To answer the Comet / Super Comet question. The Leyland Comet originally introduced in 1948 was known as a medium weight lorry, this was in the days that lorries were built bin three distinct weight categories, namely lightweights such as Bedford, Austin, Morris, and some Albions etc. Then there was the medium weight category covered by AEC, Leyland, Albion, Guy, Dennis, Seddon, some ERFs, some Atkinsons, and some Fodens etc. The heavyweight category was the maximum gross weight 4, 6, and 8 wheelers plus artics made by AEC, Leyland, Albion, Scammell, Guy, ERF, Atkinson, Foden, Seddon etc.
The Super Comet was introduced in 1958 / 9 with the LAD cab, at the time ordinary Comets were for 12 tons gross weight as a rigid (artic versions varied according to spec) and Super Comets were for 14 tons gvw as a rigid. (There was also a 13 ton gvw Comet version). Ergo cabbed Super Comets were for 16 tons gvw as a rigid (24 tons gtw as an artic). There was also a non-tilting Ergo cab Comet listed at 14 tons gvw, but I don’t ever recall seeing one in service. Albion definitely offered its 16 ton gvw Clydesdale rigid with a fixed Ergo cab, and the Clydesdale was basically a Super Comet with an Albion badge. To complicate things further Clydesdales with the LAD cab could also be bought until about 1970, a considerable period of overlap with the Ergo cab range.
Leyland Ergo cab Super Comet O.400 engine, Leyland Beaver P.680 engine, the relevant numbers equating to the approximate engine cylinder capacity (swept volume) in cubic inches.
newmercman:
I always say that a Mandator with Ergo cab is one of my favourite looking lorries, but to be fair, the Leyland version with the narrower front arches is a much better looking lorry
Not often I agree with someone 100%, but this is 2012’s incidence of it!
Why did some of them have wider arches? They all seemed to have the same narrow-track front axle.
Well you learn something everyday, never knew that Dennis, non tilting Ergo whatever next, I was a mate on Banbury Buildings 1970 we had one Super Comet with a tilt cab a 1967 E Reg, and 4, F Reg Albion Clydesdales, they were all LAD cabs, we fought long and hard to get that Super Comet, not that it went any better that the Albions, it just had a heater that worked. Then in 1971 we got 5 new Lynxs.
Always preferred the wider arches myself, they didn’t dirty the mirrors so much.
newmercman:
Dennis, a two pedal Beaver driver would be easy to spot in a dance hall, he’d be going round in anticlockwise circles, the weak left peg would see to that
I always say that a Mandator with Ergo cab is one of my favourite looking lorries, but to be fair, the Leyland version with the narrower front arches is a much better looking lorry
I always thought the AEC version was the better looking of the two with the full width top grill and a blue triangle ,chrome bumper and chrome wheel trims ,i think they looked more finished off ,but not a patch on the mkv Park Royal cabbed mm8
newmercman:
I always say that a Mandator with Ergo cab is one of my favourite looking lorries, but to be fair, the Leyland version with the narrower front arches is a much better looking lorry
I always thought the AEC version was the better looking of the two with the full width top grill and a blue triangle ,chrome bumper and chrome wheel trims ,i think they looked more finished off ,but not a patch on the mkv Park Royal cabbed mm8
It takes all sorts- I always considered the Park Royal AECs to look old-fashioned, drab and miserable- like a bloodhound that has just had a kick up the backside. I still consider the Ergo to be a masterpiece of Modern design. I suppose it comes down to fashion- I first started to appreciate lorries in about 1970, when the Ergo was still the latest thing…
newmercman:
I always say that a Mandator with Ergo cab is one of my favourite looking lorries, but to be fair, the Leyland version with the narrower front arches is a much better looking lorry
I always thought the AEC version was the better looking of the two with the full width top grill and a blue triangle ,chrome bumper and chrome wheel trims ,i think they looked more finished off ,but not a patch on the mkv Park Royal cabbed mm8
It takes all sorts- I always considered the Park Royal AECs to look old-fashioned, drab and miserable- like a bloodhound that has just had a kick up the backside. I still consider the Ergo to be a masterpiece of Modern design. I suppose it comes down to fashion- I first started to appreciate lorries in about 1970, when the Ergo was still the latest thing…
The thing is i thought they both looked good but i wouldnt want to spend 13 hours a day in 1 now ,a bit like snow it looks good on christmas cards
I once saw a driver wearing ear defenders in an Ergo-cabbed Leyland Retriever. This was during the 1970s, long before H&S became an issue. Given that Leyland had the foresight to commission a study of ergonomics, to design the interior of the cab, one would have thought that a bit more sound insulation would have been an obvious addition. I guess it was no noisier than its contemporaries, at least the British-built ones. One of the drivers of the Park Royal AEC in the Astran book blames his tinnitus on that lorry.
[zb]
anorak:
I once saw a driver wearing ear defenders in an Ergo-cabbed Leyland Retriever. This was during the 1970s, long before H&S became an issue. Given that Leyland had the foresight to commission a study of ergonomics, to design the interior of the cab, one would have thought that a bit more sound insulation would have been an obvious addition. I guess it was no noisier than its contemporaries, at least the British-built ones. One of the drivers of the Park Royal AEC in the Astran book blames his tinnitus on that lorry.
I never understood why Leyland never tried to make downsized version of the Marathon a bit like Scania do with the the R ,G and P cabs
ramone:
I never understood why Leyland never tried to make downsized version of the Marathon a bit like Scania do with the the R ,G and P cabs
They did. The Buffalo, Lynx etc. had the original Ergo cab, but raised up a bit, and the Marathon had the same cab mounted higher still.
I never understood why the original Ergo was not mounted about a foot or more higher, like the Marathon, to compete with the other “premium” vehicles of the time (1963), like the Tip Top Volvo, DAF 2600 and Mercedes LP. Then I read that Lord Stokes had decided that it was not worth trying to export lorries to Europe, since they were capable of building their own. Hence, the Ergo was aimed squarely at the British market, in which it was, according to many posts on here, far superior to the competition. I will take this argument up with Stokes in Hell, when I get there. Having said that, the place has a pretty bad reputation- I’ll probably end up being shouted down by Carryfast, for eternity!
ramone:
I never understood why Leyland never tried to make downsized version of the Marathon a bit like Scania do with the the R ,G and P cabs
They did. The Buffalo, Lynx etc. had the original Ergo cab, but raised up a bit, and the Marathon had the same cab mounted higher still.
I never understood why the original Ergo was not mounted about a foot or more higher, like the Marathon, to compete with the other “premium” vehicles of the time (1963), like the Tip Top Volvo, DAF 2600 and Mercedes LP. Then I read that Lord Stokes had decided that it was not worth trying to export lorries to Europe, since they were capable of building their own. Hence, the Ergo was aimed squarely at the British market, in which it was, according to many posts on here, far superior to the competition. I will take this argument up with Stokes in Hell, when I get there. Having said that, the place has a pretty bad reputation- I’ll probably end up being shouted down by Carryfast, for eternity!
The Buffalo and Lynx had the original ergo layout and the high engine hump surely the Marathon cab could have been lowered but retaining the superior dash layout and noise levels
The Buffalo and Lynx didn’t have the original cab - they had the ‘high-datum’ version, which was raised a little higher than the original Ergomatic cab as featured on the Beaver, Badger, Super Comet, etc…
If you look at the wheel arches, there’s a fillet plate above them on the Buffalo, Bison, Lynx, which isn’t there on the original version.
Ramone, I see what you mean now. I suppose the dash could have been swapped for the Marathon one, and a bit of extra fluff stuffed into the engine cover. For the sake of a few pennies, it would have kept the Ergo competitive for longer. Given that the cab was mounted higher on these post-'71 models, they may have even been able to lower the engine cover a bit.
The Ergo cab was so disliked in Portugal, they used to buy chassis-cowls from Leyland, and fit Scania LB80 cabs to them. That is the extent they went to, to get the Leyland they wanted, so strong was Leyland’s reputation in Spain and Portugal.
marky:
The Buffalo and Lynx didn’t have the original cab - they had the ‘high-datum’ version, which was raised a little higher than the original Ergomatic cab as featured on the Beaver, Badger, Super Comet, etc…
If you look at the wheel arches, there’s a fillet plate above them on the Buffalo, Bison, Lynx, which isn’t there on the original version.
I did mention that, although not quite as eloquently.
[zb]
anorak:
Ramone, I see what you mean now. I suppose the dash could have been swapped for the Marathon one, and a bit of extra fluff stuffed into the engine cover. For the sake of a few pennies, it would have kept the Ergo competitive for longer. Given that the cab was mounted higher on these post-'71 models, they may have even been able to lower the engine cover a bit.
The Ergo cab was so disliked in Portugal, they used to buy chassis-cowls from Leyland, and fit Scania LB80 cabs to them. That is the extent they went to, to get the Leyland they wanted, so strong was Leyland’s reputation in Spain and Portugal.
marky:
The Buffalo and Lynx didn’t have the original cab - they had the ‘high-datum’ version, which was raised a little higher than the original Ergomatic cab as featured on the Beaver, Badger, Super Comet, etc…
If you look at the wheel arches, there’s a fillet plate above them on the Buffalo, Bison, Lynx, which isn’t there on the original version.
I did mention that, although not quite as eloquently.
Intersetingly Leyland never fitted the high datum brown trimmed cab to AECs i dont mean the V8 version ,maybe another attempt to try and steer buyers away from southall
Thanks all for your in-put, Gingerfold especially for such detail.
I remember the Leyland 400 engine being used in 45 seater Tiger chassis with manual box, and the 680 with semi box in 53 seaters.
My father had a Big J with the Leyland 400 and Eaton 2 speed axle at 16.? ton gvw. Wasn’t a bad motor.
Hi, Folks , Iremember John Sumers and sons ,Shotton Steel Works ,having 4 or 6 of them with tri axle trailors ,32 tons i think the only problem they had was when Grandfather rights came up ,The Drivers had to go on there Guy artics 2 days a week for 6 months to get there liecenes ,just a bit of usless info ,cheers Barry
I only ever remember 1 or possibly 2 that Pritchard Bros. Anglesey had.Never drove a 2 pedal lorry,but a fair few
Leopards,and a couple of Bristol RLs ,Gardner 180s(I think) with an electric shift.I remember that full throttle ‘racing’ gear changes with a coach was a definite no-no,as apparently it wore the clutch bands out.I can only imagine the effect that would have on a fully loaded 32 tonner.Perhaps that’s why it didn’t catch on?
Noise levels and Tinnitus, been there and done that, I have Tinnitus in my left ear, I’ve done more miles in LHD lorries than RHD and it’s a combination of having the window open to flick out my ash for all those years and more recently, the noise from the straight through exhaust throbbing away just inches from my ear on my Peterbilt, bloody nightmare
It’s a wonder I haven’t got it in my right ear too, spent my whole childhood with my head on the doghouse of Atkis, Fodens and AECs as I slept soundly
ESSO used the semi automatic beaver back in the sixties and seventies, my dad worked there, I can remember driving around Fleet services lorry park in my dads wagon in 1978 when I was 16 using the throttle to go and the dead man to stop, he eventually jumped back in as said there wouldn’t be any tyres left.
I eventually started at ESSO Stanwell in 1990 for a short time. Whilst there, the longer serving drivers used to recite tales of the big fire that occurred on the 01/04/67 at ESSO. There were a lot of Beavers at various stages of loading when the fire took hold and as the heat built up a number of the Beavers fired up and drove themselves across the yard and into the offices opposite the loading gantry’s.
It must have been a hell of a site seeing driverless Beavers in flames.
hi all,
some great information coming to light on this thread about these iconic motors .back in 2006 an ex boss of mine had found himself employed by shipping giant evergreen in south east asia.many years earlier this ex boss’ father had bought the two pedal i posted a picture of on page 1.during 2006 evergreen bought a large area of land and buildings for development,in either singapore or hong kong? when my ex boss was being shown around the building,in the corner were five new and unused right hand drive two pedal beavers in esso colours.wherever it was it was illegal to have left hand drive vehicles and esso had imported them and it would seem forgotten they were there.i believe they were all scrapped.
regards andrew.
.back in 2006 an ex boss of mine had found himself employed by shipping giant evergreen in south east asia.many years earlier this ex boss’ father had bought the two pedal i posted a picture of on page 1.during 2006 evergreen bought a large area of land and buildings for development,in either singapore or hong kong? when my ex boss was being shown around the building,in the corner were five new and unused right hand drive two pedal beavers in esso colours.wherever it was it was illegal to have left hand drive vehicles and esso had imported them and it would seem forgotten they were there.i believe they were all scrapped.