midlifetrucker:
The brown envelope is very very prevalent. There is a lot of leeway. If an agency has just ten drivers doing 40 hours a week that generates probably about 1600 profit less expenses V lucrative
Dude, you’re going to have to give us a figure on what you think the expenses are!! You can’t just say 1600 profit less the expenses = v lucrative!!!
I did some I.t . Work for an unnamed agency when they started working from his front room. It is now massive and he is loaded. They worked hard to get a lot of contracts but he said a lot were obtained by “sweetners”
stevieboy308:
midlifetrucker:
The brown envelope is very very prevalent. There is a lot of leeway. If an agency has just ten drivers doing 40 hours a week that generates probably about 1600 profit less expenses V lucrativeDude, you’re going to have to give us a figure on what you think the expenses are!! You can’t just say 1600 profit less the expenses = v lucrative!!!
I can and I just did
Bottom line is you can drive without an agency they can’t work without you. However too many are bending over and taking it dans Lee pooper for a pittance.
Me, I work freelance and sell my own pooper to people I like and appreciate me and reward me appropriately.
thetastytrucker:
lolipop:
thetastytrucker:
Every topic seems to have the general opinion of agencies and the jobSo how can we as drivers become less dependent upon them and make employers realize there is an alternative ?
Maybe a website like ebay with drivers in set areas with customer feedback and a rating system and advertised rate etc etc
I cant see how a agency can charge £15 a hour for our services yet only pay us £10 as they are only advertising and then supplying our skills
A website like the above would also weed bad drivers out as reviews left by employers would state if they was good accident prone etc etc
Getting rid of Agencies won`t happen simply because Companies can get the work covered without employing a Driver full time, especially when he is only needed on say a Monday or Friday,just common sense.
What even if an employer could bypass the agency and save £5 per hour ?
What so you just have a problem with agencies making money, you’ll happily give the £5 an hour to the company. Companies use agencies because they want to, because its convenient. Companies dont have time to scour a driver ebay sending messages looking for drivers available, they want to make one phone call and have it sorted, thats what agencies are paid for. I really don’t get this hatred of agencies. I spent three years doing agency work for three different agencies and enjoyed it. Some of the best drivers Ive ever encountered were agency drivers I worked with, and some of the worst employed drivers at big companies who created the need for agencies with their constant droning ‘Im not doing that’. I’m happy doing my current job but come the day I want to settle down a bit agency work will be top of my list
midlifetrucker:
Me, I work freelance and sell my own pooper to people I like and appreciate me and reward me appropriately.
You sell your ‘pooper’…anyone else?! 
Relatively speaking all employed do. No company pays an employee what they are worth. They pay what they can get away with. The valued employee had never really existed.
switchlogic:
thetastytrucker:
lolipop:
thetastytrucker:
Every topic seems to have the general opinion of agencies and the jobSo how can we as drivers become less dependent upon them and make employers realize there is an alternative ?
Maybe a website like ebay with drivers in set areas with customer feedback and a rating system and advertised rate etc etc
I cant see how a agency can charge £15 a hour for our services yet only pay us £10 as they are only advertising and then supplying our skills
A website like the above would also weed bad drivers out as reviews left by employers would state if they was good accident prone etc etc
Getting rid of Agencies won`t happen simply because Companies can get the work covered without employing a Driver full time, especially when he is only needed on say a Monday or Friday,just common sense.
What even if an employer could bypass the agency and save £5 per hour ?
What so you just have a problem with agencies making money, you’ll happily give the £5 an hour to the company. Companies use agencies because they want to, because its convenient. Companies dont have time to scour a driver ebay sending messages looking for drivers available, they want to make one phone call and have it sorted, thats what agencies are paid for. I really don’t get this hatred of agencies. I spent three years doing agency work for three different agencies and enjoyed it. Some of the best drivers Ive ever encountered were agency drivers I worked with, and some of the worst employed drivers at big companies who created the need for agencies with their constant droning ‘Im not doing that’. I’m happy doing my current job but come the day I want to settle down a bit agency work will be top of my list
Spot on fella
Well I,m just working my notice after 4 years with a company. When you look at £27500 for 39 hours it all looks good. But put into the factor this includes weekends, bank holidays. Start times midnight to 6.00am runs can be changed as you get into work, everything is hand balled off the trailer. All hours after 39 hours are banked. Only allowed to take holidays for 10 months of the year the other two are classed as peak periods. No overtime rates.
So I am going to try my luck on agency under a LTD company at least with a LTD company I can sign up with a few agencies. You may as well get what you can when you can. Big companies are just like agencies you are a number and nothing else.
midlifetrucker:
Relatively speaking all employed do. No company pays an employee what they are worth. They pay what they can get away with. The valued employee had never really existed.
It’s a paradox - “The Valued Employee” is the one that got headhunted already, and now no longer works for the company that didn’t value them!"
If you’re valued, then the firm will keep very quiet about you, pay you more than everyone else, and tell that worker to keep stumn about it.
This, after all, is what ‘valued staff’ in other lines of work can expect to be treated like. 
How can you ever be “valued” at a firm that pays everyone the same - no matter what?
It encourages doing less and less work, no favours for the boss, and bunking off early at any and every opportunity.
The “hard worker” in this environment won’t be headhunted by another firm, because that other firm doesn’t know they exist. There isn’t much of a “reputation grapevine” out there so that firms can gauge the true value of a driver at any point.
Even hiring in an agency driver tells you not a lot about them - The fence one has to jump to sign up with an agency is too low…
“6 points oK”? Must be 25+ ? Must have at least 2 years experience?
“Anyone will do” essentially… 
fredthered:
Don’t use them?
easier said than done when agencies control most of the area where I exist[Swindon]and employers prefer them to actually recruiting drivers
Winseer:
midlifetrucker:
Relatively speaking all employed do. No company pays an employee what they are worth. They pay what they can get away with. The valued employee had never really existed.It’s a paradox - “The Valued Employee” is the one that got headhunted already, and now no longer works for the company that didn’t value them!"
If you’re valued, then the firm will keep very quiet about you, pay you more than everyone else, and tell that worker to keep stumn about it.
This, after all, is what ‘valued staff’ in other lines of work can expect to be treated like.How can you ever be “valued” at a firm that pays everyone the same - no matter what?
It encourages doing less and less work, no favours for the boss, and bunking off early at any and every opportunity.
The “hard worker” in this environment won’t be headhunted by another firm, because that other firm doesn’t know they exist. There isn’t much of a “reputation grapevine” out there so that firms can gauge the true value of a driver at any point.
Even hiring in an agency driver tells you not a lot about them - The fence one has to jump to sign up with an agency is too low…
“6 points oK”? Must be 25+ ? Must have at least 2 years experience?“Anyone will do” essentially…
Take the John Lewis Partnership. Everyone is a partner. If all do a good job the company makes profit. They all get a share as a percentage of their wage.
Employees therefore have a reason to perform. In this industry it’s full of peanut payments like £22 for sleeping in a tin box away from your family with a toilet or amenities. Stoppages for breaks. Being told you are salaried then flogging you to death with as many hours as they can.
This breeds resentment and people with a poor work attitude.
Human nature. I once worked for a wholesale fresh produce company. Drivers were allowed a box of fruit and veg a week free. It was a nice perk. Then they said we could have a box at cost + 20%. So consequently we all said stick it. Everyone then took a potato sack full on a Friday morning before bosses got to work.
I am lucky I freelance for a couple of old fashioned companies. We work together and the job gets done professionally with no fuss. I don’t like working weekends but if they can’t cover it. I will do them. Likewise if I can’t work for them for a few days they accept it no prob.
I wonder if it’ll ever happen - that a top dog in the industry decides to pay top dollar - just because they are top dog - and can easily afford it?!
Imagine how difficult it would be for another firm to compete with said top dog, if topdog’s package was so good, but so strictly enforced - that all the top talent distills through to the topdog firm, leaving everyone else with drivers of such liability, that they’ll all eventually go under from repeated insurance claims…?
Eg. “We only employ drivers with clean licences. Get even 3 points for setting off a camera - and you’re sacked on the spot!”
On the markets it used to be called a “■■■■■■■” and you got it on the last day of the week
It was called a ■■■■■■■ because everything was in a spud bag and you swung it over your shoulder on your way out to go home
Driver-Once-More:
@midlifetruckerOn the markets it used to be called a “■■■■■■■” and you got it on the last day of the week
It was called a ■■■■■■■ because everything was in a spud bag and you swung it over your shoulder on your way out to go home
Lol
lesrollins:
Well I,m just working my notice after 4 years with a company. When you look at £27500 for 39 hours it all looks good. But put into the factor this includes weekends, bank holidays. Start times midnight to 6.00am runs can be changed as you get into work, everything is hand balled off the trailer. All hours after 39 hours are banked. Only allowed to take holidays for 10 months of the year the other two are classed as peak periods. No overtime rates.
So I am going to try my luck on agency under a LTD company at least with a LTD company I can sign up with a few agencies. You may as well get what you can when you can. Big companies are just like agencies you are a number and nothing else.
I retired in 2005 on that money for those hours, I worked mainly in an office, Mon-Thu 8-5 Fri 8-4 no weekends, no bank holidays.
I now get a £300 a week pension, that’s why I left the profession 30 odd years ago.
Funny enough, my final salary pension coming to an end, and being replaced by a “defined contributions” rather than “defined benefits” pension meant it would be best if I “cut and run now”… It factored into me taking voluntary redundancy when I did - to go on agency.
My original final salary pension is now paid up, and secure. The new one involves paying for years, intially to pay commissions and fees (front loaded of course) and the actual money invested later on in only grows by an infintessimal amount. Not worth the bother. I no longer pay into any schemes at all, and probably won’t until the pensions industry has some serious reforming done to it. I won’t be holding my breath. 
I’ll just be taking my paid up final salary pension, and hopefully the state pension on top of it. That should safely see me past £300 a week, indexed to today’s values. 
So it would seem that operators prefer agency staff because they are easier to dismiss when they are not needed. It’s not about the money because agencies pay the same as an operator does and takes a cut for themselves which means agency drivers cost more than employed drivers. When you think about it, the cost of the driver is tiny compared to the cost of running the truck.
Ched:
So it would seem that operators prefer agency staff because they are easier to dismiss when they are not needed. It’s not about the money because agencies pay the same as an operator does and takes a cut for themselves which means agency drivers cost more than employed drivers. When you think about it, the cost of the driver is tiny compared to the cost of running the truck.
Operators employ agency because they are flexible, if for example an agency charges £15 and pays the driver £10 and the employed driver at the same company gets £10 the costs would be similar for both, holiday pay, uniform, training and so on all add to the cost of an employed driver, the cost of employing a driver is not tiny coming only second behind the biggest cost which is of course fuel, some years ago agency staff earned more per hour than employed drivers the extra cost being worthwhile because of the flexibility, agency staff are now becoming more difficult to get at short notice this is why we suddenly have the larger operators taking on staff.
Agencies will remain and barring legal intervention from the government will carry on, the only difference being the driver can now charge more for his or her services.
Why would i want to end somthing that pays all my training, alows me to work when an were i want an gives me £450-550 sometimes more TAKE home each week? Get half decent placements an mostly new motors.
You’d think that there would be more company interest in saving fuel, rather than penny pinching in the rates and/or booked hours they pay both full time and agency drivers.
Manys the time I’ve suggested to a TM that “warehouse say there’s nothing to go - ring the other end to see if there’s nothing back as well” - only to be told “run both ways empty - we run it like a bus service”. So, nothing loath since I’m being paid by the hour - that’s exactly what ends up happening. Fresh air both ways 200km trip each way. Half a tank of fuel wasted? Cost £250? But they wouldn’t dream of "letting some driver go home 3 hours early, because he’s only 5 hours into a shift, and gets guaranteed a minimum of 8 hours" ffs. 
It occurs to me that if you had some drivers that spent a single shift per week on “TM duty” - you might get around this entire problem, and instead of a fuel bonus for things like not revving, and other minutiae bullcrap that saves pennies - you get a fuel bonus for successfully spotting when an entire run can be cancelled, and the driver thus vacated still has time to be put onto something else, rather than cancelled at the last minute from the agency, or a full timer told to sweep the floor, or whatever… Efficiency would be ALL our business - if we had a more direct hand IN it! 