Dipster:
Anybody else persuaded today that it is time to lose the Monarchy?
A Royalist spokesman was on 5 live this morning telling us that the Queen costs us much less in this country than the French President costs France,.and asked which country is getting the better value…
Nothing against the Queen but my answer would be France.,because Macron’s family members cousins and distant relatives and in laws etc, have not got their snouts in the same trough as it is in the UK.
And Macron is actually performing a function. The Queen?
The “Bank Of Mum and Dad” seems to be a bit more relevant for Andrew here.
fodenway:
Not that I condone trafficking or exploitation in any way, but I can’t imagine that any of these girls raised much objection at the time to being escorted to lavish parties, meeting rich, famous and influential people and (presumably) being showered with expensive gifts in return for ■■■■■■ favours. Beats a bunk-up with the kid down the street in the back of his mum’s stationwagon after a McDonalds and a Pepsi.
And yes, I do think that paying someone off out of court amounts to an admission of at least some degree of guilt.
Andrew should not be able to return to duties on behalf of the Royal Family, in my opinion.
The girls given drugs, and takeaways, didnt make much objection at the time in Rotherham either. Champagne and caviar it may be sometimes, but it is just the same: in both alleged cases its older men, and younger poorer kids.
Neither case is it a “kid from down the street”, of nearly the same age.
fodenway:
Not that I condone trafficking or exploitation in any way, but I can’t imagine that any of these girls raised much objection at the time to being escorted to lavish parties, meeting rich, famous and influential people and (presumably) being showered with expensive gifts in return for ■■■■■■ favours. Beats a bunk-up with the kid down the street in the back of his mum’s stationwagon after a McDonalds and a Pepsi.
And yes, I do think that paying someone off out of court amounts to an admission of at least some degree of guilt.
Andrew should not be able to return to duties on behalf of the Royal Family, in my opinion.
The girls given drugs, and takeaways, didnt make much objection at the time in Rotherham either. Champagne and caviar it may be sometimes, but it is just the same: in both alleged cases its older men, and younger poorer kids.
Neither case is it a “kid from down the street”, of nearly the same age.
I’m the last guy to stick up for this 2hat, but in mitigation she was under age in the US where as if it had been over here she would have been within the age of consent, so it ain’t that he’s a kiddy fiddler as such, just tbf to the ■■■■ for just a minute.
If it happened in the UK the ‘scandal’ would be more of a ‘Prince Andrew shagging girls the same age as his daughter’’ perspective.
fodenway:
Not that I condone trafficking or exploitation in any way, but I can’t imagine that any of these girls raised much objection at the time to being escorted to lavish parties, meeting rich, famous and influential people and (presumably) being showered with expensive gifts in return for ■■■■■■ favours. Beats a bunk-up with the kid down the street in the back of his mum’s stationwagon after a McDonalds and a Pepsi.
And yes, I do think that paying someone off out of court amounts to an admission of at least some degree of guilt.
Andrew should not be able to return to duties on behalf of the Royal Family, in my opinion.
The girls given drugs, and takeaways, didnt make much objection at the time in Rotherham either. Champagne and caviar it may be sometimes, but it is just the same: in both alleged cases its older men, and younger poorer kids.
Neither case is it a “kid from down the street”, of nearly the same age.
I’m the last guy to stick up for this 2hat, but in mitigation she was under age in the US where as if it had been over here she would have been within the age of consent, so it ain’t that he’s a kiddy fiddler as such, just tbf to the [zb] for just a minute.
If it happened in the UK the ‘scandal’ would be more of a ‘Prince Andrew shagging girls the same age as his daughter’’ perspective.
Would you have been happy if a 40yr old guy, was with a daughter of yours when she was 15, or when she was 17? Guiffre was apparently abused by others from age 14. She was being led* up to this sort of thing for years. She wasnt, by her accounts, some sort of “wordly wise kid” out for a good time.
Careful, or you`ll be joining the ranks of the cops who victim blamed the Rotherham kids too. Bad kids after pocket money. Low morals because they are poor.
Pimps need clients. Pimps seek out vulnerable runaway kids.
Just because they pass a certain age does that make them less of a victim?
I don`t mean one person acting deliberately, but a life of being treated badly leads to acceptance of lower standards.
fodenway:
Not that I condone trafficking or exploitation in any way, but I can’t imagine that any of these girls raised much objection at the time to being escorted to lavish parties, meeting rich, famous and influential people and (presumably) being showered with expensive gifts in return for ■■■■■■ favours. Beats a bunk-up with the kid down the street in the back of his mum’s stationwagon after a McDonalds and a Pepsi.
And yes, I do think that paying someone off out of court amounts to an admission of at least some degree of guilt.
Andrew should not be able to return to duties on behalf of the Royal Family, in my opinion.
The girls given drugs, and takeaways, didnt make much objection at the time in Rotherham either. Champagne and caviar it may be sometimes, but it is just the same: in both alleged cases its older men, and younger poorer kids.
Neither case is it a “kid from down the street”, of nearly the same age.
As opposed to the 18 year old naval rating Phil sending love letters to 13 year old Liz and teenaged Di saving herself for pushing 30’s Charlie when Andy would have been the more appropriate match for her.
The girls given drugs, and takeaways, didnt make much objection at the time in Rotherham either. Champagne and caviar it may be sometimes, but it is just the same: in both alleged cases its older men, and younger poorer kids.
Neither case is it a “kid from down the street”, of nearly the same age.[/quote
Does that mean that everyone has her price, and some will settle for much less than others?
fodenway:
The girls given drugs, and takeaways, didnt make much objection at the time in Rotherham either. Champagne and caviar it may be sometimes, but it is just the same: in both alleged cases its older men, and younger poorer kids.
Neither case is it a “kid from down the street”, of nearly the same age.
[/quote
Does that mean that everyone has her price, and some will settle for much less than others?
It means that paying kids or vulnerable youngsters, that getting them high or drunk, is equally wrong no matter if it`s with cheap vodka, or expensive champagne.
fodenway:
I can’t imagine that any of these girls raised much objection at the time to being escorted to lavish parties, meeting rich, famous and influential people and (presumably) being showered with expensive gifts in return for ■■■■■■ favours. Beats a bunk-up with the kid down the street in the back of his mum’s stationwagon after a McDonalds and a Pepsi.
Seems to be you saying that if a vulnerable youngster gets a fistful of cash from a rich old ■■■■, that beats doing it for free with a friend of the same age from the local area.
Is that what you really mean?
Not quite , but a lot of people will do things that others wouldn’t for the chance of something, be it gifts, money or whatever. Someone famous once said something like “we’ve established what you are, madam, now we’re just negotiating the price”.
fodenway:
Not quite , but a lot of people will do things that others wouldn’t for the chance of something, be it gifts, money or whatever. Someone famous once said something like “we’ve established what you are, madam, now we’re just negotiating the price”.
Mark Twain? maybe.
Yes, many people have a negotiable price.
Seems to me we are dealing with allegations of predatory older people using runaways etc.
Not mature adults deciding that breaking fingernails on a typewriter aint for them. If a vulnerable under age kid is groomed as a ■■■■■, will them passing just one more birthday make them fair game? It is nigh impossible to legislate for "maturity", but that is why the law states an age. Bad as it is, its the best we got.
Guiffre was 17 when the alleged events took place.
In Portugal, Hungary, Leichtenstein, the age of consent is 14. Would it been OK for events as alleged to be done with girls of this age, in those countries?
Seems to me, that two 15 year old kids having ■■■ is much less of a crime than a 17 year old with a 40 year old.
First is illegal in the UK, second isn`t. Very difficult to get around.
Looks to me much less about consensual ■■■, and more about power over weaker individuals.
Rich, mature, influencial people can manipulate kids , without hitting them, especially if they are three-quarter ■■■■■■■
fodenway:
Not that I condone trafficking or exploitation in any way, but I can’t imagine that any of these girls raised much objection at the time to being escorted to lavish parties, meeting rich, famous and influential people and (presumably) being showered with expensive gifts in return for ■■■■■■ favours. Beats a bunk-up with the kid down the street in the back of his mum’s stationwagon after a McDonalds and a Pepsi.
And yes, I do think that paying someone off out of court amounts to an admission of at least some degree of guilt.
Andrew should not be able to return to duties on behalf of the Royal Family, in my opinion.
The girls given drugs, and takeaways, didnt make much objection at the time in Rotherham either. Champagne and caviar it may be sometimes, but it is just the same: in both alleged cases its older men, and younger poorer kids.
Neither case is it a “kid from down the street”, of nearly the same age.
I’m the last guy to stick up for this 2hat, but in mitigation she was under age in the US where as if it had been over here she would have been within the age of consent, so it ain’t that he’s a kiddy fiddler as such, just tbf to the [zb] for just a minute.
If it happened in the UK the ‘scandal’ would be more of a ‘Prince Andrew shagging girls the same age as his daughter’’ perspective.
Would you have been happy if a 40yr old guy, was with a daughter of yours when she was 15, or when she was 17? Guiffre was apparently abused by others from age 14. She was being led* up to this sort of thing for years. She wasnt, by her accounts, some sort of “wordly wise kid” out for a good time.
Careful, or you`ll be joining the ranks of the cops who victim blamed the Rotherham kids too. Bad kids after pocket money. Low morals because they are poor.
Pimps need clients. Pimps seek out vulnerable runaway kids.
Just because they pass a certain age does that make them less of a victim?
I don`t mean one person acting deliberately, but a life of being treated badly leads to acceptance of lower standards.
Bit of a stupid question…''Would I be HAPPY ‘’ take a guess.
I was coming at it from a legal pov, comparing the age of consent in the US with over here.
If a 40 yr old guy goes with a 17 yr old girl, it is legal in the UK, acceptability is down to the individual.
If a 40 yr old guy rapes an under age child it is neither legal nor acceptable…but I think you already knew what I meant before you questioned me .
“Prince Andrew, let’s be very clear, is a guy who does a huge amount of unsung, unheralded work for this country and people, they go on and on about air miles and so on – actually, I’ve seen that guy get out there and sell this country, try and help British firms to get business around the world.
“He does a huge amount of good and a huge amount of hard work. So if you ask me whether I have sympathy for him, of course I do.”
This was in 2015, after the 2014 Florida court case when he was mentioned.
Franglais:
Is the Mayor of London regretting this?
“Prince Andrew, let’s be very clear, is a guy who does a huge amount of unsung, unheralded work for this country and people, they go on and on about air miles and so on – actually, I’ve seen that guy get out there and sell this country, try and help British firms to get business around the world.
“He does a huge amount of good and a huge amount of hard work. So if you ask me whether I have sympathy for him, of course I do.”
This was in 2015, after the 2014 Florida court case when he was mentioned.
Jimmy Savile DId a lot of hard work for the country. Didn’t he?
Franglais:
Is the Mayor of London regretting this?
“Prince Andrew, let’s be very clear, is a guy who does a huge amount of unsung, unheralded work for this country and people, they go on and on about air miles and so on – actually, I’ve seen that guy get out there and sell this country, try and help British firms to get business around the world.
“He does a huge amount of good and a huge amount of hard work. So if you ask me whether I have sympathy for him, of course I do.”
This was in 2015, after the 2014 Florida court case when he was mentioned.
Jimmy Savile DId a lot of hard work for the country. Didn’t he?
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Did many stand up for Savile after serious allegations were made?
No one has to slag someone off straight away that allegations are made, but neither do they have to say they “have sympathy” with them.
No need to condemn someone without evidence, nor is there need to sympathise with them.
Shouldn`t the Mayor have just shut up about the alleged criminal?
Franglais:
Is the Mayor of London regretting this?
“Prince Andrew, let’s be very clear, is a guy who does a huge amount of unsung, unheralded work for this country and people, they go on and on about air miles and so on – actually, I’ve seen that guy get out there and sell this country, try and help British firms to get business around the world.
“He does a huge amount of good and a huge amount of hard work. So if you ask me whether I have sympathy for him, of course I do.”
This was in 2015, after the 2014 Florida court case when he was mentioned.
One twunt speaking up for another…and trying to blag a knighthood no doubt.
Speaking of Saville and the aftermath of the revelations…I wonder how many more young girls are going to come out of the woodwork looking for a payday, as those did with him.
We can only hope.
Franglais:
Is the Mayor of London regretting this?
“Prince Andrew, let’s be very clear, is a guy who does a huge amount of unsung, unheralded work for this country and people, they go on and on about air miles and so on – actually, I’ve seen that guy get out there and sell this country, try and help British firms to get business around the world.
“He does a huge amount of good and a huge amount of hard work. So if you ask me whether I have sympathy for him, of course I do.”
This was in 2015, after the 2014 Florida court case when he was mentioned.
One twunt speaking up for another…and trying to blag a knighthood no doubt.
robroy:
Speaking of Saville and the aftermath of the revelations…I wonder how many more young girls are going to come out of the woodwork looking for a payday, as those did with him.
We can only hope.
I don’t think abused girls are after a payday mate…
Not that I condone trafficking or exploitation in any way, but I can’t imagine that any of these girls raised much objection at the time to being escorted to lavish parties, meeting rich, famous and influential people and (presumably) being showered with expensive gifts in return for ■■■■■■ favours.
The girls given drugs, and takeaways, didn`t make much objection at the time in Rotherham either.
Slightly concerning that this post doesn’t equate this kind of exploitative behaviour with exploitation.
The National Crime Agency define Operation Stovewood, their investigation into child ■■■■■■ abuse in Rotherham, as “the single largest law enforcement investigation into non-familial child ■■■■■■ exploitation and abuse in the UK”
robroy:
Speaking of Saville and the aftermath of the revelations…I wonder how many more young girls are going to come out of the woodwork looking for a payday, as those did with him.
We can only hope.
I don’t think abused girls are after a payday mate…
Ok wrong choice of words…how about financial reparation ?
