No more new smart motorways

[robroy]

switchlogic:

robroy:

switchlogic:
Some words I did speak on the subject of #SmartMotorways recently > TikTok - Make Your Day

Watched it Luke…
What are your opinions on trucks broke down on the hard shoulder in terms of what the driver does…not necessarily a smart M/way btw.

In a car, I get it,… get tf as far away and as fast as you can,…
But me personally in a truck, I have always took waiting for, say tyre assistance, as an opportunity to have a lay down on the bunk or a sit in the passenger side playing on my phone or to relax with a coffee or something .
I’ve seen artic drivers stood on the bank in the ■■■■■■■ rain and I think …Why?

Also getting pulled by the Old Bill and being asked to sit in the back of a patrol car.
I ain’t been pulled for a while now (oo er Mrs ) but if I was I would be (extremely politely) telling them I would not feel comfortable being sat in the back if their car with all the vulnerability that would bring, and suggest coming off at next slip road, it would maybe ■■■■ them off slightly, but a much better option than dying .

Rare to see police pulling people on to the hard shoulder these days. But frankly I’d get out of any vehicle. Rain or shine

Ok, but all this hard shoulder stuff just got me thinking…(I’m obviously having a non eventful.Sunday btw. )
What reminded me was watching one of those Traffic Police reality shows.
They run campaigns to educate people to leave their cars on the h/s, then they get drivers to sit in the back of their car when they pull.them over.

As for being in a truck…I don’t overnight in lay bys, but I can not see the difference between spending your waiting time during breakdown in your bunk,.and overnighting on the edge of a busy trunk road in terms of potentially getting hit.
I would reckon the trailer would absorb much of any impact.

Anyhoo I’ll continue to take my chances if and when I next break down, relaxing rather than standing freezing off my plums.

[stu675]

the maoster:
I quite like hard shoulder running. I came onto the M1 at J13 s/b the other day and as I came down the slip I noticed the matrix showing a 60mph limit but also that the hard shoulder was in use as a running lane. I ran down the h/s like a member of the Politburo as about the only vehicle on it while the rest of them bunched and repeatedly braked in lanes two, three and four. It was satisfying.

How many people did you kill?
Surely it’s not safe if there’s no hard shoulder■■? [emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji23]

It’s great isn’t it [emoji1]

[stu675]

toonsy:
, but would they be more useful saying something like ‘next SOS in 1/2 mile’ or ‘in emergency use refuge’ or similar? Yes I get the information is there already, if you know where to look (on the marker bollards) and which signs to look for (the ones specifically about refuges) but having it in bright lettering might help.

I .

There’s millions of these signs already!

[stu675]

toonsy:
. Remember this is while we have the highest tax burden in a generation

That’s got one single reason, which is the choice of lockdowns.

[stu675]

Franglais:

switchlogic:
I personally think it’s bad driving that’s the problem not bad motorways. That and fact media seemed to over exaggerate the incidents

In one sense that is a self evident truth: if there were only good drivers we would never have any accidents.
However we don`t have only good drivers, as we all know.

Well designed roads take account of that. Badly designed roads dont. Badly designed roads dont cause accidents, but well designed ones can mitigate the bad drivers we will always have.

Yes, you`re right that it is bad driving that causes accidents, and that must be addressed, but poor road design is something else we can improve.

Not sure I agree [emoji23]

You have a mix of roads, there will always be more safe and more dangerous roads. The more you make dangerous roads safer, the more the public will switch off and make them dangerous again.
If they made all roads and all cars more dangerous there might be less accidents. Start by replacing steering wheel airbags with large spikes [emoji48]

[switchlogic]

robroy:

switchlogic:

robroy:

switchlogic:
Some words I did speak on the subject of #SmartMotorways recently > TikTok - Make Your Day

Watched it Luke…
What are your opinions on trucks broke down on the hard shoulder in terms of what the driver does…not necessarily a smart M/way btw.

In a car, I get it,… get tf as far away and as fast as you can,…
But me personally in a truck, I have always took waiting for, say tyre assistance, as an opportunity to have a lay down on the bunk or a sit in the passenger side playing on my phone or to relax with a coffee or something .
I’ve seen artic drivers stood on the bank in the ■■■■■■■ rain and I think …Why?

Also getting pulled by the Old Bill and being asked to sit in the back of a patrol car.
I ain’t been pulled for a while now (oo er Mrs ) but if I was I would be (extremely politely) telling them I would not feel comfortable being sat in the back if their car with all the vulnerability that would bring, and suggest coming off at next slip road, it would maybe ■■■■ them off slightly, but a much better option than dying .

Rare to see police pulling people on to the hard shoulder these days. But frankly I’d get out of any vehicle. Rain or shine

Ok, but all this hard shoulder stuff just got me thinking…(I’m obviously having a non eventful.Sunday btw. )
What reminded me was watching one of those Traffic Police reality shows.
They run campaigns to educate people to leave their cars on the h/s, then they get drivers to sit in the back of their car when they pull.them over.

As for being in a truck…I don’t overnight in lay bys, but I can not see the difference between spending your waiting time during breakdown in your bunk,.and overnighting on the edge of a busy trunk road in terms of potentially getting hit.
I would reckon the trailer would absorb much of any impact.

Anyhoo I’ll continue to take my chances if and when I next break down, relaxing rather than standing freezing off my plums.

I’ve never slept in a layby without a divider

[macski]

Surely there is a difference between the original smart motorways that use the hard shoulder as a temp running lane when it is busy and these later cost cutting smart motorways where the hard shoulder is used all the time.

However now the government has accepted smart motorways are dangerous will we see the current lot being turned back into standard motorways?

[robroy]

As somebody said on tv,.the Govt may have shot themselves in the foot with their ''We,ve decided they are dangerous after all ‘’ b/s to mask the real reasons.
Next time somebody comes a cropper, and you get somebidy like that widow gobbing off, they will have a much better case to sue,.as it has been ‘‘admitted’’ that basically the road layout is not fit for purpose by being ‘‘dangerous’’.

Serves the ■■■■ s right for not being entirely straight on the reasons in order to save face and look good.

[yourhavingalarf]

Short sighted…

Transport policy. In similar fashion to the M42 only being two lanes, the Peterborough to Boston road being single carriageway, Newark’s comedy of errors twin roundabout set up, the A1 around Doncaster and up to Ferrybridge.

I’m sure you all have your favourites too.

[juddian]

stu675:

toonsy:
, but would they be more useful saying something like ‘next SOS in 1/2 mile’ or ‘in emergency use refuge’ or similar? Yes I get the information is there already, if you know where to look (on the marker bollards) and which signs to look for (the ones specifically about refuges) but having it in bright lettering might help.

I .

There’s millions of these signs already!

Its not that there’s no signs, but, you’re in your car possibly with other people and its dying rapidly possibly a puncture or gradually spluttering before conking out, in reality that scene in the pic isn’t what you find, which is a wall of lorries in both ns lanes in front and you’ve hopefully managed to get yourself over to the left lane but daren’t slow up too much losing precious momentum hoping to make the refuge and the bod in the truck behind is jammed right up your arse already annoyed because he can’t think why you’ve ‘‘cut him up’’, you can’t see a bloody thing and have no clue where the refuge might be.

This is how its more likely to be

Only last week i spotted a bloke with his head screwed on right, he found a section of level grass to the left hand side with no armco and managed to get his car onto that before it pegged out, well done him, i’ve instilled in my loved ones to get off the road if at all possible, don’t worry about getting stuck in the grass/mud the breakdown lads will sort that out, better a bill from them than the too possible alternatives.

I’ve always thought that hard shoulder running should not have been allowed in the dark on unlit sections or in heavy fog, with good visibility and well lit sections all lane running is not a problem.

[franglais]

Juddian:

stu675:

toonsy:
, but would they be more useful saying something like ‘next SOS in 1/2 mile’ or ‘in emergency use refuge’ or similar? Yes I get the information is there already, if you know where to look (on the marker bollards) and which signs to look for (the ones specifically about refuges) but having it in bright lettering might help.

I .

There’s millions of these signs already!

Its not that there’s no signs, but, you’re in your car possibly with other people and its dying rapidly possibly a puncture or gradually spluttering before conking out, in reality that scene in the pic isn’t what you find, which is a wall of lorries in both ns lanes in front and you’ve hopefully managed to get yourself over to the left lane but daren’t slow up too much losing precious momentum hoping to make the refuge and the bod in the truck behind is jammed right up your arse already annoyed because he can’t think why you’ve ‘‘cut him up’’, you can’t see a bloody thing and have no clue where the refuge might be.

Only last week i spotted a bloke with his head screwed on right, he found a section of level grass to the left hand side with no armco and managed to get his car onto that before it pegged out, well done him, i’ve instilled in my loved ones to get off the road if at all possible, don’t worry about getting stuck in the grass/mud the breakdown lads will sort that out, better a bill from them than the too possible alternatives.

I’ve always thought that hard shoulder running should not have been allowed in the dark on unlit sections or in heavy fog, with good visibility and well lit sections all lane running is not a problem.

Opening a hard shoulder to ease already slow running traffic? Not a problem, is it?
All lane running to shave a second or two off free running traffic? Why? Not worth the risk IMHO.
What we have had built, was not what was trialed & approved

[rambo19]

IIRC, before smart m/ways, more people died on the hard shoulder than in lanes 1/2/3.

[franglais]

rambo19:
IIRC, before smart m/ways, more people died on the hard shoulder than in lanes 1/2/3.

Yep, probably true.

But is that a good comparison?
The question is nearer, are more dying now on lane 1 of all lane running, than used to die on the HS?

[edd1974]

Arnt they now know as digital roads?
Or are they something completely different

[ets]

ok now to make the roads even safer change speed limits from 70 to 50, from 60 to 40 and from 50 to 35 this will surely save even more lives?

I’m not a fan of smart aka part time motorways btw just the logic behind the ‘ban’ seems rather…bemusing to me

[winseer]

It isn’t the smart motorways themselves, new or old Hard Shoulder that causes the most problems here…

It is the Sudden changing over from “Live” to “Off Peak” usage of these things.

As I’ve stated before, I try and stay in Lane 2 when driving along a stretch that has a now-open hard shoulder as the temporary Live Lane One…

Upon going around the next corner, I now am already in the right place to not just miss the broken down vehicle in lane one, but also shut out anyone behind me from suddenly pulling past me just as I need to check-up and pull out of Lane one into lane two to get around myself, “at the last moment”.

F… that kind of stress… Easier to just stay in lane two for the stretch as long as it lasts, for me mostly between J11 and J14 on the M1, where the lane drops, and comes back several times along that stretch…

If you get the gantry signs suddenly come on, you also run the risk of running under a red ‘x’ or even going through a 40/50 temporary speed limit at 56 on the limiter, which (of course…) super-sensetive flashing cameras and the fine in the post that goes with it…

I also don’t undertake, stick to the gantry speed limits without sharply braking to achieve them, and STILL I cannot idiots coming up my inside at speed, and cutting in right where the lane cutoff/drop or even the broken down vehicle is…

Then there’s the aspect of “Pouring down with rain” which makes for poor visibility, and a relucatance of occuptants of a broken down vehicle to alight and stand behind the crash barrier as they really need to be doing…

‘Smart’ motorways: The human price of ‘smart’ motorways

Whoever decided to NOT build an extra lane out of side-lining fields and wasteland - needs to be put in the dock for the decision that has already cost so many lives.
…Alongside whomever made the decision to rob a third of our pension funds, quadruple our energy payments, six-times up our mortgages, and then tell the NHS workers “Nope. No deal. No Offer. Nowt.”

This country is broken - because BOTH Labour and Tories have bloody well broken it, and kept it broken.
It’s not even a “Conspiracy” any longer that they’ve both done that. It’s History by this point.

[robroy]

^^^^^^^
As I said,.the clowns who can’t OR WON’T use them properly is the problem, not the design of the road.
So do you also hog lane 2 on a 3 lane d/c also.
I know the answer btw,.the question was rhetorical,.I’m STILL.laughing at your dramatic and famous description of your truck as your… ‘‘Instrument of death’’ the other time we had this conversation.
As for looking out for broken down vehicles… do.the aerials on your ‘‘Captain Winseer Tin Foil hat’’ , not pick them up like a radar system??

[andrejs]

They stop build smsrtmotorway not because this us danger.But I think more who no money in budget after Brexit,Covid.

[switchlogic]

Instrument of death is one I shall be using. Off to buy www.instrument-of-death.com

[winseer]

robroy:
^^^^^^^
As I said,.the clowns who can’t OR WON’T use them properly is the problem, not the design of the road.
So do you also hog lane 2 on a 3 lane d/c also.
I know the answer btw,.the question was rhetorical,.I’m STILL.laughing at your dramatic and famous description of your truck as your… ‘‘Instrument of death’’ the other time we had this conversation.
As for looking out for broken down vehicles… do.the aerials on your ‘‘Captain Winseer Tin Foil hat’’ , not pick them up like a radar system??

You shoud argue like that in the Guns debate going on around America…

“It’s not guns that kill people, but deranged TS lefties that have run out of Lithium-based medication - that do”…

It might make a lot less people vote Democrat that way, making future elections less easy to steal within the accepted 4% margin of error easily obtainable (currently) from missing ballot boxes, multiple voting permitted for blue incumbents, et al.

Ps. The only thing dead about the #instrument of death# site below - is the link.

“Using Smart Motorways Properly” amounts to “Not using them at ALL” as the smartest move available, as far as I’m concerned.

If I were to make a Tin-Hatted “Conspiracy Theory” out of it all (as you’d have it) - I’d argue that “I’ll not have silly people committing suicide in front of my truck, just to fiddle me out of my clean licence!”…