Funnily enough, I don’t think it does - well it doesn’t say so, so one has to assume it is anything to do with cpc (as it says), be it initial or periodic. Presumably commonsense will prevail - or it will have to be tested in law by VOSA bringing a prosecution (thats if they take the time to find anyone doing it, or can be bothered).
The other way would be for someone in authority to give a written definition.
I’ve just looked in the VOSA regs guide and at the side of the derogation there is a note saying -
Includes instruction for renewal of Driver Certificate of Professional Competence (CPC) which is interesting as an Intial one would not need renewing so that must mean Periodic.
Periodic training of any kind must be approved by JAUPT.
Includes
Doesn’t say ‘only’.
delboytwo:
I remember having a refresher course when i worked for White Arrow,it was in house and the assessor was DSA registered from a training school and cos in was done in house all duties had to be booked as driving and other work even the assessor had to have a tacho in cos it was not his truck.
That is correct…because it is not a private training company.
I should point out that where the EU regs are concerned and the LGV being over 7.5 tonnes, being privately taxed or not makes no difference.
It’s the EU regs training exemptions that matter for training vehicles.
The same exemptions would apply to a training vehicle that is fully taxed as many are for dual purposes - maybe a delivery run on nights and used as a training vehicle during the day…
instructorone:
delboytwo:
I remember having a refresher course when i worked for White Arrow,it was in house and the assessor was DSA registered from a training school and cos in was done in house all duties had to be booked as driving and other work even the assessor had to have a tacho in cos it was not his truck.That is correct…because it is not a private training company.
My view on this is that even if the course was entirely done by a private training company then a full licence holder would not be exempt if it was a refresher course and being not be done for the driver cpc.
It is Not a requirement by law to do the 1 or 2 days refresher with a tachograph in use at that time.
The driver would be under W.T.D. if working upto, including and beyond the refresher course if he is driving, or doing other work. He would have to produce his last 28 days records of all work he has undertaken. If the refresher course was involved in the 28 days records, it can be manually entered onto the back of a tacho/printout. If stopped by Vosa during the 28 days following his refresher he would not be done if he only had a manual record for those days he were taking his refresher. They are his records, not the training company’s, so the training company is not held responsible if that driver has not kept his records upto date…A good training company would advise the driver to keep a manual record of those hours/breaks spent on the 1/2 days retraining, but that is as far as a private training company’s responsibilities go.
instructorone:
It is Not a requirement by law to do the 1 or 2 days refresher with a tachograph in use at that time.
If you have info that is opposite to that given by VOSA in the first post in this thread then feel free to post it along with the info source 
According to VOSA in the first post -
If a full licence holder is doing refresher training with a LGV training school - The driver & the school must comply with the LAW
If the law is not adhered to and an incident occured, whether the drivers fault or not, then the insurance will be void and a potential prosecution from VOSA may ensue.
If the training school wishes to take the chance and not comply that is one thing but what about the poor driver if something occured 
ROG:
instructorone:
It is Not a requirement by law to do the 1 or 2 days refresher with a tachograph in use at that time.If you have info that is opposite to that given by VOSA in the first post in this thread then feel free to post it along with the info source
According to VOSA in the first post -
If a full licence holder is doing refresher training with a LGV training school - The driver & the school must comply with the LAW
If the law is not adhered to and an incident occured, whether the drivers fault or not, then the insurance will be void and a potential prosecution from VOSA may ensue.
If the training school wishes to take the chance and not comply that is one thing but what about the poor driver if something occured
If you have info that is opposite to that given by vosa
I have! Still from VOSA, but not someone at the end of the phone…someone with hands on…and very active…i cant give the source but he is very high up the ladder. I’m sorry, i cant say any more than that. If admin wish to pm me for my source i am willing to disclose it to them but i don’t wish to make it public.
instructorone:
I have! Still from VOSA, but not someone at the end of the phone…someone with hands on…and very active…i cant give the source but he is very high up the ladder. I’m sorry, i cant say any more than that. If admin wish to pm me for my source i am willing to disclose it to them but i don’t wish to make it public.
PM sent to you
Received, replied and one sent to site admin. 
E-Mail from VOSA -
Date: Friday, May 29, 2009 1:44 PM
From: Richard.Francis@vosa.gov.uk
To: removed
Subject: Tachograph Exemptions
Size: 5 KBRoger,
Thank you for your enquiry today.
I can confirm that under EU rules (Regulation (EC) 561/2006), an exemption
to using tachograph recording equipment is applicable to vehicles used for
driving instruction and examination with a view to obtaining a driving
license or a certificate of professional competence, provided that they are
not being used for the commercial carriage of goods or passengers.The exemption does not cover refresher training for drivers not
in relation to either of the above conditions. Furthermore, because the
driver should be using a tachograph record sheet on these occasions, the
recording equipment must be operating correctly and be in date for both the
six yearly calibration and two yearly check.Regards,
Richard Francis
Area 10 Traffic Examiner.
0117 9662855 - option 2
I hope that settles any concerns - unless someone can produce evidence to back an alternative definition…
… certificate of professional competence courses -
2007 No. 605
ROAD TRAFFIC
The Vehicle Drivers (Certificates of Professional Competence)
Regulations 2007
Persons providing periodic training courses6.–(1) A person who wishes to provide periodic training courses must make a written application to the competent authority and shall pay to it a fee of–
(a) £1,500, and
(b) £250 for each proposed course.
(2) Such application must be accompanied by the documents specified in Section 5.1 of Annex I to the Directive and such other documents as the competent authority may reasonably require.
(3) The competent authority may approve in writing –
(a) that person to provide periodic training courses subject to the conditions specified in Section 5.2 of Annex I to the Directive, including the last two paragraphs of that Section;
and
(b) each periodic training course which that person wishes to provide.
(4) The competent authority’s approval shall be valid for –
(a) five years under paragraph (3)(a), and
(b) one year under paragraph (3)(b).
(5) If it appears to the competent authority that any of the conditions of the approval of a person are not being complied with, the competent authority may send notice to that person that it is minded to withdraw or suspend its approval under paragraph (3)(a).
(6) Upon receiving a notice under paragraph (5), that person may make representations to the competent authority within 28 days.
(7) The competent authority shall take those representations into account and send notice to the person informing him whether or not its approval is withdrawn or suspended.
(8) A person approved under paragraph (3)(a) who wishes to provide a training course which has not been approved by the competent authority may at any time request that authority’s approval for that course and shall pay to that authority a fee of £250.
(9) If the competent authority gives approval in response to a request under paragraph (8), that approval shall be valid for one year.
(10) A person to whom these Regulations apply may take a periodic training course approved under this regulation if that person is–
(a) a national of a member State and normally resident in the United Kingdom, or
(b) a national of a third country and authorised to work in the United Kingdom.
Having read your post Roger, just to confirm the legislation written in relation to persons with a valid full lgv entitlement who is unemployed/not working and not involved with the carriage of goods and reward IS exempt under the above regulations…and is not required to use the tachograph at that time.
For a person with a valid full Lgv entitlement who IS employed is required to keep a record of his activities.
Speaking from experience, when a company asks for a refresher course for X amount of drivers, the company’s vehicles are used (Not the private training vehicle) and records must then be kept.
From the mouth of a “Senior Traffic Inspectorate”
i would like to say something about this
i have had a few assessments as i am unemployed and all the time i have had to use a tachograph as there needed that tachograph for the mileage that the truck as run,and some assessments were done by training schools in there trucks and i still had to use a tachograph. to prove that i had done the assessment and that i new how to fill one it right,and use the mode switch right as it was part of the assessment
IMO if you are on an assessment there are assessing your ability to do the job right and IMO filling in a tachograph and knowing how to use one would be a must on a assessment
i have had to to show tell fill out check sheets on assessments and fill in tachograph’s i don’t think i can remember the last time i did not after do one expert on my training for my class LGV’s
instructorone:
Having read your post Roger, just to confirm the legislation written in relation to persons with a valid full lgv entitlement who is unemployed/not working and not involved with the carriage of goods and reward IS exempt under the above regulations…and is not required to use the tachograph at that time.From the mouth of a “Senior Traffic Inspectorate”
having read this bit you wrote would that be if there do not have to use a tachograph would that not open the door for vosa to go in and ask where is the missing mileage of the truck the used for the assessments and if a firm did let say 20 unemployed drivers then the mileage would be high in the truck there used and in theory have no record of that said mileage, and if this man that said this would in fact be the one that would do the said company for not keeping records
operators have to account for all mileage of there trucks and the best way is the tachograph
delboytwo:
i would like to say something about thisi have had a few assessments as i am unemployed and all the time i have had to use a tachograph as there needed that tachograph for the mileage that the truck as run,and some assessments were done by training schools in there trucks and i still had to use a tachograph. to prove that i had done the assessment and that i new how to fill one it right,and use the mode switch right as it was part of the assessment
IMO if you are on an assessment there are assessing your ability to do the job right and IMO filling in a tachograph and knowing how to use one would be a must on a assessment
i have had to to show tell fill out check sheets on assessments and fill in tachograph’s i don’t think i can remember the last time i did not after do one expert on my training for my class LGV’s
i have had a few assessments as i am *unemployed [/b]*and all the time i have had to use a tachograph as there needed that tachograph for the mileage that the truck as run,and some assessments were done by training schools in there trucks and i still had to use a tachograph. to prove that i had done the assessment and that i new how to fill one it right,and use the mode switch right as it was part of the assessment
[/quote]
Needed!!? But not required by law,
> IMO if you are on an assessment they are assessing your abiliy to do the job right and IMO filling in a tachograph and knowing how to use one would be a must on an assessment.
> Would be a mustBut isn’t. And we are not talking about assesments. A Company must record all activities with its vehicles. I.E on an assessment for the very reasons you have just mentioned delboy, (I have edited this post as it was posted at the same time as yours and it answers some of your questions twice)
A training school can use a tachograph to teach a driver how to use one, and to show that the trainee did in fact spend some time with them, but thats all.
instructorone:
Having read your post Roger, just to confirm the legislation written in relation to persons with a valid full lgv entitlement who is unemployed/not working and not involved with the carriage of goods and reward IS exempt under the above regulations…and is not required to use the tachograph at that time.For a person with a valid full Lgv entitlement who IS employed is required to keep a record of his activities.
Speaking from experience, when a company asks for a refresher course for X amount of drivers, the company’s vehicles are used (Not the private training vehicle) and records must then be kept.From the mouth of a “Senior Traffic Inspectorate”
Where in the regulations does it say anything about the driver being employed or unemployed
If you have a source of information then invite that source to e-mail you with their definition and ask permission of that source to post it on here as I did.
I think it was Smart Mart who questioned my ‘word of mouth’ source and rightly so as it could be seen as MMTM 
If a C driver is using an empty company artic for the purpose of learning only (not going empty to a pick up etc) then they are exempt from the regs.
A CE driver using an empty company artic for doing a JAUPT/DSA Periodic Driver CPC approved SAFED course of training would also be EU regs exempt with the usual restrictions (not going empty to a pick up etc).
In both of the above, the company will usually like the tacho to be used so as not having to explain any ‘missing’ mileage but it is not a legal requirement.
VOSA will except an explanation of any missing mileage in the above circumstances and they can check it out if they wish to.
instructorone:
But isn’t. And we are not talking about assesments. A Company must record all activities with its vehicles. I.E on an assessment for the very reasons you have just mentioned delboy,
A training school can use a tachograph to teach a driver how to use one, and to show that the trainee did in fact spend some time with them, but thats all.
Full LGV licence holders doing an assessment by a company with a view to employment are not exempt EU regs whether in a company truck or a LGV school training truck.
The same applies to refresher training by either a company or a LGV training school.
There are no exemptions in either the 561/2006 regs or in the VOSA national rules for either of the above that I can find… maybe someone else can find one…