iDriver:
Hmmm how does the saying go, “argue with an idiot and he will drag you down to his level then beat you on experience”.I bow out in awww of your vast experience.
Awe 
degsy4wheels:
Everyone who is arrested is forced to submit a DNA sample and this is then kept on file for six?Having been arrested for complete ■■■■■■■■, false accusation, proven in court, i was told that if found not guilty all my dna and fingerprints would be removed from the Filth database…Despite me asking them to provide evidence of this i am still waiting, and that was 2 years ago. so i assume they have not removed either fingerprints or dna, and they just lied.
This shouldn’t happen any more as it’s been outlawed by both the UK supreme Court and the European Court of Human Rights in 2008. But of course when it comes to giving us our rights back the wheels of parliament move slowly. 
I’ll just add this little bit here if i may. A few years back i had issues with the insurance database for my car and was stopped twice for alleged no insurance(i proved otherwise on both occasions).
Talking to one of the more senior police officers on one of these occasions he remarked that the police are merely civilians in uniform who “represent” the law and enforce it and are not as seems to be the general consensus here “above” it.
If this is the case then why not apply the arrest to preserve evidence scenario in this case or any other case involving an accident involving any police vehicle?
EastAnglianTrucker:
So in this case, despite the police vehicle having a camera and a black box, it’s considered appropriate to allow a police officer to leave the scene, or drink, or indeed recover from the effects of drink/drugs? This negates your earlier comment about having all the evidence… Obviously if it’s acceptable to arrest another driver after a fatal accident to preserve evidence, then why is it NOT necessary to do the same for a police officer? It won’t be the first time a copper might have been driving without due care and attention!
Perhaps I wasn’t very clear in my reply. No a police officer in this instance would not be permitted to leave the scene, and would be breathalzed and supervised of course. They would not necessarily be arrested as their duty would be to co-operate with the investigation. they would be ordered to follow certain procedures, this is different from a civilian who is not required to give any information unless they are under caution, may leave the scene or damage potential evidence.
EastAnglianTrucker:
Why do you think being arrested is not an issue? It certainly is for me, even if it isn’t for you! If it’s not an issue, then why is the police officer in similar circumstances, not arrested as I would be? What is the difference between any ordinary citizen and a police officer in these circumstances!
Being arrested is not an issue for me, I have been arrested several times myself for routine matters of information gathering. The difference between a civilian and a police officer is as I have stated above, a police officer will have to follow the orders of their superior/senior officer. They will be detained for the purposes of the investigation but this need not be by arrest.
EastAnglianTrucker:
This is complete bulls**t for the reasons stated above! Would a police driver be breathalysed at the scene? Or checked for drugs? And who is to say that what he says, is the truth? The police are not any different to any ordinary citizen, and I can’t see why the law should be applied differently to different sections of society, unless we really have become a totalitarian state! And I see no difficulty in comparing a police driver and a truck driver in this matter!.
Yes as the driver of a vehicle involved in an RTC the police officer will be subject to the same checks as any other civilian, what I intended to convey is that the details of the driver such as name, address, driving licence etc will already be known, as will the complete details of speed, direction, road conditions by way of the black box and cameras recordings. For this reason again there is no need to “arrest” the officer, they are not going anywhere until told they may do so by their senior officer.
EastAnglianTrucker:
In fact, there are very good reasons why the law should act in exactly the same way for both. If only to re-assure the public that the law is being applied exactly the same to the police as it would be to a truck, bus or car driver, in similar circumstances!But Lofty83, it seems as if you not only have a strangely different opinion, but you appear to have inside information? And you still haven’t explained to me why you feel police officers should be treated any differently to any ordinary citizen in similar circumstances. Or indeed, explained why the law is interpreted in a different way for them.
I hope that I have answered your questions, A Police Officer will be subjected to the same roadside checks as any civilian and I quite agree that this is the correct procedure. However a Police Officer need not be arrested in order to ascertain the facts, they simply get instructed to co-operate, this may be by filing a report that will be reviewed along with the data from the vehicle.
A Civilian is not required to give information unless under caution i.e Arrested, it is a matter of procedure to ensure that the information can be gathered, and that the information supplied is recorded in the prescribed manner laid out in the police procedures.
I have spent the past 4 years working as a civil servant with all the powers of a police constable, I have been trained by the police for information gathering, Preservation of Evidence, Crime scene preservation, amongst other things.
I am by no means an expert but I am aware of the internal processes in place and the independent bodies that oversee these issues.
I do not disagree with you that involved parties should be treated the same regardless of position, I only mean to explain what I know of the processes that are used. I do not wish to argue either, I will agree that there are some practices that are ridiculous, some powers that are abused, and there are staff/officers that are corrupt. Im just sharing what I know.
Lofty
Never, ever ACCEPT a caution either! 
Fatboy slimslow:
Never, ever ACCEPT a caution either!
look at the blue star! 
ACAB
Like it or not, if you, a trucker, kills a cyclist in a collision, then it’s not so much if you get arrested or not, but the aftermath: You are very likely to get a CD80 endorsement on your licence, worse for your record than DD or DR.
Why? - Because for you NOT to get it, the investigation would have to prove that “cyclist died through their own stupid fault” which is a VERY rare outcome for an inquest. It’s all about proportioning blame. The deceased has already paid the ultimate price, so investigations sadly are going to take the biased form of “guilty until proven innocent” (or at least until “no supporting evidence is found”) regardless of what we think is right and wrong with British law.
I, for one, dislike the idea that someone could jump off a motorway bridge under my wheels, and hey-presto, not only do I get to lose my spotless accident record, but I get punished by endorsements, higher insurance premiums, harder to get jobs, pressure to take any old crap AS a job, etc etc.
Wouldn’t YOU feel hard done by if you were basically in the wrong place at the wrong time, as opposed to actually doing anything wrong? 
Road accidents destroy lives everyone knows sure, but if one of the parties involved is one of us, there’s usually hell to pay.
Dont know why some people keep going on about innocent untill proven guilty that has nothing to do wtih being arrested, being arrested has no connection to being treated as guilty, it is simply a way of carrying out further investigations, someone who has been arrested is still treated as compleatly innocent untill then are charged on reasonable grounds even then it has to go to court before they are proven guilty.
As said there is no reall reason to arrest a police officer he could still be breathalised and all his details are already logged on the system so he cant really go AWOL in the mean time like joe bloggs the truck driver can
Winseer:
I, for one, dislike the idea that someone could jump off a motorway bridge under my wheels, and hey-presto, not only do I get to lose my spotless accident record, but I get punished by endorsements, higher insurance premiums, harder to get jobs, pressure to take any old crap AS a job, etc etc.
You honnestly belive that you would be found guilty of someone jumped off a moterway bridge■■? 
Yes. The way I understood it, the poor fellow couldn’t get a job along with other offers that had dried up as a result of the CD80.
You see, he was breathalysed at the scene, no problems, 0mg, but tacho showed 13 hours into a shift with 5.5 hours continuous driving.
You can run over a cat with such data on your digicard, and guess what?..
Questions in Court: Were you beyond legal driving hours without a break, and tired?
Yes.
Did you run over Mr Smith in the middle of the road, who was still alive with a broken leg at that time?
Yes.
Do you think you might have pulled up in time had you been less tired?
Erm…
Were you flat out at 56mph on the 40mph limit road you were driving on?
Erm…
GUILTY of causing death by inconsiderate driving. 10 points on licence. CD80 endorsement. Next case please. 
(Then you try and keep your job, especially if you’re already on agency once you’ve got that black mark!)
Lofty83:
I do not disagree with you that involved parties should be treated the same regardless of position, I only mean to explain what I know of the processes that are used. I do not wish to argue either, I will agree that there are some practices that are ridiculous, some powers that are abused, and there are staff/officers that are corrupt. Im just sharing what I know.Lofty
Thank you Lofty for an informative post. I still can’t see why a police officer should not be arrested if a civilian would be. And I don’t believe that it’s justified because he has been ordered to answer an investigation by a senior officer. If I am arrested, I am ordered/expected to answer his questions… He then has the choice to ask further questions, and investigate further, if he has reasonable cause to think I am not telling him a truthful account of what occurred.
I appreciate you knowledge and contribution.
M1 Crash: Seven Hurt And Lorry Driver Arrested
uk.news.yahoo.com/driver-serious … 33366.html
Was no one else involved driving dangerously?
I’m sure if the Lorry driver had been the only one hurt/damaged, and everyone in cars totally unscathed, then the car drivers would be the ones looking at arrest…
Can you see where the systemic bias against us comes from hmm?
Winseer:
I’m sure if the Lorry driver had been the only one hurt/damaged, and everyone in cars totally unscathed, then the car drivers would be the ones looking at arrest…
Can you see where the systemic bias against us comes from hmm?
Anyone who the police belive to be at fault of causeing death or injury would be arrested, unfortunantly it does often seem to be the truck drivers, even just looking at the pictures it doesnt take a genious to work out whats probably happend and whose at fault
EastAnglianTrucker:
Would a police driver be breathalysed at the scene? Or checked for drugs? And who is to say that what he says, is the truth? The police are not any different to any ordinary citizen, and I can’t see why the law should be applied differently to different sections of society, unless we really have become a totalitarian state! And I see no difficulty in comparing a police driver and a truck driver in this matter!
In truth, a police driver is more likely to be breath tested after a collision than any truck driver. For at least the last 30 years all UK police forces have made it policy that all collisions involving their vehicles will be investigated and that a supervisory officer will attend the scene and oversee the investigation. In addition - and this may not go back 30 years, but certainly goes back 20 or more - there is a general policy in all forces that all drivers involved in police vehicle collisions are breath tested. So whereas you or I could quite legally stop at the scene and exchange particulars with the other drivers, with no police involvement (and therefore no breath test), that is simply not an option for an on-duty copper. Most forces have similar broad-brush policies in respect of off-duty officers in their own cars as well.