Dolph:
. . . the whole idea of EU is Federal state, why British people don’t know that I have no idea, but it’s obvious.
I’ve stated it many times before and I’ll say it again; the only way the EU can work properly is as one state. ie one parliament, one financial institution, one currency, one border, one defence policy, no veto’s, no opt-out’s etc etc. If that’s what the rest of Europe wants then good luck to them, implement it, but as the maoster says it’s not what the British people were sold 40 years ago and it’s not what we want.
Spot on.But the problem is that puts us on a direct collision course with US Federalist ideology in which the US sees our membership of the scam as an essential component in maintaining that flawed undemocratic system of government.While on the same note it ( probably rightly ) sees any dissent against that Federalist position as a threat to the Federal status quo at home.IE we want out based on the issue sovereignty that then plants the question of Federalist v anti Federalist in Europe and then again in America.In all cases notice the total ignoring of any anti federalist view point wherever it arises as part of that.
Dolph:
Your whole mindset is not up to date is my opinion
Absolutely. But try changing it; suggest that the tax and benefit system should be completely overhauled . . . and then listen to every interested party crying because their particular part would be altered. Try suggesting that we must not only protect but aggressively increase our manufacturing base . . . and then listen to the cries of why the f should we when we can get it from China for next to nowt.
Suggest getting rid of the House of Lords - our un-elected second chamber with more members than the whole of the US Congress - and listen to the moans from sitting MP’s, terrified that their meal ticket is to be taken away.
We are an old fashioned country trying to keep our seat at the top table whilst clinging on to the history that binds us.
IF anyone comes up with the bright idea of palming off China with all the costs for everything - they can do so at any moment by “turning on the Printing Presses”…
If no one has noticed - the Pound Sterling has been artificially propped-up for some years now - by China.
If you print money into a propped-up market therefore - the currency doesn’t collapse in value, and we don’t go into Hyper-inflation either.
It’s a LOT cheaper than borrowing - even at <2% interest rates on the bonds we float - which China snaps up of course, each and every week with each and every fresh bond auction performed by Osbourne in the name of plugging the trade gap.
Winseer:
IF anyone comes up with the bright idea of palming off China with all the costs for everything - they can do so at any moment by “turning on the Printing Presses”…
If no one has noticed - the Pound Sterling has been artificially propped-up for some years now - by China.
If you print money into a propped-up market therefore - the currency doesn’t collapse in value, and we don’t go into Hyper-inflation either.
It’s a LOT cheaper than borrowing - even at <2% interest rates on the bonds we float - which China snaps up of course, each and every week with each and every fresh bond auction performed by Osbourne in the name of plugging the trade gap.
Until suddenly we’ve got the Chinese military sitting off our coast to call in the ‘debts’ we owe them.In the form of an offer we can’t refuse in the transfer of ownership of the freehold on uk real estate and farming/food supplies and ownership of uk employers.In which the uk labour force gets TUPE’d by Chinese employers at Chinese dictated labour rates.With Chinese government dictated rationing of housing and food at subsistence levels.
Dolph:
Why do you have low wage economy in first place, something Germany and France don’t have■■? And don’t use EE as scapegoats again. Why UK is subsidizing slave wages instead of abolishing them?
Stop putting UK with Germany and France, it is you who don’t want free movement of people, not France of Germany. Yes but France and Germany have a lot strict laws, regulations and benefit systems, you don’t. How many time we herd about illegals living and working in Germany or France and how many time in UK? Of course you will refuse Schengen, when someone enters EU they can go pretty much everywhere, but they can not work and live legally, hens the ID and mandatory council registration.
I have read stories where people could work 10-15hrs and live on benefits, or foreign patients who get non emergency medical procedures in NHS for the expense of the British tax payer or people buying alcohol with birth certificate.
Your whole mindset is not up to date is my opinion, you wouldn’t have the problems you have if you had followed French/German experience in protecting the labor force (with minimum wage, trade certificates and language skills); benefit system; healthcare system; id docs etc.
P.S. Why don’t you go to Spain or France and try claiming benefits?
hmmm …
sadly none of these problems that exist in britain will be/are solved by letting a bunch of ex soviets bums run wild in our country ruining everything that many generations have worked so hard to build .
the sooner we start controlling our borders , make decisions domestically , cherry pick our immigrants carefully , become self sufficient and rediscover our english identity …
boredwivdrivin:
the big problem with this upcoming referendum (if we ever are allowed to have it) is …
Scotland .
they are being allowed to vote on whether England wants to remain in EU !!.
this cannot be allowed to happen .
The really scary thing is that both the Scottish and English electorate are both gullible enough to not see the glaring inconsistency in an anti UK pro EU and anti EU pro UK stance in the case of the SNP and UKIP respectively.When both ‘Unions’ are each forms of equally bad Federalist institutions containing all the same undemocratic flaws of Federalism whenever and wherever that zb system of government,which tramples all over the right of national sovereignty and self determination,is allowed to take root.
Dolph:
Why do you have low wage economy in first place, something Germany and France don’t have■■? And don’t use EE as scapegoats again. Why UK is subsidizing slave wages instead of abolishing them?
Stop putting UK with Germany and France, it is you who don’t want free movement of people, not France of Germany. Yes but France and Germany have a lot strict laws, regulations and benefit systems, you don’t. How many time we herd about illegals living and working in Germany or France and how many time in UK? Of course you will refuse Schengen, when someone enters EU they can go pretty much everywhere, but they can not work and live legally, hens the ID and mandatory council registration.
I have read stories where people could work 10-15hrs and live on benefits, or foreign patients who get non emergency medical procedures in NHS for the expense of the British tax payer or people buying alcohol with birth certificate.
Your whole mindset is not up to date is my opinion, you wouldn’t have the problems you have if you had followed French/German experience in protecting the labor force (with minimum wage, trade certificates and language skills); benefit system; healthcare system; id docs etc.
P.S. Why don’t you go to Spain or France and try claiming benefits?
hmmm …
sadly none of these problems that exist in britain will be/are solved by letting a bunch of ex soviets bums run wild in our country ruining everything that many generations have worked so hard to build .
the sooner we start controlling our borders , make decisions domestically , cherry pick our immigrants carefully , become self sufficient and rediscover our english identity …
the better
You are a strange man, anti Scottish(anti UK) and anti Eastern European but pro English and pro Indian. Are you an English from Indian descent, just curious?
You are a strange man, anti Scottish(anti UK) and anti Eastern European but pro English and pro Indian. Are you an English from Indian descent, just curious?
English , been here since stone age .
Not strange at all . just consistant !
As CF points out , the anti english , pro EU SNP ( who inconsistantly voted to remain english bum boys) are the strange ones .
They seemed swayed by EU refusing to allow them membership if they succeeded .
And now effectively they hold the whip hand in our efforts to break up EU .
They should vote for wot they want , and ill vote for wot i want
Winseer:
IF anyone comes up with the bright idea of palming off China with all the costs for everything - they can do so at any moment by “turning on the Printing Presses”…
If no one has noticed - the Pound Sterling has been artificially propped-up for some years now - by China.
If you print money into a propped-up market therefore - the currency doesn’t collapse in value, and we don’t go into Hyper-inflation either.
It’s a LOT cheaper than borrowing - even at <2% interest rates on the bonds we float - which China snaps up of course, each and every week with each and every fresh bond auction performed by Osbourne in the name of plugging the trade gap.
Until suddenly we’ve got the Chinese military sitting off our coast to call in the ‘debts’ we owe them.In the form of an offer we can’t refuse in the transfer of ownership of the freehold on uk real estate and farming/food supplies and ownership of uk employers.In which the uk labour force gets TUPE’d by Chinese employers at Chinese dictated labour rates.With Chinese government dictated rationing of housing and food at subsistence levels.
THey can do all that right now, and at any time… Liabilities don’t cease or fail to happen in the first place - just because one has yet to take the piece of cheese out of the trap.
Oddly enough, this country raising interest rates would upset China as much as us printing a load of fresh fiat money. They’d probably ask us to refrain. That’s easy to do if one has merely “just turned a QE programme on” - but a LOT harder politically to apparently reverse a recent interest rate hike for “no apparent reason” as far as the public are concerned.
BillyHunt:
Ive taken a leaf out of your book and put in a link for you, odd you never picked this up on google, and it’s a couple of years old, just as you prefer. It explains in simple terms the types of veto we have, no mention of percentages though. Enjoy. independent.co.uk/news/world … 38345.html
Ironically I’ve actually posted that previously and I think it backs my comments more than yours.
You obviously mean the part that says we actually have three types of veto, as opposed to you saying we have none.
Many Brits are talking about border security while discussing EU migration and been able to control who comes and goes . Even if you are out of EU, how the hell you secure your border with that crappy system? Its astonishing in 21 century Britain 8 years after a terror attack to not have proper system.
Winseer:
IF anyone comes up with the bright idea of palming off China with all the costs for everything - they can do so at any moment by “turning on the Printing Presses”…
If no one has noticed - the Pound Sterling has been artificially propped-up for some years now - by China.
If you print money into a propped-up market therefore - the currency doesn’t collapse in value, and we don’t go into Hyper-inflation either.
It’s a LOT cheaper than borrowing - even at <2% interest rates on the bonds we float - which China snaps up of course, each and every week with each and every fresh bond auction performed by Osbourne in the name of plugging the trade gap.
Until suddenly we’ve got the Chinese military sitting off our coast to call in the ‘debts’ we owe them.In the form of an offer we can’t refuse in the transfer of ownership of the freehold on uk real estate and farming/food supplies and ownership of uk employers.In which the uk labour force gets TUPE’d by Chinese employers at Chinese dictated labour rates.With Chinese government dictated rationing of housing and food at subsistence levels.
THey can do all that right now, and at any time
You only have to look at the way the news media has taken on a Communist type propagandist line in everything that seems to fit the Chinese Party way to see that.
Ironically getting involved with that commy zb hole will probably be a similar type of mistake as Hoffa made in getting involved with the mob.It’s just that in this case we’re dealing with the national interest,not just a bit of aggro in the union and just the leader paying the ultimate price.
BillyHunt:
Ive taken a leaf out of your book and put in a link for you, odd you never picked this up on google, and it’s a couple of years old, just as you prefer. It explains in simple terms the types of veto we have, no mention of percentages though. Enjoy. independent.co.uk/news/world … 38345.html
Ironically I’ve actually posted that previously and I think it backs my comments more than yours.
You obviously mean the part that says we actually have three types of veto, as opposed to you saying we have none.
No I obviously meant the bit referring to none which you’ve selectively missed.While yes maybe ‘3 types of VETO’ but which at the end of the day only cover 20% of the decision making process which realistically is as bad as none.Everything else decided by majority vote among foreign elected MP’s.
Dolph:
You are a strange man, anti Scottish(anti UK) and anti Eastern European but pro English and pro Indian. Are you an English from Indian descent, just curious?
While I certainly don’t agree with his agenda which seems to be based on replacing East Euro free movement with Asian etc where do get the idea that being pro nationalist means being anti anything or anyone.You sound like a typical federalist who can’t,or more like doesn’t want to,get your head around the idea of friends with fences and self determination and local democracy which is the definition of nationalism.
The issue in this case being the total inconsistency in the so called ‘Nationalist’ SNP’s ideology in being anti Nationalist/pro Federalist EU.No surprise being that it is a Socialist Party masquerading as a Nationalist one when it suits it.
Carryfast:
While I certainly don’t agree with his agenda which seems to be based on replacing East Euro free movement with Asian etc
not so at all . i dont want free movement with anywhere .
i dont believe there is a requirement for any immigration for low skilled work .
where there is a need for highly skilled workers (medicine , software , engineering etc ) then commonwealth countries should be preferred .
ive pointed out that (for example) india produces 9 million graduates a year , it makes sense to cherry pick these . afterall we are second choice destination after US and indians understand our culture , language and identity . unlike our flipflop friends .
even enoch powell realised this and launched an immigration process to recruit nurses from west indies .
at present commonwealth is discriminated against in vain attempt to control immigration figures , as obviously the numbers cant be controlled from EU .
Carryfast:
While I certainly don’t agree with his agenda which seems to be based on replacing East Euro free movement with Asian etc
not so at all . i dont want free movement with anywhere .
i dont believe there is a requirement for any immigration for low skilled work .
where there is a need for highly skilled workers (medicine , software , engineering etc ) then commonwealth countries should be preferred .
ive pointed out that (for example) india produces 9 million graduates a year , it makes sense to cherry pick these . afterall we are second choice destination after US and indians understand our culture , language and identity . unlike our flipflop friends .
even enoch powell realised this and launched an immigration process to recruit nurses from west indies .
at present commonwealth is discriminated against in vain attempt to control immigration figures , as obviously the numbers cant be controlled from EU .
i find this highly offensive .
Well if you ever want to emigrate, I’m sure plenty of us here would support your application!
BillyHunt:
Ive taken a leaf out of your book and put in a link for you, odd you never picked this up on google, and it’s a couple of years old, just as you prefer. It explains in simple terms the types of veto we have, no mention of percentages though. Enjoy. independent.co.uk/news/world … 38345.html
Ironically I’ve actually posted that previously and I think it backs my comments more than yours.
You obviously mean the part that says we actually have three types of veto, as opposed to you saying we have none.
No I obviously meant the bit referring to none which you’ve selectively missed.While yes maybe ‘3 types of VETO’ but which at the end of the day only cover 20% of the decision making process which realistically is as bad as none.Everything else decided by majority vote among foreign elected MP’s.
There’s no “maybe” about it, it clearly states it in black & white, and at least one of those is a full 100% veto, making your statement wrong, as you well know it does. It’s just another case of you not liking something & trying t make it out to be worse than it is.
BillyHunt:
There’s no “maybe” about it, it clearly states it in black & white, and at least one of those is a full 100% veto, making your statement wrong, as you well know it does. It’s just another case of you not liking something & trying t make it out to be worse than it is.
oh no the veto man !!!
have you even read and understood your own link ■■?
how many times have we deployed this fantastic veto ■■?
what is the result of using roses covered veto ■■?
in what circumstances may it be used ■■?
and what makes you think politicians would ever use it ■■?
we have had veto since year dot . please provide evidence that it will secure our future ■■
also please provide details of when our EU ‘partners’ have used AGAINST us ■■
