 is my minimum because by the time I’ve relaxed, chilled and eaten I need a good sleep. Only my personal preference though.
I think we work far too many physical hours on duty which over a 5 day week can be 72 hours 
that can’t be right surely 
At almost EVERY delivery point we go to ask the staff there the hours for their shift and the maximum will be 12 hours!! Some drivers want all the hours etc but 72 every week (which is legal) cannot be safe. I have a good planner and my average is 60 - 65max. at least 10 rest every night which as a tramper is just enough, for me anyway.
As coffee stated with his simplified rules - easy to understand and all legal but should/do we REALLY have to put up with the long hours■■?
Rick B:
I personally think the recognised 15 hour day needs looking at as even the 13 hours is more than any other industry anyway. I can’t cope with 9 hours rest either…10 is my minimum because by the time I’ve relaxed, chilled and eaten I need a good sleep. Only my personal preference though.I think we work far too many physical hours on duty which over a 5 day week can be 72 hours
At almost EVERY delivery point we go to ask the staff there the hours for their shift and the maximum will be 12 hours!! Some drivers want all the hours etc but 72 every week (which is legal) cannot be safe. I have a good planner and my average is 60 - 65max. at least 10 rest every night which as a tramper is just enough, for me anyway.
As coffee stated with his simplified rules - easy to understand and all legal but should/do we REALLY have to put up with the long hours■■?
Forget thinking of it as the 15 hour day and 13 hour days. Think about what you actually work, not sit in a waiting room or in the passenger seat while tipping.
For instance the rep selling fire extinguishers leaves home at 6 am to get to his first appointment at 9 and leaves his last client at 6 pm and then drives back home for 2 hours. He didn’t sell much today and is paid on commission
The bloke working on the building site opposite me, on his feet from 07.30 until 16.30 carrying bricks and climbing scaffolding in the rain and cold. He gets 15mins mugga at 10am and 30mins lunch.
The schoolteacher who gets up at 6.30 to get herself and the kids ready for school, drops them off and then has to sit in front of unruly kids all day, then collect her own kids do tea and mark homework.
To me, the last three jobs are hard work, our job is spent alone sat on our arse listening to the radio for 9 hours a day
Rick B:
I personally think the recognised 15 hour day needs looking at as even the 13 hours is more than any other industry anyway. I can’t cope with 9 hours rest either…10 is my minimum because by the time I’ve relaxed, chilled and eaten I need a good sleep.
These are the two main problems with the current regulations in my opinion too. I personally would like to see the minimum rest being increased to 10 hours and the maximum working day reduced to 13 hours, which is still five hours more than sane people work.
I would refer anyone complaining that this would reduce their pay to the Law of Supply and Demand 
Wheel Nut:
tonyhogi:
All these excuses that it wont be flexible to work is always from the greedy operator & like anything they’d have to work round any changes if it happensAnd that same flexibility suits the driver too, especially when he can extend his working day by 3 hours and get home on the wife’s birthday or to watch football, the kids party or just to see his boyfriend.
If it isn’t broke don’t try to fix it.
in the real world most transport companies wont give a [zb] about your wifes birthday they will want you to use the extra 3 hours to do another delivery 
if it aint broke then why are so many people leaving this industry 
TOO many unsociable hours is one of the main reasons & the fact that alot of drivers are complete muppets is another 
Hours regs to apply for the week not the fortnight.
MAX 12 hours per day, any combination of other work/driving.
1 hour break must be had after 6hrs30mins duty latest.
Minimum 24hr weekly rest.
Leave WTD out of it.
The above to apply to day drivers starting after 0400.
Night drivers starting after 1800.
MAX 11 hours per night any combination of other work/driving.
2 hour break after on duty 6hrs30mins latest can be taken as 2 * 1 hour breaks.
Trailer must be dropped for loading if driver on break.
Minimum 48 hours weekly rest.
One of the problems I encounter these days is that I don’t always get a full week in as an agency driver. Last week I didn’t have work for Tuesday and Thursday. To make a day up I can often grab a Saturday then Sunday off back to work Monday. The following week if that was repeated I can’t work the Saturday to make up my week even though I am perfectly capable and fit for work as I now need 2 days off somewhere. That’s why I’ve suggested a 24 for day drivers. I do think night drivers benefit from a 48 though having had 20 years on nights.
Harry Monk:
These are the two main problems with the current regulations in my opinion too. I personally would like to see the minimum rest being increased to 10 hours
Maybe they should actually make that popular drivers myth a reality, the one were they say it is illegal to take a 9 hour rest at home.
Ten or 11 hours is often too long when you are away and want to get home but 9 is often too short for a lot of drivers when at home by the time they take travelling time out of the 9 hours. So maybe one change could be reduced daily rest only when away from base.
The downside to that would be you might not make it home as often because you would only be able to do 13 hours max as opposed to 15, thereby resulting in more nights out.
Kerbdog:
Would anyone else like to see tachograph rules simplified to set hours and breaks a day. There would still have to be a fortnight rule so you couldn’t drive 6 days every week.
No not really the rules a the moment are quite good, with a certain amount of flexibility that fits most applications but let’s see what the thead throws up!!!
What continues to amaze me is the amount of drivers who don’t know the rules. This is why we need the driver cpc.
I notice a lot of the suggestions have the driver working a long time before requiring a break, 5 hours, 6.5 hours and that could all be driving time under these suggestions. Now if the company want the max out the driver, as some have suggested, that’s going to lead to a lot more tired and unsafe drivers sharing the road with the rest of us. Not sure I’m too keen on that idea.
Most of the suggestions have shorter working days which can only mean more time away from home as you run out of time to get back to the yard and have to suffer the delights of an MSA or layby more than currently. With limiting the day to one amount of time say 12 hours the parking situation will be worse earlier in the day as you won’t have the same possible three hour differential in drivers ending their day.
Surely less driving hours and longer rest periods would lead to more money and more jobs in the industry for the drivers, or so you would think ?
mike68:
What continues to amaze me is the amount of drivers who don’t know the rules.
I completely agree.
Even after 23 years I still don’t understand them.
In fairness, I have never had a job where I needed to
mike68:
What continues to amaze me is the amount of drivers who don’t know the rules. This is why we need the driver cpc.
Based on what I’ve heard about some of the tacho courses being given as part of the Driver’s CPC drivers will still be none the wiser after the course as most of them seem to range from minor inaccuracies to total ■■■■■■■■ being taught.
Coffeeholic:
mike68:
What continues to amaze me is the amount of drivers who don’t know the rules. This is why we need the driver cpc.Based on what I’ve heard about some of the tacho courses being given as part of the Driver’s CPC drivers will still be none the wiser after the course as most of them seem to range from minor inaccuracies to total ■■■■■■■■ being taught.
Hence the need to simplify. I know a lot of drivers struggle to understand the rules as they are at present and rely on other people for advice,not always a good idea! I’m a long way from being any sort of expert myself!
The good news on the horizon is that we have a General Election coming up so we only have a few more months of the one-eyed Scottish idiot.
44 Tonne Ton:
Coffeeholic:
mike68:
What continues to amaze me is the amount of drivers who don’t know the rules. This is why we need the driver cpc.Based on what I’ve heard about some of the tacho courses being given as part of the Driver’s CPC drivers will still be none the wiser after the course as most of them seem to range from minor inaccuracies to total ■■■■■■■■ being taught.
Hence the need to simplify. I know a lot of drivers struggle to understand the rules as they are at present and rely on other people for advice,not always a good idea! I’m a long way from being any sort of expert myself!
Doesn’t matter how simple they are if the courses are teaching nonsense. 
Coffeeholic:
That’s the rules we have at the moment in half a dozen sentences, I’m struggling to see how that could be any more simple.
I’m printing that out !! Excellent !!! 
Although i still may have questions at a later date 
But it works.
Coffeeholic:
44 Tonne Ton:
Coffeeholic:
mike68:
What continues to amaze me is the amount of drivers who don’t know the rules. This is why we need the driver cpc.Based on what I’ve heard about some of the tacho courses being given as part of the Driver’s CPC drivers will still be none the wiser after the course as most of them seem to range from minor inaccuracies to total ■■■■■■■■ being taught.
Hence the need to simplify. I know a lot of drivers struggle to understand the rules as they are at present and rely on other people for advice,not always a good idea! I’m a long way from being any sort of expert myself!
Doesn’t matter how simple they are if the courses are teaching nonsense.
Then why do so many struggle with it? I have recently been helping someone with very basic numeracy and literacy and beleive me there’s a lot out there
Mike-C:
Although i still may have questions at a later date
That’s usually delboytwo’s job but I’m sure he won’t mind.
44 Tonne Ton:
Then why do so many struggle with it?
Because they are led to believe they are complicated so approach them with that mindset, from then on it’s all downhill.
It’s just a matter of reading them carefully and cutting through the legal speak. For those with literacy problems the courses need to be taught properly and in a simple manner, in fact for everybody regardless of their level of literacy. I don’t think people who have reading difficulties would have too much problem learning the rules from this six sentences if it was taught to them.