delboytwo:
i did a first aid appointed persons training once, and there said to me if your out and about do not give first aid as you could be prosecuted for any injuries that may of being coursed by me
1st of all, the above is bollox and has been proved in Court! You cannot be prosocuted for trying to save a life!
2nd, as a professional Fireman for 15 years, it is not advised for anyone without the correct training & equipment to attempt to extinguish a fire. “Get out, stay out, call the Fire Brigade out!”
As a driver, I ve had plenty of times to use my First Aid & Resusitation training whilst out on the road. I’ve saved lives and helped injured but I’ve also been too late, carried on untill a Doctor told me to stop & pronounced death at the scene!
Oh and basic First Aid Training should be compulsory in schools, never mind part of the Driver CPC. Your never to young (or old) to help save a life!
As a first aid trainer/assessor, I teach my students that as long as they do the first aid as per their training, they’ve got nothing to fear. There are no cases in the UK to date of a first aider being sued for any treatment they have administered.
delboytwo:
i did a first aid appointed persons training once, and there said to me if your out and about do not give first aid as you could be prosecuted for any injuries that may of being coursed by me
this is true, i was trained in the army, and i was told i was not to use it on civvys, only military personnel .
I refer to my last statement, it’s what’s known as the good samaritan legislation. Provided that you only give what treatment you’ve been trained for, you’ll be ok. By that, I mean as long as you don’t do open heart surgery on a basic first aid certificate, you’ll be ok
The Highway Man:
As a first aid trainer/assessor, I teach my students that as long as they do the first aid as per their training, they’ve got nothing to fear. There are no cases in the UK to date of a first aider being sued for any treatment they have administered.
Its the same in our training as divers there is nothing stopping you giving Basic life support to anyone. The only thing that differs is giving o2 to non diving casualties. Its classed as a drug for pain so cant be give to people. other than that the training we give is a little more than first aid
A point here Rikki mentioned it should be LAW, well folks in Germany you have to do a first aid course before any driveing instruction, is carried out also all german city and guilds drivers have to do a first aid course every 5years or early , have been very lucky yes helped people in situations but not all on RTA in other places,IT should be law and also the carriage of a first aid box along with the rest of the gubbins required ALSO in germany YOU ARE COVERED WHEN GIVEING FIRST AID aand there are no comebacks ,what so ever, UNLESS you refuse to help then this is a offense,
Normally in Europe (perhaps also elsewhere in the world) you can be prosecuted for NOT giving first aid. In the UK, you can be prosecuted for giving first aid - unless you have a certificate… Sorry, but I am not getting this. This attitude of “can’t someone else do it?”, “blame somebody else”, “not doing these things, not my job” must have been imported from the US or somewhere.
If I get run over by car or something I don’t give s…t who drags me to safety, stops me bleeding and starts me breathing - fat butcher, bearded trucker or hot paramedic - I won’t be asked for preferences…
I got some first aid training numerous times, even at secondary school when classes involved some lab experiments or workshops - cann’t remember anybody getting hurt. Nowadays, even phys.ed. is limited to minimum if anything so that nobody can get hurt and school sued. There’s ■■■■■■ education instead, so we have to tackle different sort of problems such as teenage pregnacies… Anyway…
Thanks God, only had to use my first aid skills with minor cases, fainted ladies, sprained ankles and so. Cuts, bruises do not count… neither does dragging drunk chaps from railway lines I guess
Also with myself - was a passenger in the left rear seat of a car hit by another car right into the area I was seated. My mates helped me out but went on to worry about the damage and to argue with the other guy. I had to check myself, why does my head so hurt, am I bleeding, can I see OK, am I sick etc
I think first aid should certainly be a part of drivers training - not only for profi drivers, for everybody aiming for driving licence. Maybe it should also be in schools curriculum (couple of hours a term/year). You cannot know when it comes useful, better be ready than sorry. You can not know how you’ll react seeing an emergency - you may faint, freeze or whatever just as well as being useful.
There should also be some basic firefighting training - at least to make sure nobody tries to pour water into his burning TV or frying pan. There should also be a demo to show what happens when you do!
Have done first aid away from work a couple of times.
The first one was in a mens toilet where a guy started to spray me from a neighbouring urinal.As I turn to give him a mouthful I realise he has been having an epileptic fit .He falls to the floor and knocks himslf unconscious.
I get down next to him and start to do the ABC’s.Just as I have got him into the recovery position the mans two friends appear at the door and put 2 and 2 together ,coming up with 5,and decide I must have been trying to attack or rob him.End result was one kick in the head for my troubles .
Case 2
I am going to the car park at the local supermarket when an elderly lady reverses clean over an elderly man and leaves the car parked on his head.
I make a quick assessment of the mans visible injuries.Straw coloured fluid coming from his ears and blood from his nose and eyes,he was also having great trouble breathing.I got a car jack out and jacked the car up,fortunately the ambulance crew arrived as I lifted the car.
It is important to note that one third of all paralysis cases are caused post accident by well meaning resuers dragging people “to safety”.If there is no immediate danger from fire,moving vehicles etc,leave em where they are and ensure they have an open airway,just tilt the head up to a straight ahead position.
Same as RTCs involving motorbikes, DO NOT UNLESS IT’S ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY REMOVE THE HELMET. You should be able to get an airway with the helmet still in place. Only remove it if you have to do CPR.
Same as RTCs involving motorbikes, DO NOT, UNLESS IT’S ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY, REMOVE THE HELMET. You should be able to get an airway with the helmet still in place. Only remove it if you have to do CPR.
No-one has ever been succesfully sued or prosecuted in the UK for administering First aid they have been trained to do
Most first aid training is about what NOT to do
First aid doesnt 99.9999999% of the time involve applying torniquets to gushing wounds or cutting open chests to manually beat hearts, its about common sense, stopping further injuries and ensuring when the emergency services turn up they can get a quick report on the situation in a manner they can quickly and easily absorb.
first aid is just that, a holder to ensure any situation doesnt get worse because of lack of knowledge, no-one is expected to be a doctor but a few simple techniques and procedures to stabilise a situation and stopping others who dont have a clue from causing any more damage to casualties or themselves
I would rather be in a situation where I can and know the basics whats needed than run around like a headles chicken - Which is what I did when involved in a major RTA, luckily someone with first aid training recognised I was involved and needed to be taken out of the situation and calmed down, I was first aid trained but was involved in the incident, the first aider recognised I was shook up and simply took me to one side and chatted to me while the adrenaline rush died away.
This sort of training could save your life, or the life of another driver, surely thats better training for us than how to be “ambassadors for our companies” ?
The Highway Man:
DO NOT, UNLESS IT’S ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY, REMOVE THE HELMET.
True. And although the story behind this goes back, if not eons, then certainly multiple decades whereupon, the removal of a helmet, reportedly, resulted in a portion of the skull structure being removed and part of the brain spilling out, Isn’t it strange how this same ‘tale’ has perpetuated throughout these multiple decades of training without there being any supportive evidence of subsequent instances.
Either, the message ‘hit home’ in a big way, or there have been a great number of injured motor cyclists that have had to endure additional discomfort for prolonged periods that otherwise would have been unnecessary
We’ve come a long way since then. Helmets are of a far better construction and offer far better protection.
I work on the principle that if the patient is conscious and coherent, and desires to remove their helmet, then why prevent them?
Can only remember one time were I came across an incident that called on me to act and not panic, not a trained first aider, but knew not to move someone uncessarily but to make sure the airways are clear and the person and other helpers were protected from other traffic it it was on a road.
One early morning I’d left the M62 at Howden to go up the A614 across country to Driffield & Bridlington, the roads around there in the 80’s were just single lane each way and once past the Hygena factory were quite narrow and twisty, not sure if they have been upgraded since as I haven’t been over that way for a long time. Anyway at some point near a village called Potrington there is a vicious ‘S’ bend going to right first and it is not that visible until your’e almost into it. As I started to enter the bend lo an behold in the dawn light there is a little Honda 50 ‘Stepthru’ and a body lying acoss the double whites, I wasn’t going at speed, as this was a regular route for me and I knew the road so was able to stop safely. Hazards on and out the cab after I’d put the motor in a position that for a few minutes would afford the person and myself a bit of protection, the old guy was face down on the floor and was unconcious but was breathing, trouble was he was wearing some old fashioned crash helmet which wasn’t fastened and was pushed backwards almost off his head he also was wearing glasses which seemed to have been pushed part way down his throat Within a few minutes a car came along the other way and had obviously realised something was wrong because of the way my lorry was parked, the old guy from the bike was still out of it and his face was a bit smashed up but it was important to get the glasses out of his throat, I suppose I must have gone onto autopilot or something because the guy from the car didn’t know what to do so I just pulled the glasses out and the guy seemed to come round a bit. Gotta remember there were no mobile phones then so getting the 999’s out meant a phone box or the nearest house which just happened to be about a 500m sprint away. Luckily some other motorists had turned up by this time and the ambulance had already been called. I moved my lorry out of the way once the ambulance arrived and the traffic plod seemed more interested in checking out that I hadn’t knocked the old guy off his ‘stepthru’ not that I might have saved his life
Never heard anything else about it though so he must have lived and bet he got himself a better, full face, crash helmet.
Regards
Dave Penn;
Errr. Did I state that I’d be the one removing the helmet? Try reading it again.
orys:
Krankee:
I work on the principle that if the patient is conscious and coherent, and desires to remove their helmet, then why prevent them?
What about spinal injuries which can be worsened by removing the helmet unproffesionally?
I’d doubt that anyone with spinal injuries would even seek, or desire, or indeed, be in a position to remove their own helmet.
What is often neglected in such situations is that the patient is the ultimate ‘barometer’ of their situation. Talk to the person. Ask them how they feel. Question them as to how they could be made more comfortable.
My criticism of the current standard of training, particularly in respect of one-day ‘workplace’ training is that it concentrates on certain taboos, rather than building upon the decades of experience of others.
I always teach my students that the best item they can use as a first aider is their mouth. Talk to the casualty if they’re concious, find out what happened, reassure them. I usually find a casualty is a lot more receptive to treatment if you put them at ease with a friendly smile and a chatty nature.
Within a few minutes a car came along the other way and had obviously realised something was wrong because of the way my lorry was parked, the old guy from the bike was still out of it and his face was a bit smashed up but it was important to get the glasses out of his throat, I suppose I must have gone onto autopilot or something because the guy from the car didn’t know what to do so I just pulled the glasses out and the guy seemed to come round a bit. Gotta remember there were no mobile phones then so getting the 999’s out meant a phone box or the nearest house which just happened to be about a 500m sprint away. Luckily some other motorists had turned up by this time and the ambulance had already been called. I moved my lorry out of the way once the ambulance arrived and the traffic plod seemed more interested in checking out that I hadn’t knocked the old guy off his ‘stepthru’ not that I might have saved his life 