I had an original Buffalo new in 1973 and it was a flier!, no doubt it seemed more so as it replaced a Guy big J with a Gardner 180 running at 32 tons. The Buffalo had nearly another fifteen hundredweight of payload using the same trailer ( A PENCO [Peterborough Engineering Company] bulk tipper) collecting bulk coal products from midland and S Wales for delivery to Southampton area. At the time of getting the Buffalo the Abingdon bypass (A34) had just been completed and with the Big J it was not normally possable to exceed 45 mph on this new dual carrageway, 40 mph being the limit at the time, so speeding wasn’t an issue but one day with the Buffalo I was driving a la Gardner style, ie foot to the floor, when a police car pulled up alongside me and tooted his horn, to my surprise when I checked the speedo I was doing over 60 mph. In those days not all coppers were bar stewards so I quickly slowed down and the police car pulled in front of me for about two miles at 39 mph he then left at an intermediate exit with a bit of finger waving at me and I resolved to watch the speed of these flying Buffalo’s, for a day or two anyway.
Had an accident with that one in April 1974 near Oxford on the A34 wich resulted in it jackknifing and rolling, thanks to an oik from the USAF base at Upper Heyford, and I walked away from it so I have a bit of a soft spot for them. It still threw it’s dummy out of the pram a year later and snapped a crankshaft. 
The amount of well known fleets that ran them, they couldn’t have been that bad!
adr:
The amount of well known fleets that ran them, they couldn’t have been that bad!
Come on “adr” you cannot be serious !! The Buffalo was cheap,nasty and unreliable!! The one we had on a couple of weeks demo was universally hated by all the drivers that had a turn on it,what a load of crap they were!! But fair do’s whatever “floats your boat” but I don’t think the big firms that ran a few re-ordered any after their experiences with the first one or two !! Cheers Bewick.
Bewick:
adr:
The amount of well known fleets that ran them, they couldn’t have been that bad!Come on “adr” you cannot be serious !! The Buffalo was cheap,nasty and unreliable!! The one we had on a couple of weeks demo was universally hated by all the drivers that had a turn on it,what a load of crap they were!! But fair do’s whatever “floats your boat” but I don’t think the big firms that ran a few re-ordered any after their experiences with the first one or two !! Cheers Bewick.
Hi Bewick, I thought someone would come back at me for that one 
, couldn’t resist it! As you say though, whatever floats your boat, & having worked with them & driven them so many times through my apprenticeship etc I’m afraid I do have a soft spot for them. As you say, I think a lot of people, particularly the Oil companies bought them hoping they were another Mandator, sadly they soon found out they weren’t, but I always look at them & smile when I see them at the shows! The unreliable side could be true at times, so I can see it from your point of view cos I didn’t have to pay to put them right!
Regards Chris
This Buffalo blew up within 3 weeks of going on the road. At first it was said must be drivers fault, no doubt he was thrashing it said the boss. As we all found out it wasn’t the driver of course. Fixed under warranty. Round about 12 months later, just out of warranty, it blew again. Tough said Leyland it’s out of warranty, your problem you fix it.
All the fleet at this time were leylands of one sort or another. 20 or so vehicles, but Leyland were not interested. Some time later, not sure how long, it blew again.
Scrap it said the boss I’m not wasting any more money on it.
Guess what, they still carried on buying Leylands.
Ray
adr:
Bewick:
adr:
The amount of well known fleets that ran them, they couldn’t have been that bad!Come on “adr” you cannot be serious !! The Buffalo was cheap,nasty and unreliable!! The one we had on a couple of weeks demo was universally hated by all the drivers that had a turn on it,what a load of crap they were!! But fair do’s whatever “floats your boat” but I don’t think the big firms that ran a few re-ordered any after their experiences with the first one or two !! Cheers Bewick.
Hi Bewick, I thought someone would come back at me for that one
Regards Chris
Interesting comment on the oil companies there Adr ,so what was the big difference between the L12 Buffallo and the Mandator youre certainly right in that they didnt buy that many, Leyland even fit the L12 in the Marathon for the oil companies to no avail
Hi Bewick. The difference must just come down to reliability, the Ergomatic cab was the same wasn’t it, if anything there was a bit more space in the Buffalo cos the cab sat slightly higher up so had a lower engine cover, I personally thought the Mandator was a nicer drive from both comfort & driving style wise, the Buffalo was a more bouncy ride, & our 500 fixed-heads were a bit more frantic with the range-change box, they’d go but you had to chase them whipping the gears through up & down to keep them pulling, I found the Mandator was a more relaxed drive, knock it out of gear, pour out a cup of tea, light a ■■■ & slot her back in! The Marathon was a strange one with the Oil companies, it was really only Texaco that went for them, they seemed to decide that the Buffalo was a pile of crap hardly buying any of them, but steamed straight into the Marathon, buying virtually a whole fleet of them, & keeping on buying them!
Chris
adr:
Hi Bewick. The difference must just come down to reliability, the Ergomatic cab was the same wasn’t it, if anything there was a bit more space in the Buffalo cos the cab sat slightly higher up so had a lower engine cover, I personally thought the Mandator was a nicer drive from both comfort & driving style wise, the Buffalo was a more bouncy ride, & our 500 fixed-heads were a bit more frantic with the range-change box, they’d go but you had to chase them whipping the gears through up & down to keep them pulling, I found the Mandator was a more relaxed drive, knock it out of gear, pour out a cup of tea, light a ■■■ & slot her back in! The Marathon was a strange one with the Oil companies, it was really only Texaco that went for them, they seemed to decide that the Buffalo was a pile of crap hardly buying any of them, but steamed straight into the Marathon, buying virtually a whole fleet of them, & keeping on buying them!
Chris
Honestly “adr” I don’t think we should be wasting our time discussing these latter-day,crappy,Leyland products they truly were obnoxious peices of ■■■■■ !! I couldn’t have survived,let alone build up a haulage business if I’d had to depend on the mainline Leyland offerings!!! having said that,the two V8 Mastiffs at the start and the half a dozen Guy Big J’s in the 70’s did us a fair job,but the Ergos,Buffalos and Marathons No way it would have been suicide believe me !! Cheers Bewick.
I can see that you like many others weren’t a fan, but certainly as far as the Mandator/Mercury are concerned, why did they sell so many, particularly to the Oil companies, who had the money to buy whatever they liked? Mobil, Esso, Texaco, over the years they bought them certainly in their 100s if not 1000s between them, Oil companies with their obvious greed clearly wouldn’t want unreliable wagons that failed to deliver the fuel! The drivers at Oil companies, despite their huge Union power years ago didn’t really have that much say in what the companies bought, & as is well known the fuel drivers (my dad did 23 years on Mobil) were on such high money excellent working conditions etc, they were more inclined to put up with a plodder as there journey times etc weren’t as important. Take Spiers of Melksham, they worshipped AECs, kept them going as long as possible, buying up a lot of ex-Amoco Mandators to either run or use as donor’s! But as you say we all have our favourites, some firms today worship Scania 144 Toplines, someone else will have had 1 on demo or bought 1 & it’s been a rogue & they will tell you Scania’s are a pile of crap, that’s the joy of haulage!
Regards adr
Hiya “adr”,one of the reasons the ergo AEC and Leyland sold in numbers was when they were introduced,in the mid 60’s,there really wern’t any foreigners here(well hardly any) and the British hauliers and own account operators were still very loyal.As far as the Oil companies were concerned,from what I understand anyway, they were only interested in the basic of specs at the keenest price,and they always did up until they “outsourced” their distribution systems.The Oil cos. were never interested in either fuel economy or reliability as they always made mountains of profit and distribution costs were miniscule in the greater scheme of their respective worldwide operations! Well thats how it was explained to me by both Shell and BP excecutives.It is an acknowleged fact that the Oil cos. and to a lesser extent the Big Supermarkets kept Atki/Sed Atk,ERF and certainly Foden viable for a number of years with the massive orders they used to place,not much profit per unit but they contributed to the factory overheads. Cheers Bewick.
Bewick:
Hiya “adr”,one of the reasons the ergo AEC and Leyland sold in numbers was when they were introduced,in the mid 60’s,there really wern’t any foreigners here(well hardly any) and the British hauliers and own account operators were still very loyal.As far as the Oil companies were concerned,from what I understand anyway, they were only interested in the basic of specs at the keenest price,and they always did up until they “outsourced” their distribution systems.The Oil cos. were never interested in either fuel economy or reliability as they always made mountains of profit and distribution costs were miniscule in the greater scheme of their respective worldwide operations! Well thats how it was explained to me by both Shell and BP excecutives.It is an acknowleged fact that the Oil cos. and to a lesser extent the Big Supermarkets kept Atki/Sed Atk,ERF and certainly Foden viable for a number of years with the massive orders they used to place,not much profit per unit but they contributed to the factory overheads. Cheers Bewick.
Hi Bewick, that all makes sence, as you say it was mainly the big fleets that stayed Brit’ loyal, & certainly in the case of the Oil companies, they could stand the down-time of a un-reliable wagon!
Regards adr
adr:
Bewick:
Hiya “adr”,one of the reasons the ergo AEC and Leyland sold in numbers was when they were introduced,in the mid 60’s,there really wern’t any foreigners here(well hardly any) and the British hauliers and own account operators were still very loyal.As far as the Oil companies were concerned,from what I understand anyway, they were only interested in the basic of specs at the keenest price,and they always did up until they “outsourced” their distribution systems.The Oil cos. were never interested in either fuel economy or reliability as they always made mountains of profit and distribution costs were miniscule in the greater scheme of their respective worldwide operations! Well thats how it was explained to me by both Shell and BP excecutives.It is an acknowleged fact that the Oil cos. and to a lesser extent the Big Supermarkets kept Atki/Sed Atk,ERF and certainly Foden viable for a number of years with the massive orders they used to place,not much profit per unit but they contributed to the factory overheads. Cheers Bewick.Hi Bewick, that all makes sence, as you say it was mainly the big fleets that stayed Brit’ loyal, & certainly in the case of the Oil companies, they could stand the down-time of a un-reliable wagon!
Regards adr
I could be wrong here so correct me if i am but AECs were never cheap to buy so why didnt the oil cos go for say Seddons or Atkis or ERFs ,they stayed with AECs til the death
The list price of a standard spec Mandator ex-works was about £4,500 in 1972-3, just before rampant inflation kicked in under the Ted Heath government. Many of the own account fleets, not just the oil companies, but also such as Rank Hovis and Spillers Milling, both of whom I worked for in the 1970s and '80s were very loyal to British marques because most of the senior management were men who were getting on in years and had often served in World War Two, so they had an ingrained loyalty to all things British. Also, most fleet engineers I met then were time served men at somewhere like AEC, Leyland Motors etc. so their preference was to stay with what they were familiar with. Air Products was another typical example, ex-AEC men ran its fleet so AEC was the preferred choice.
When a Mandator was £4000 pound , a Volvo F86 was 3000 pound and the Volvo was paying back at each time on the fuel pump , room for a bunk , car comfort ect ,
Lilladan:
When a Mandator was £4000 pound , a Volvo F86 was 3000 pound and the Volvo was paying back at each time on the fuel pump , room for a bunk , car comfort ect ,
Evening Gentlemen, Lilladan…when you have access to the facts, then use them correctly, please do not interject with posts that lack factual evidence.
Admirable though the F86 was, (and I do have some personal experience), the final version of the Buffalo was not a bad machine, though sadly the earlier versions were proven at operators expense…both financial, and actual. Then of course the credibility went…bit like Volvo from the 240 88, to the botched "express " 290.
Cheerio for now.
Did they get power steering in the end ? took three years to slightly lower engine cover ! and only center of it, Mandator WAS much more expensive than 86 , and used more fuel , last AEC engines gave two years or 100000 miles like Volvo 290 , Buffalo NO power Steering ,no laminated screen , weak kabine in smash , bad in rain , no space , still better an Atkinson for driver at any rate , go and stop well , hard ride of course, still better an Atkinson or any Gardner boat engined heap 
heater worked in Leyland
Lilladan:
Buffalo NO power Steering
I never came across a buffalo without power steering ! we had lots of them over the years, early ones were troublesome with the 500, the L12 versions were reliable but hindered by the wide spaced 6 speed, the last versions with the TL11 with a fuller box were the best, quite reliable and gave a good payload.
flishflunk:
This Buffalo blew up within 3 weeks of going on the road. At first it was said must be drivers fault, no doubt he was thrashing it said the boss. As we all found out it wasn’t the driver of course. Fixed under warranty. Round about 12 months later, just out of warranty, it blew again. Tough said Leyland it’s out of warranty, your problem you fix it.
All the fleet at this time were leylands of one sort or another. 20 or so vehicles, but Leyland were not interested. Some time later, not sure how long, it blew again.
Scrap it said the boss I’m not wasting any more money on it.
Guess what, they still carried on buying Leylands.Ray
0
Ray was this Buffalo driven by a guy called Tom ,? Steve.
hey, Can someone tell me the difference between a Buffalo 32 tonner and a Beaver in 32 tons, or replaced the Buffalo the Beaver. Was the Beaver not the top range of Leyland,we knew them so in belgium as a top range but as a 38 tonner. Leyland must go bust as they had all types overlap each other,and then still have the same class with their other brands too as AEC,Albion,Guy and so on. Over here AEC was always the stronger, maybe it helped a bit that they were assembled here and were more geared to our market.
Of course you can say so did other as Volvo’sF86/88 both 38 tons scanies LB86/111and DAF’s 2200/2800-DO/2600 but you can’t compare that because of the different cab size.But with Leyland you see only the Ergo cab so not much difference.
Greetings Eric,
Trev_H:
Lilladan:
Buffalo NO power SteeringI never came across a buffalo without power steering ! we had lots of them over the years, early ones were troublesome with the 500, the L12 versions were reliable but hindered by the wide spaced 6 speed, the last versions with the TL11 with a fuller box were the best, quite reliable and gave a good payload.
Sorry to ■■■■ on your bonfire, Trev 
The company I worked for in the early eighties had a Buffalo with no power steering, fixed head 500 and a 10 speed Fuller. New in '72, she had 6 years with one driver then a few more with anyone at the wheel and never missed a beat! She was used a yard shunter for a few years after that and finally parked up at about 15 or 16 years old cos the tinworm got her. A couple of years after the boss wanted a clear out so got the scrapman in…we put a pair of batteries on the old girl and she burst into life, first piston up!
Apart from the steering, she was a wonderful machine. So easy to drive and quite comfortable, not to mention the lovely sound she made from the stack up the back of the cab… Cracking motor