Religion.

[robroy]

Juddian:
Whether one believes in a God isn’t really the issue.

What becomes more certain every day is that pure evil, by whatever name one may know it, has been dilligently working and appears to be winning by quite some margin.
It thrives on mammon corruption and cruelty, sadly these are attractive traits for so many of the lost.

It’s been like that since time immemorial Juddian, but I reckon you know that.
Maybe that is how or why the very first religion started ,.some guy saw what the world and the dark side of human nature was like,.and he thought…
‘‘Hey I know,.I’ve got a cunning plan ,.I’ll make summet up to make people tow the line,.a made up being or a god to fear, that will make people think twice if they think there is some life after death or another,.and the choice is theirs if they live it up or end up down the khazi’’…(I’m paraphrasing btw.,.that is not the vernacular of your everyday prophet. )
Then others got the same idea,.and boom , numerous religions.
I knew I should have studied Theology at school,.I’m a natural, …I like the sound of …‘‘Reverend Rob’’.

[star_down_under]

robroy:

Juddian:
Whether one believes in a God isn’t really the issue.

What becomes more certain every day is that pure evil, by whatever name one may know it, has been dilligently working and appears to be winning by quite some margin.
It thrives on mammon corruption and cruelty, sadly these are attractive traits for so many of the lost.

It’s been like that since time immemorial Juddian, but I reckon you know that.
Maybe that is how or why the very first religion started ,.some guy saw what the world and the dark side of human nature was like,.and he thought…
‘‘Hey I know,.I’ve got a cunning plan ,.I’ll make summet up to make people tow the line,.a made up being or a god to fear, that will make people think twice if they think there is some life after death or another,.and the choice is theirs if they live it up or end up down the khazi’’…(I’m paraphrasing btw.,.that is not the vernacular of your everyday prophet. )
Then others got the same idea,.and boom , numerous religions.
I knew I should have studied Theology at school,.I’m a natural, …I like the sound of …‘‘Reverend Rob’’.

You’re a truck driver, ergo, The Right Rev Rob.

[carryfast]

robroy:

Juddian:
Whether one believes in a God isn’t really the issue.

What becomes more certain every day is that pure evil, by whatever name one may know it, has been dilligently working and appears to be winning by quite some margin.
It thrives on mammon corruption and cruelty, sadly these are attractive traits for so many of the lost.

It’s been like that since time immemorial Juddian, but I reckon you know that.
Maybe that is how or why the very first religion started ,.some guy saw what the world and the dark side of human nature was like,.and he thought…
‘‘Hey I know,.I’ve got a cunning plan ,.I’ll make summet up to make people tow the line,.a made up being or a god to fear, that will make people think twice if they think there is some life after death or another,.and the choice is theirs if they live it up or end up down the khazi’’…(I’m paraphrasing btw.,.that is not the vernacular of your everyday prophet. )
Then others got the same idea,.and boom , numerous religions.
I knew I should have studied Theology at school,.I’m a natural, …I like the sound of …‘‘Reverend Rob’’.

Ironically my take on it is that it’s more about explaining the meaning of life and how why we’re here.
Also don’t think that only believing just based on the idea and promise of an easy ride in the after life will cut it on arrival there.

[immigrant]

robroy:
A bit of a heavy and deep subject, but very apt on Easter Sunday.
Just to say I have no religion whatsoever, even though I was brought up in a Christian family, went to Sunday school,.and was confirmed in a C of E church at 14 years old.
My Mam and Dad are believers, my earliest memory of my grandparents are of them praying before they went to bed.
Anyhoo that said…
I see on Sky news, it’s all kicked off big style in Jerusalem where 3 different religions are celebrating 3 different events,.Christian’s …obviously Easter,
.The Muslims Ramadan,
.and The Jews …with some festival or another which escapes me.

However…Good luck to them,.and each to his own and all that.

It’s a bit like The World Cup all rival supporters meeting up in the venue city square and instead of celebrating the event together with a laugh and a beer., knocking 7 shades of [zb] out of one another.
At least in that case they are fighting over something that is actually real rather than a fantasy passed down from numerous generations with no REAL substance, but explained as ‘‘Having a faith’’.

I find it fascinating and amazing that in the present day …the 21st Century ffs !!!
People are still running their lives around some imaginary supernatural concept that all belong in the dark ages, even before the days when they were burning witches.
People are getting killed in the name of some religion or another ran by the crazed fanatics of each one.
I just don’t get it myself, if I kicked off a conversation in a pub telling a guy what Santa brought me for Christmas, or how much the tooth fairy left under my pillow last night, people would think I was a sandwich short, but if I talk about a religion I believe in, I am taken seriously, and in many cases respected.
If that offends anybody, I can’t help that, it is just my opinion
As I said…‘Each to his own’.

its abrahams religion by the old will.
first were all jews.
the jesus got killed for healing someone on a saturday and christianity was born, and later moslems. that why all three can pray together

[winseer]

The Schism that led to Islam going down a different path from Judaism - came from Abraham’s first-born son ISHMAEL not being recognized, and instead the birthright going to Isaac.

In Islam - Ishmael is the man, and Issac - was a nobody, because he didn’t survive… (Abraham - went thorugh with the human sacrifice!)

Ishmael, you see - was born on the wrong side of the blanket, being his maidservant’s kid, some Egyptian cleaner on a zero hours contract called Hagar.

[winseer]

Here’s one for everyone to answer in their own way:

“Wot do you believe happens to what is lost out of you at your death?”

“Soul”, “Lifeforce”, “Energy”, “Water” etc. - if everyone goes to nothingness, then why are people so worried about their reputations, when it doesn’t matter the moment you go through the curtains into the oven after all??

…Even Big Tats come off in there, don’t forget!

[dipster]

Winseer:
Here’s one for everyone to answer in their own way:

“Wot do you believe happens to what is lost out of you at your death?”

“Soul”, “Lifeforce”, “Energy”, “Water” etc. - if everyone goes to nothingness, then why are people so worried about their reputations, when it doesn’t matter the moment you go through the curtains into the oven after all??

…Even Big Tats come off in there, don’t forget!

I think we die when we cease to function for any reason-that is whether the fault be mechanical, such as heart failure, or electrical, such as brain functions failing that can no longer control the mechanical bits correctly. A bit like the ECU on our vehicles failing! Then we just become a big, lifeless lump of waste that can no longer protect itself from attack by the various microorganisms and insects etc. that are constantly attacking us but successfully repelled during life.

The long, dreamless, sleep. Just like a “dead” laptop. No soul, no onward journey.

[carryfast]

Winseer:
Here’s one for everyone to answer in their own way:

“Wot do you believe happens to what is lost out of you at your death?”

“Soul”, “Lifeforce”, “Energy”, “Water” etc. - if everyone goes to nothingness, then why are people so worried about their reputations, when it doesn’t matter the moment you go through the curtains into the oven after all??

…Even Big Tats come off in there, don’t forget!

The idea of ‘soul’ and ‘nothingness’ is an oxymoron.
If you believe that we have a soul then by definition that means something different and in addition to the mortal component and side of life.Which to put it simply is just a big bag of mostly water.
The miracle of life is something else and something totally unexplainable by science starting with the question of the origin of the DNA code.
Plenty of scope for all the different ideas that suggest that the meaning of life isn’t about the big bag of water either at conception or death.

[winseer]

If we don’t remember being “Dead” 100 years ago, then will we be aware of being dead - 100 years from now?

There are supposedly 7 major faiths in the world, and it is often said that each one of them - has a facet of the bigger picture…

The concept of “Afterlife” for instance, “Re-incarnation”, “Ascending”, “Descent to a lower order for the wicked”, “rewards for virtue deeds”, “karma for misdeeds”, and a load of other concepts I invite others to come up with.

Our “mis-understanding” of any or all of such concepts - leads us to these roads to perdition that are a common thread around the world of humanity as it is today.

Just as no kid says “I want to be a prostitute when I grow up”, there can’t be many people that say "I want to go to hell/be re-incarnated as a slug/go to nothingness/rot gently in the ground etc etc

…And yet - there’s this undertow among the general public that suggests just that: It is only a matter of time now when the more brazen irregligious types - have a "CremCam at their funeral, so you can actually watch in close detail as their earthly remains get burned down to a skeleton, their skulls and marrow-filled bones exploding as their contents boil, the fragments being raked out, stuck into that cement-mixer centrifuge-like device known as a “Cremulator”, and ground into the power we know as “Ashes”…

Pretty grim - for anyone alive actually watching this rather uncomfortable truth about what happens to us “when we die” in the very physical world of things, eh?

[carryfast]

Winseer:
If we don’t remember being “Dead” 100 years ago, then will we be aware of being dead - 100 years from now?

There are supposedly 7 major faiths in the world, and it is often said that each one of them - has a facet of the bigger picture…

The concept of “Afterlife” for instance, “Re-incarnation”, “Ascending”, “Descent to a lower order for the wicked”, “rewards for virtue deeds”, “karma for misdeeds”, and a load of other concepts I invite others to come up with.

Our “mis-understanding” of any or all of such concepts - leads us to these roads to perdition that are a common thread around the world of humanity as it is today.

Just as no kid says “I want to be a prostitute when I grow up”, there can’t be many people that say "I want to go to hell/be re-incarnated as a slug/go to nothingness/rot gently in the ground etc etc

…And yet - there’s this undertow among the general public that suggests just that: It is only a matter of time now when the more brazen irregligious types - have a "CremCam at their funeral, so you can actually watch in close detail as their earthly remains get burned down to a skeleton, their skulls and marrow-filled bones exploding as their contents boil, the fragments being raked out, stuck into that cement-mixer centrifuge-like device known as a “Cremulator”, and ground into the power we know as “Ashes”…

Pretty grim - for anyone alive actually watching this rather uncomfortable truth about what happens to us “when we die” in the very physical world of things, eh?

Don’t think there’s any connection between the miracles of conception and the after life following it v the different ways and contradictions in how the mortal corpse is dealt with by different cultures or choice.They are two totally different concepts.
In which one culture would see the methods of the other as sickening desecration and sometimes even within the same culture and religion pro v anti cremation.In which the antis see burial as laying the mortal remains to rest.
I’m firmly within the latter group and the sickening violence of your description is one of the reasons why.Including just the possible trauma in the long term of those employed in that process.

[dipster]

Carryfast:

Winseer:
If we don’t remember being “Dead” 100 years ago, then will we be aware of being dead - 100 years from now?

There are supposedly 7 major faiths in the world, and it is often said that each one of them - has a facet of the bigger picture…

The concept of “Afterlife” for instance, “Re-incarnation”, “Ascending”, “Descent to a lower order for the wicked”, “rewards for virtue deeds”, “karma for misdeeds”, and a load of other concepts I invite others to come up with.

Our “mis-understanding” of any or all of such concepts - leads us to these roads to perdition that are a common thread around the world of humanity as it is today.

Just as no kid says “I want to be a prostitute when I grow up”, there can’t be many people that say "I want to go to hell/be re-incarnated as a slug/go to nothingness/rot gently in the ground etc etc

…And yet - there’s this undertow among the general public that suggests just that: It is only a matter of time now when the more brazen irregligious types - have a "CremCam at their funeral, so you can actually watch in close detail as their earthly remains get burned down to a skeleton, their skulls and marrow-filled bones exploding as their contents boil, the fragments being raked out, stuck into that cement-mixer centrifuge-like device known as a “Cremulator”, and ground into the power we know as “Ashes”…

Pretty grim - for anyone alive actually watching this rather uncomfortable truth about what happens to us “when we die” in the very physical world of things, eh?

Don’t think there’s any connection between the miracles of conception and the after life following it v the different ways and contradictions in how the mortal corpse is dealt with by different cultures or choice.They are two totally different concepts.
In which one culture would see the methods of the other as sickening desecration and sometimes even within the same culture and religion pro v anti cremation.In which the antis see burial as laying the mortal remains to rest.
I’m firmly within the latter group and the sickening violence of your description is one of the reasons why.Including just the possible trauma in the long term of those employed in that process.

Yet again I find myself agreeing with Carryfast’s last sentence.

I am not at all religious. When I die I imagine my corpse will be an inconvenient piece of waste to be disposed of rapidly and with no fuss. But I would prefer that my remains are allowed to follow Nature’s course and slowly fade away: That is to rot naturally. Of course this could be very unpleasant for any nearby and I imagine that is why we and many societies have simply buried the remains.

Slightly digressing from religion it has to be said that cemeteries do devour a great deal of land that society seem to imagine become hallowed ground, (I do not agree with that thinking) to be preserved for a long time-although not for ever as many cemeteries are ultimately re-purposed! Perhaps individual plots for the defunct is not the answer. I recall in Prague there is an ancient Jewish cemetery that is multi-layer, that is graves on top of graves (note that in Judaism burial is the norm, so no alternative would be acceptable). This was the result of anti-Jewish feeling in the past not allowing the local Jewish population more land within the city.

[carryfast]

Dipster:

Carryfast:

Winseer:
Yet again I find myself agreeing with Carryfast’s last sentence.

I am not at all religious. When I die I imagine my corpse will be an inconvenient piece of waste to be disposed of rapidly and with no fuss. But I would prefer that my remains are allowed to follow Nature’s course and slowly fade away: That is to rot naturally. Of course this could be very unpleasant for any nearby and I imagine that is why we and many societies have simply buried the remains.

Slightly digressing from religion it has to be said that cemeteries do devour a great deal of land that society seem to imagine become hallowed ground, (I do not agree with that thinking) to be preserved for a long time-although not for ever as many cemeteries are ultimately re-purposed! Perhaps individual plots for the defunct is not the answer. I recall in Prague there is an ancient Jewish cemetery that is multi-layer, that is graves on top of graves (note that in Judaism burial is the norm, so no alternative would be acceptable). This was the result of anti-Jewish feeling in the past not allowing the local Jewish population more land within the city.

To be fair anti Judaism frequently occurred in societies where burial was considered the expected norm for all.
Also bearing in mind that cremation was only legalised here relatively recently.
While the logical conclusion of high density city type living ultimately comes down to chucking the dead into an acid tank being more efficient and cheaper than cremation, to add even lower quality of death, to the low quality of life.
Compared to small communities spread around the country with sufficient land space around them v population to treat their dead with respect.

[winseer]

What we should all be agreed upon here - is that with our lives strictly limited by our own mortality, then making those years for each and every one of us - as smooth as possible, rather than brow-beating others with tales of what one believes over another.

“Belief Systems” is how the Atheist sees “Religion” for sure, but surely “Personal Politics” is also a “Belief System” in that regard?

Why do we believe the lies of Tony Blair but not those of Micheal Howard for example?

Why does the media defend the lies of one side and make-up lies to be told of the other side?

Have the media, indeed - become nothing more than “Pontiffs of Disbelief” or the ultimate temple of Atheism, where it becomes impossible to prove anything, ever?

How we define “What would prove something to me” then - is as important as any other belief system one might cling to.

“Can you be sold to?” is a question of inner strength, rather than perceived “outward gullibility” - I’d humbly suggest to everyone.

[carryfast]

Winseer:
What we should all be agreed upon here - is that with our lives strictly limited by our own mortality, then making those years for each and every one of us - as smooth as possible, rather than brow-beating others with tales of what one believes over another.

“Belief Systems” is how the Atheist sees “Religion” for sure, but surely “Personal Politics” is also a “Belief System” in that regard?

Why do we believe the lies of Tony Blair but not those of Micheal Howard for example?

Why does the media defend the lies of one side and make-up lies to be told of the other side?

Have the media, indeed - become nothing more than “Pontiffs of Disbelief” or the ultimate temple of Atheism, where it becomes impossible to prove anything, ever?

How we define “What would prove something to me” then - is as important as any other belief system one might cling to.

“Can you be sold to?” is a question of inner strength, rather than perceived “outward gullibility” - I’d humbly suggest to everyone.

You can generally choose to reject or believe a religion.Or selectively reject and accept.
Not so in the case of politics and government.IE I choose not to believe the theory of ‘climate change’ so I choose not to be bound by its needless ‘solutions’.

[winseer]

Maybe one’s set of beliefs (and we DO all have such!) makes a “fingerprint” of what and who we are…?

I don’t believe that Gaia and Europa have any long-term future.

I DO believe that what worked in the past - will be re-used to work again in times of trouble coming…

Boneparte took advantage of such a power vacuum following the “Reign of Terror” but even he couldn’t act until the instigator of that Reign of Terror, Max Robespierre had successfully been neutralized (by ruining his reputation, and feeding him to his own machine that so many met their deaths upon at his instigation)

People don’t want to suffer, regardless of them being pius or total libertines in their collective lifestyles.

The future belongs to those that can and do, rather than those who have to look things up on the internet just to answer a question, IF they ever answer ANY questions, in the case of our hapless politicians.

Green - won’t feed you with tales of “Meat is Murder” won’t keep formerly “for slaughter” animals alive in a comfortable retirement, as opposed to being eaten by we carnivores…

Ukraine - won’t be feeding you neither, anymore… Even if Putin owes the last grain on Earth, the West would rather deny it and starve, than let Putin have his win, which he’ll take in any case, because that’s what winning autocrats DO after all.

Then (back to topic) we must look at the huge role that 3000-Church-Building Putin has played among his own people in the Russias, compared to the woke, self-destructive, hand-wringing Godless liberal set that thought they’d solved all the world’s problems, only to faceplant in the face of natural disasters that even THEY don’t control by merely “disbelieving” that such natural disasters are anything but man-made rather than God’s Judgement…

We’re on the wrong team, folks!!

[star_down_under]

youtu.be/OBRiWcqMX6M