Winseer:
Surely though, you wouldn’t be so daft as to take your truck keys out with you on a binge night?
Splitting hairs a bit, but I would if weekended, and I’m sure the point made in my last post would apply.
Realistically though - plod doesn’t turn up when you dial 911 and tell them your load is being nicked, whilst your nostrils get gang-raped by persons unknown…
What are the chances of someone in uniform rapping on your window when you have your curtains closed - purely on the offchance that this tramper in this layby “might have had a skinful”? 
splashdown:
World of difference if in a layby in drivers seat with keys in ignition and over the limit and IMHO you deserve to be found guilty and loose your licence.
I don’t agree with you here. If I’m sat in a vehicle ■■■■■■■ but have my faculties, the engine even may be running, lights on, but I have NO intention to drive, then why should I deserve to lose my licence?
It should all be about intent. If I make efforts to get the thing moving, ie fiddle with the handbrake or gearbox, fair enough. If the motor is just ticking over, but I’m just sat there in neutral, hand brake on, what actual harm am I doing to anyone■■? How can I lose control of the vehicle when I don’t have any in the first place! I mean the engine idling obviously isn’t going to do anything on its own is it? The vehicle is no more likely to move than if it’s in pieces in a workshop. It’s just the pistons moving up and down. Never mind just the ignition on or fast asleep in a bunk.
To my mind, unless I am trying to get the wheels turning, or they already are, no offence should have been committed.
I mean you could be ■■■■■■ at home with the keys in your picket lying on the sofa asleep. No intention to drive but probably committing an offence. If they’re hanging up in the hallway, your in the clear. Stupid really
I mean consider this carefully. A guy ■■■■■■■ gets in a car say, tries to get the keys in the ignition, can’t, and falls to sleep. No offence should have been committed.
Why?
He has (possibly) tried to get the vehicle moving, but hasn’t. He has not lost control of the vehicle, he never had it. Up until that point, the car could not have moved, therefore no one was in danger.
Scenario two. He gets engine started, fiddles with gear stick. Conceivably, the car could move, especially with enough revs. Bingo, nick him. He has become a danger to others.
The EXACT point at which I become a danger to others, is the time for an arrest. An idling engine with handbrake on and in neutral is no danger to anyone, never mind just having the keys on you.
If you’re drunk and in a vehicle, in any seat, then you’re drunk in charge. If you’re drunk, have the vehicle keys in your pocket and are getting into the vehicle, then you’re drunk in charge!
As said earlier, it becomes a bit less clear cut if you’re a tramper and some common sense should be applied .But, By the letter of the law, you’re drunk in charge. I haven’t dealt with a situation like that but I’ll ask traffic colleagues when I’m at work next week. I’m a response cop, not a traffic officer and this stuff is their bread and butter.
joemaxi:
If you’re drunk and in a vehicle, in any seat, then you’re drunk in charge. If you’re drunk, have the vehicle keys in your pocket and are getting into the vehicle, then you’re drunk in charge!As said earlier, it becomes a bit less clear cut if you’re a tramper and some common sense should be applied .But, By the letter of the law, you’re drunk in charge. I haven’t dealt with a situation like that but I’ll ask traffic colleagues when I’m at work next week. I’m a response cop, not a traffic officer and this stuff is their bread and butter.
Whilst I know you don’t make the law, it’s stupid law. It’s criminalising people who had no intention of driving. Your colleagues have nicked people for swigging water at red traffic lights, biting apples etc. What harm could have occurred■■? Er, none.
The interesting point, which backs up my opinion regarding this “in charge” nonsense , is this:
An airline pilot whilst in charge of his multimillion pound jet with hundreds of people on board and tons of fuel, can heartily tuck into his chicken caesar salad with strawberry mousse etc on his tray at the controls, and that’s fine.
Mildred at the wheel of her stationary Fiesta takes a swig of water at a red light and you throw the book at her.
Who has more riding on their actions here??
See my point?
After speaking to a couple of traffic colleagues , there has to be an “intent” to drive. If you’re parked up for the night and having a beer (and there’s no keys in the ignition!) then there’s no issues! As I said, this their bread and butter so I wanted to hear it from them!
Common sense should really prevail in situations like this.
Winseer:
If you have access to a vehicle that no one else has access to, and you are over the limit - you are drunk in charge.Drivers on weekly rest sometimes still have access to the vehicle (if no one else at the yard gets to use it), so should not be drinking unless they’ve handed their keys in somewhere first. Not easy if you’re a tramper.
Having a bevvy or two is a luxury of those who get to go home every night - you might say.
I hope plod don’t call round in the next 12 hours then I am the only driver in the house and the keys for the car on the drive, of which I am the registered keeper, are in my jacket pocket. I could be out of work if the interpretation you offer is if fact correct. I suggest that it needs more than this to demonstrate “in charge” for example “Intent”. As the only driver, with the keys in my possession, I am in charge of the vehicle. Until I get into the vehicle how can intent be shown?
robroy:
burnley-si:
just to note if you have had a beer and going back to the truck to go to bed always get in on the passenger side and never sit in the drivers chair and put the keys in a draw or on the dashWhy? If you have booked off on daily rest with the curtains drawn I would be confident that would be a good line of defence in a court of law, and an indication to the Police that you had no intent to set off.
my be so, but also in the eyes of the law if you are getting into the drivers seat with the keys in your hand 
you know what they are like in the country
joemaxi:
If you’re drunk and in a vehicle, in any seat, then you’re drunk in charge. If you’re drunk, have the vehicle keys in your pocket and are getting into the vehicle, then you’re drunk in charge!As said earlier, it becomes a bit less clear cut if you’re a tramper and some common sense should be applied .But, By the letter of the law, you’re drunk in charge. I haven’t dealt with a situation like that but I’ll ask traffic colleagues when I’m at work next week. I’m a response cop, not a traffic officer and this stuff is their bread and butter.
you only in charge of the vehicle in the drivers seat i would have thought, thats IMHO
joemaxi:
After speaking to a couple of traffic colleagues , there has to be an “intent” to drive. If you’re parked up for the night and having a beer (and there’s no keys in the ignition!) then there’s no issues! As I said, this their bread and butter so I wanted to hear it from them!Common sense should really prevail in situations like this.
but what % of the old bill have common sense, 
Winseer:
plod doesn’t turn up when you dial 911 and tell them your load is being nicked,
Who does? not a number I know!
joemaxi:
After speaking to a couple of traffic colleagues , there has to be an “intent” to drive. If you’re parked up for the night and having a beer (and there’s no keys in the ignition!) then there’s no issues! As I said, this their bread and butter so I wanted to hear it from them!Common sense should really prevail in situations like this.
I often have 2 or 3 cans when parked up and listen to the radio/cd or on laptop etc. I need keys in for auxiliary power and windows up/down - what happens here then? Or is this when common sense prevails?
dri-diddly-iver:
Winseer:
plod doesn’t turn up when you dial 911 and tell them your load is being nicked,Who does? not a number I know!
joemaxi:
After speaking to a couple of traffic colleagues , there has to be an “intent” to drive. If you’re parked up for the night and having a beer (and there’s no keys in the ignition!) then there’s no issues! As I said, this their bread and butter so I wanted to hear it from them!Common sense should really prevail in situations like this.
I often have 2 or 3 cans when parked up and listen to the radio/cd or on laptop etc. I need keys in for auxiliary power and windows up/down - what happens here then? Or is this when common sense prevails?
based on the amount of drivers done every day,can someone enlighten me as to where common sense and the opinion of your average plod meets on common ground? they mostly seem to have as much intuition as a speed camera on a deserted motorway at 3 o clock in the morning when theres nobody working on the road works…bean counters,every single one of them.