Oil level "high"

Franglais:
I was meaning, its best not to expand the possibilities for confusion. So I certainly wont mention it…
:smiley:

As it happens I did have a 1974, dry sump, 750/4, and later on other big Hondas. Always well engineered bikes.

Got ya now :blush:
No, we don’t want to expand the possibilities for confusion :laughing:

Aye, they were often over engineered.
My dad was an engineer. The place where he worked decided to try Japanese gearboxes. This was back in the 1950s.
When they placed the initial order, they specified a maximum percentage of ‘not up to spec’ boxes, as they were used to doing with British gearbox suppliers.
There was some confusion with this line in Japan, a ‘lost in translation’ thing.
So when the orders of gearboxes started arriving, there was a percentage of not working gearboxes in the delivery, with the correct parts in the crate to make a good gearbox :smiley:

Franglais:
Me:
I won`t say “dry sump”…

Oooppss!

Simon:
Erm, no!
The single over head cam K’s from the 70s were dry sump though.

You didn’t break one, forgetting it wasn’t dry sump did you?

I was meaning, its best not to expand the possibilities for confusion. So I certainly wont mention it…
:smiley:

As it happens I did have a 1974, dry sump, 750/4, and later on other big Hondas. Always well engineered bikes.

Bearing in mind that one of the advantages of dry sump lubrication is that it can be used to lower if not reverse crankcase pressure.How so ?.

Roymondo:

Carryfast:
Thereby increasing crankcase pressures which are an unarguable fact or we wouldn’t need a crankcase breather system.

Positive crankcase pressure is a result of small amounts of leakage past the piston rings, not “windage” due to pistons moving up and down.

That’s why we have crankcase breather systems, and why such systems give problems when the bores/rings are worn.

As has already been said, in any 4 or 6 cylinder in line engine the crankcase gas displaced by a downward moving piston is at all times exactly balanced out by another piston moving upwards at the same time, leaving a net zero effect on crankcase pressure.

Exactly where did I say that crankcase pressure ISN’T ( also/mostly ) caused by piston ring blow by.
Windage defined as energy released by a higher pressure moving to a lower pressure ?.
If it was an average of zero there would obviously be no wind energy.The wind energy in question contained by the crankcase also acts on the oil seals as part of that ?.
Also bearing in mind my point that an over filled sump means less crankcase capacity which means more pressure created by the equivalent blow by and/or arguably also windage.

Having followed this post I think ‘Windage’ is definitely the best word to describe CF’s posts :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

whisperingsmith:
Having followed this post I think ‘Windage’ is definitely the best word to describe CF’s posts :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

Sounds like a definitive last word to me!

On the first day of my last job I pulled out the dipstick of the truck and the level was on the “min” mark so I walked into the garage and asked for some oil. They asked why so I told them and their response was that’s where we like the oil level, we don’t put any more in that’s not needed.

In fact they told me to not bother checking the oil as that was their concern. :open_mouth:

The old Merc I drove for a one man band always had the oil half an inch below the full mark. He told me that if I topped it up, it’d be that half inch down the next day. No oil leaks.

When you start a cold engine, that is the most dangerous part, it is one of the problems using easy start, the engine fires up before it has cranked enough oil around the bearings, easy start cleans the bores and creates a really hot explosion. I notice the guys on Bangers and Cash like their easy start a little too much. I too prefer a dip reading to a sensor which may be faulty.

Too much oil will normally force out a crankshaft seal or a gasket.

When I ran DAF, they were much happier and stayed cleaner if you ran the oil between the two marks.

Wheel Nut:
When you start a cold engine, that is the most dangerous part, it is one of the problems using easy start, the engine fires up before it has cranked enough oil around the bearings, easy start cleans the bores and creates a really hot explosion. I notice the guys on Bangers and Cash like their easy start a little too much. I too prefer a dip reading to a sensor which may be faulty.

I’m not sure of the reasons why, but diesels can become “addicted” to Easy Start, and other equivalents. Australia apparently has an equivalent with a particularly catchy name :smiley:
So, to prevent the addiction, it’s better to limit its use as much as possible.

Oil…my truck holds 36 litres of 5W30. Just learnt that today.

Simon:

Wheel Nut:
When you start a cold engine, that is the most dangerous part, it is one of the problems using easy start, the engine fires up before it has cranked enough oil around the bearings, easy start cleans the bores and creates a really hot explosion. I notice the guys on Bangers and Cash like their easy start a little too much. I too prefer a dip reading to a sensor which may be faulty.

I’m not sure of the reasons why, but diesels can become “addicted” to Easy Start, and other equivalents. Australia apparently has an equivalent with a particularly catchy name :smiley:
So, to prevent the addiction, it’s better to limit its use as much as possible.

If a current engine needs gas to start it, then it has a fault. If that fault isnt addressed then it will stay the same, or get worse. I dont think it`s an “addiction”, so much as a persisting or worsening underlying fault.

Franglais:

Simon:

Wheel Nut:
When you start a cold engine, that is the most dangerous part, it is one of the problems using easy start, the engine fires up before it has cranked enough oil around the bearings, easy start cleans the bores and creates a really hot explosion. I notice the guys on Bangers and Cash like their easy start a little too much. I too prefer a dip reading to a sensor which may be faulty.

I’m not sure of the reasons why, but diesels can become “addicted” to Easy Start, and other equivalents. Australia apparently has an equivalent with a particularly catchy name :smiley:
So, to prevent the addiction, it’s better to limit its use as much as possible.

If a current engine needs gas to start it, then it has a fault. If that fault isnt addressed then it will stay the same, or get worse. I dont think it`s an “addiction”, so much as a persisting or worsening underlying fault.

Assuming fuel supply is ok starting a diesel is mainly a function of compression pressure and cylinder temperature.A worn engine with low compression combined with cold temperatures soaking away what compression heat there is will obviously create more starting problems.While reliance on easy start will obviously wash and dilute oil off the bores increasing the problem of bore wear and thereby reducing compression pressures more.

I check the oil on my old Daf every morning like i should , it does use around a gallon a week but every now and then on break i will get oil level high and sometimes low mainly due to being parked on a slope. What i don’t inderstand is why did they stop making the dip stick unaccessable without tilting the cab it doesn’t make sense especially with unreliable sensors

ramone:
I check the oil on my old Daf every morning like i should , it does use around a gallon a week but every now and then on break i will get oil level high and sometimes low mainly due to being parked on a slope. What i don’t inderstand is why did they stop making the dip stick unaccessable without tilting the cab it doesn’t make sense especially with unreliable sensors

In think it was Lord Stokes who, may years ago said “I don`t need someone to design another new car. I need someone to save ten bob on every rear light fitting”.

No external oil dip = another few bob saved for the maker.

Franglais:

ramone:
I check the oil on my old Daf every morning like i should , it does use around a gallon a week but every now and then on break i will get oil level high and sometimes low mainly due to being parked on a slope. What i don’t inderstand is why did they stop making the dip stick unaccessable without tilting the cab it doesn’t make sense especially with unreliable sensors

In think it was Lord Stokes who, may years ago said “I don`t need someone to design another new car. I need someone to save ten bob on every rear light fitting”.

No external oil dip = another few bob saved for the maker.

But they still have a dipstick (usually) - it’s just not accessible by opening the bonnet panel. Instead you have to tilt the cab.

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Franglais:

ramone:
I check the oil on my old Daf every morning like i should , it does use around a gallon a week but every now and then on break i will get oil level high and sometimes low mainly due to being parked on a slope. What i don’t inderstand is why did they stop making the dip stick unaccessable without tilting the cab it doesn’t make sense especially with unreliable sensors

In think it was Lord Stokes who, may years ago said “I don`t need someone to design another new car. I need someone to save ten bob on every rear light fitting”.

No external oil dip = another few bob saved for the maker.

Shame he didn’t resign before he got his sticky hands on AEC that would have saved a few bob

Roymondo:
But they still have a dipstick (usually) - it’s just not accessible by opening the bonnet panel. Instead you have to tilt the cab.

Agreed there is a dip there, but as you say it isn`t accessible externally, you gotta get inside the engine shrouding, by tilting the cab.
A few bob saved in not installing the longer dip-tube.

So how do you use the easy start then?
Where do you spray it?

Sploom:
So how do you use the easy start then?
Where do you spray it?

Into the engine air intake - ideally pop open the air filter canister and spray it in there.

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