Saviem's fan club (Part 1)

[pete_smith]

MaggieD:

pete smith:

Retired Old ■■■■:

Fergie47:
Some more Chinese 6’s…except the last one, which is a twin steer, so would it be that in general terms all flat beds are Chinese 6’s and tractor units are twin steers, even if the steer axles are close together ? or perhaps,if yours 50 years old and younger they’re twin steer, and if your 51 and older they’re Chinesesssssss…May be we’ll have to get Sir Richard Evans QC,( MaggieD) to make an executive ruling to be abided by T/N members…

Mr Fergie and Mr Maggie D QC,
For the record I’m 46 and have always known them as Chinese 6’s, so please Sir Richard QC be careful with any ruling!

Hi Pete,

Hope you are well, I’m a little rusty on legal rules,as the last case I dealt with in Wolverhampton was a ruling on Bert Williams and Billy Wright’s shorts, were they either Short Longs or Long Shorts.
By the way my paper round started opposite “The Mount” in Penn Rd,and ended up in Colway Avenue !!
Hi Richard,
That was a nice round you had,mine was Whitmoreans! Can’t comment any further, you know why!!
Regards
Richard

edited cos it was sent twice

[harry_gill]

MaggieD:

harry_gill:
Hiya,
Are Mr and Mrs Fergie doing the Viennese waltz ■■.
thanks harry, long retired.

Hi Harry,

I don’t know, but it looks like Gay Gordon watching

Hope the Malt is still flowing.

Regards
Richard

Hiya,
Yes “MaggieD” the malt is more trickle than flow nowadays but
it is still being enjoyed, thank you.
thanks harry, long retired.

[carryfast]

gingerfold:
The term “Chinese-Six” has its origins in the mid-1930s and the actual vehicle type was a typical British solution to finding a way to increase the payload of a two axle rigid, the maximum gvw then being 12 tons. Hire and reward hauliers on ‘A’ Licence were also weight restricted for tare weight of a lorry. For about an extra ton weight of single wheel axle the gvw could be increased to 15 tons, gaining about 2 tons of extra payload and revenue. Back then virtually all loads were rated on tonnage. Some manufacturers and converters did put the single wheel axle behind the driven axle (e.g. the pre-WW2 AEC Mammoth Minor). I was told that the terminology “Chinese-Six” for twin-steering 3-axle rigids was used in a somewhat derogatory fashion because it wasn’t apparently the logical place to locate an extra axle. A Chinese way of doing something different was applied to other things when I was growing up, less politically correct times back then.

Blimey by that explanation we invented the idea. Then rightly took the pish out of ourselves by calling it ‘Chinese’ when the Chinese were still using rickshaws to haul stuff around.Then true to form the Chinese co incidentally actually copied the idea big time when they eventually discovered trucks.On that note no one said we have to be PC even now.

Having said that I don’t think I’ve ever seen a photo of a 1930’s Brit,or anywhere else,Chinese 6 configuration vehicle.

[fergie47]

pete smith:
Which Mrs Smith are you refering to Fergie? You have a choice…well you have to have an upgrade now and then

Explains everything Mr Smith…

[retired_old_fart]

Mr Smith is spot on with his views on marriage. I have traded wives in for newer models in the past, however now I’ve retired I’ve come to the conclusion that I can’t afford the upkeep on both a vehicle and a wife.

I do like my old van!

[robert1952]

Carryfast:

gingerfold:
The term “Chinese-Six” has its origins in the mid-1930s and the actual vehicle type was a typical British solution to finding a way to increase the payload of a two axle rigid, the maximum gvw then being 12 tons. Hire and reward hauliers on ‘A’ Licence were also weight restricted for tare weight of a lorry. For about an extra ton weight of single wheel axle the gvw could be increased to 15 tons, gaining about 2 tons of extra payload and revenue. Back then virtually all loads were rated on tonnage. Some manufacturers and converters did put the single wheel axle behind the driven axle (e.g. the pre-WW2 AEC Mammoth Minor). I was told that the terminology “Chinese-Six” for twin-steering 3-axle rigids was used in a somewhat derogatory fashion because it wasn’t apparently the logical place to locate an extra axle. A Chinese way of doing something different was applied to other things when I was growing up, less politically correct times back then.

Blimey by that explanation we invented the idea. Then rightly took the pish out of ourselves by calling it ‘Chinese’ when the Chinese were still using rickshaws to haul stuff around.Then true to form the Chinese co incidentally actually copied the idea big time when they eventually discovered trucks.On that note no one said we have to be PC even now.

Having said that I don’t think I’ve ever seen a photo of a 1930’s Brit,or anywhere else,Chinese 6 configuration vehicle.

Here you CF: a late '30s Foden Chinese 6, I believe! Robert

[fergie47]

Back on track… a few wreckers…

[fergie47]

A few spare parts for me !!

[carryfast]

robert1952:

Carryfast:
Blimey by that explanation we invented the idea. Then rightly took the pish out of ourselves by calling it ‘Chinese’ when the Chinese were still using rickshaws to haul stuff around.Then true to form the Chinese co incidentally actually copied the idea big time when they eventually discovered trucks.On that note no one said we have to be PC even now.

Having said that I don’t think I’ve ever seen a photo of a 1930’s Brit,or anywhere else,Chinese 6 configuration vehicle.

Here you CF: a late '30s Foden Chinese 6, I believe! Robert

0

Thanks for posting that Robert.It looks like gingerfold was right.But what a co incidence if the term was established here to describe a Brit designed truck configuration ‘before’ the Chinese actually became known for being its most common user.

[robert1952]

Carryfast:

robert1952:

Carryfast:
Blimey by that explanation we invented the idea. Then rightly took the pish out of ourselves by calling it ‘Chinese’ when the Chinese were still using rickshaws to haul stuff around.Then true to form the Chinese co incidentally actually copied the idea big time when they eventually discovered trucks.On that note no one said we have to be PC even now.

Having said that I don’t think I’ve ever seen a photo of a 1930’s Brit,or anywhere else,Chinese 6 configuration vehicle.

Here you CF: a late '30s Foden Chinese 6, I believe! Robert

0

Thanks for posting that Robert.It looks like gingerfold was right.But what a co incidence if the term was established here to describe a Brit designed truck configuration ‘before’ the Chinese actually became known for being its most common user.

Yes indeed CF, and I do belief it is just that: a coincidence! BTW, will your Bennku-drawn Bedford TM (D/D) rigid, with your name on the visor, be a Chinese-six perchance? Robert

[carryfast]

robert1952:
Bedford TM (D/D) rigid, with your name on the visor, be a Chinese-six perchance? Robert

Good old fashioned 6x4 western Capitalist decadence in keeping with its GM parent and 8x4 for the NZ market where they still recognise the real Brit lorry configuration.

[froggy55]

And now, a Corsican Berliet. Unfortunately scrapped since the picture was taken. (Picture from Charge-Utile Magazine)

[gingerfold]

robert1952:

Carryfast:

gingerfold:
The term “Chinese-Six” has its origins in the mid-1930s and the actual vehicle type was a typical British solution to finding a way to increase the payload of a two axle rigid, the maximum gvw then being 12 tons. Hire and reward hauliers on ‘A’ Licence were also weight restricted for tare weight of a lorry. For about an extra ton weight of single wheel axle the gvw could be increased to 15 tons, gaining about 2 tons of extra payload and revenue. Back then virtually all loads were rated on tonnage. Some manufacturers and converters did put the single wheel axle behind the driven axle (e.g. the pre-WW2 AEC Mammoth Minor). I was told that the terminology “Chinese-Six” for twin-steering 3-axle rigids was used in a somewhat derogatory fashion because it wasn’t apparently the logical place to locate an extra axle. A Chinese way of doing something different was applied to other things when I was growing up, less politically correct times back then.

Blimey by that explanation we invented the idea. Then rightly took the pish out of ourselves by calling it ‘Chinese’ when the Chinese were still using rickshaws to haul stuff around.Then true to form the Chinese co incidentally actually copied the idea big time when they eventually discovered trucks.On that note no one said we have to be PC even now.

Having said that I don’t think I’ve ever seen a photo of a 1930’s Brit,or anywhere else,Chinese 6 configuration vehicle.

Here you CF: a late '30s Foden Chinese 6, I believe! Robert

I have photos (hard copy) of Leyland twin-steers from the 1930s but I need to get my scanning sorted out, for some reason I cannot scan to the correct format for uploading to Trucknet. I think that Leyland could have been the pioneers of the concept in the '30s. AEC couldn’t easily adapt their braking system of the time,(a handbrake for parking was required on the additional axle).

0

[robert1952]

Carryfast:

robert1952:
Bedford TM (D/D) rigid, with your name on the visor, be a Chinese-six perchance? Robert

Good old fashioned 6x4 western Capitalist decadence in keeping with its GM parent and 8x4 for the NZ market where they still recognise the real Brit lorry configuration.

And photographed by Peter ‘Eight-wheeler’ Davies for the front cover of TRUCK, no doubt! Robert

[carryfast]

robert1952:
Good old fashioned 6x4 western Capitalist decadence in keeping with its GM parent and 8x4 for the NZ market where they still recognise the real Brit lorry configuration.

And photographed by Peter ‘Eight-wheeler’ Davies for the front cover of TRUCK, no doubt! Robert
[/quote]
It’s been done but ‘only’ a day cab tipper unfortunately.

hankstruckpictures.com/pix/t … le0063.jpg

[carryfast]

Froggy55:
0
And now, a Corsican Berliet. Unfortunately scrapped since the picture was taken. (Picture from Charge-Utile Magazine)

Blimey what’s the weight of that lot.

[robert1952]

Carryfast:

robert1952:
Good old fashioned 6x4 western Capitalist decadence in keeping with its GM parent and 8x4 for the NZ market where they still recognise the real Brit lorry configuration.

And photographed by Peter ‘Eight-wheeler’ Davies for the front cover of TRUCK, no doubt! Robert

It’s been done but ‘only’ a day cab tipper unfortunately.

hankstruckpictures.com/pix/t … le0063.jpg
[/quote]
Well, you could always have this one which has a sleeper cab. It’s also the only TM that I know of with a Twin-splitter 'box! Robert

[froggy55]

Carryfast:

Froggy55:
0
And now, a Corsican Berliet. Unfortunately scrapped since the picture was taken. (Picture from Charge-Utile Magazine)

Blimey what’s the weight of that lot.

I’d say the truck is about 12/13 tons, and maybe 20 tons f or the digger. Initially a 6x4, a second steering axle was fitted on the GBO by its owner, who considered a “home-made” 8x4 was more suitable than an artic for Corsican narrow mountain roads.

[carryfast]

Froggy55:

Carryfast:

Froggy55:
0
And now, a Corsican Berliet. Unfortunately scrapped since the picture was taken. (Picture from Charge-Utile Magazine)

Blimey what’s the weight of that lot.

I’d say maybe 20 tons f or the digger.

Looks possibly closer to 40 t than 20. Check out the clearance between body and wheels.

[saviem]

Froggy55:
0
And now, a Corsican Berliet. Unfortunately scrapped since the picture was taken. (Picture from Charge-Utile Magazine)

Evening all,

Refreshed from my Saturday night dose of Sicily via the TV…(and I do not watch much TV at all…“Commisario Montalbano”…try ever so hard not to look at the sub titles, just listen to the words, but Im losing my Italian, and also my French, could be age, lack of use, I d`ont know…but I loved Sicily…and likewise Corsica. Separate bits of my life, one as a lorry driver, another "bumbling " around in an atmosphere of pure optimism…and loving every second of it!

Then Froggy posts the picture of Michel Colon`s GBH. That picture really just does not do justice to the size of the thing! Or the enterprise of the man.

Funny old place to do business La Corse…Now if you were honest, and did good business, and sold great clean performing lorries…and not to your clients biggest competitor…life was fine…but sell " old dog"…and “take the Mick” with the price…then best not stay on the Island overnight…or ever!..it really is that serious!

Michel operated from a yard in Ghisonaccia, on the Eastern side of the island. But I first saw the GBH in Zicavo, near the centre, up a narrow little road dropping down to Corrano. And as Froggy says those narrow little roads were the reason for Michel creating that unique 8x4 GBH Berliet, because there are many places that one would not wish to, or ever contemplate taking an artic low loader with a 30 tonne machine…let alone be impossible so to do.

The basis of Michels "monster" was a 60s Berliet GBH long wheelbase, (4.95metre) 6x4, 26000kgs gvw inside “code”, or 45000kgs gvw outside “code”, (known as Hors Code). If I remember correctly the chassis weight was 13500kgs, plus body, (and Colons body was a substantial structure, mainly steel, with a hard wood deck, and ramps on the beavertail)l. Power was from the 140x160, 14780cc 200 hp Ricardo injection 6 cylinder, but as I write this I am not totally sure that she had not been uprated to the 240 hp MAN injection MDO3 M version, (Michel had acquired her second hand), with the10 speed FBO gear box combination. Driving down to the tandem double reduction FPOR bogie. I seem to remember she was running on Trilex front wheels, with 1200x20s not 1200x24s, The second steer was added by Michels team, complete with power steering box, and came not from either a GBO, or TBO, but from the lighter GLM. The steering geometry that they arrived at was very good, but when on full lock, (as Froggys picture), gave the GBO an almost 2CV Citroen appearance. But overall she was around 12.5 metres long , 2.5 metres wide, and loaded that centre of gravity really needed watching with care!

Carryfast is nearer the mark weight wise, the Fiat Allis was around 30 tonnes plus, then the GBO stood at a good17 tonnes, so there you have it an 8x4 Berliet from the 60s with 200 hp, @ around 47 tonnes…reliable, and strictly speaking totally illegal…but this was Haute Corse…wonderful place to do business…if you sold good lorries …with honesty!..and the Seafood Restauraunts were easily the equal of Sicily…and perhaps better…

Cheerio for now.