the maoster:
^^^^ the only flaw in that is that a Euro trapper driving for 3 days to get to his drop will rarely exceed 12 hours duty time per day, sometimes as short as a ten hour day.
^^^
This
Malaga/Calais return slog is our bag (in the main) so its just maxing driving hrs ie 3x9 and 2x10 (approx) so just 3x10 and 2x12hr days, drop and swop so an easy 54hr week on average…
robroy:
70+ weekly hours legal?
9 hours off after 15 hour working days?
…and drivers are falling asleep ?
[zb] me ! …Who would have thought it eh?
Abolish POA & allow the WTD to be enforced properly. 60 hours duty time per week, period.
rob22888:
robroy:
70+ weekly hours legal?
9 hours off after 15 hour working days?
…and drivers are falling asleep ?
[zb] me ! …Who would have thought it eh?
Abolish POA & allow the WTD to be enforced properly. 60 hours duty time per week, period.
+1
It has only become the norm over the years to do bloody ridiculous weekly hours because drivers have allowed their pay structure to go from hours + overtime hours, to same rate right through.
In the old days by the time Wednesday pm came you were on overtime rate for rest of week, then drivers beeing drivers they accepted a large increase in hourly pay, …but the same rate right through.
They were conned because that rate stayed dormant for years, until it became almost necessary to work a week and a half’s hours to earn a week’s pay.
Clever transport bosses 1. Thick drivers 0. 
Working really long hours with a short rest is draining, without a doubt. I’d definitely support a simple 12on/12off system.
Making proper use of your breaks throughout the day is important too. I like to have a nap during the day if I’m tired. Without going too management speak on it, safety has got to be our number 1 concern.
The job is forked…end of.
I DO get proper overtime rates…makes no difference.
I think,if it was legal to work 20 hours per day…they’d plan you that way
There are jobs with less hours,but these involve"rotas"which are equally ■■■■…in my view.
I’ve quit.
robroy:
It has only become the norm over the years to do bloody ridiculous weekly hours because drivers have allowed their pay structure to go from hours + overtime hours, to same rate right through.
In the old days by the time Wednesday pm came you were on overtime rate for rest of week, then drivers beeing driversThey were conned because that rate stayed dormant for years, until it became almost necessary to work a week and a half’s hours to earn a week’s pay.
Clever transport bosses 1. Thick drivers 0.
That’s a phrase I see repeated so often I almost believe it to be true. So, what’s the score? Do drivers stop getting paid for twenty hours after they’ve done forty? Or are they only earning two thirds minimum wage, roughly four and a half quid per hour.
If you were to say drivers have to work 50% more to earn a decent wedge, I’d agree with you. But then again, almost anyone on minimum wage doing 40 hours is going to struggle. Drivers aren’t special in that regards.
The original WTD for drivers was proposed to be a total weekly shift average of 48 hours but the UK vetoed it and came up with the WTD to be for working time only then decided not to enforce it
I think the regs should be looked at again and made much simpler with perhaps using a mixture of the current EU and UK domestic regs with separate daily rest rules for those sleeping at home and those sleeping away
To many drivers kill own health by eating so much,not rest properly but after blame somebody else.Driver must first sleep at least 6-hours .But to many drivers or trampers watch tv,video for many hours but after sleep 4 hours.
Drivers can work just 8 hours per day but asleep as well.This is some sickness if person asleep very quickly.
Andrejs:
Drivers can work just 8 hours per day but asleep as well.This is some sickness if person asleep very quickly.
Keh?
Captain Caveman 76:
robroy:
It has only become the norm over the years to do bloody ridiculous weekly hours because drivers have allowed their pay structure to go from hours + overtime hours, to same rate right through.
In the old days by the time Wednesday pm came you were on overtime rate for rest of week, then drivers beeing driversThey were conned because that rate stayed dormant for years, until it became almost necessary to work a week and a half’s hours to earn a week’s pay.
Clever transport bosses 1. Thick drivers 0.That’s a phrase I see repeated so often I almost believe it to be true. So, what’s the score? Do drivers stop getting paid for twenty hours after they’ve done forty? Or are they only earning two thirds minimum wage, roughly four and a half quid per hour.
If you were to say drivers have to work 50% more to earn a decent wedge, I’d agree with you. But then again, almost anyone on minimum wage doing 40 hours is going to struggle. Drivers aren’t special in that regards.
Think you’ve took me too literally mate.
I hadn’t worked it out mathematically, I just meant that for 70 hours you would be getting a lot more if 30 of those were paid at proper time and a half rate as it once was, so the actual amount more or less equates to a week’s wage, not a week and a halfs.
The week and a half reference was 40 hours which most normal industries work, plus another 30.
So if you want to be technical it’s more than a week and a half, more like a week and 3 quarters,…which is even worse. 
Well I know what I mean anyway. 
jbaz73:
Andrejs:
Drivers can work just 8 hours per day but asleep as well.This is some sickness if person asleep very quickly.Keh?
If man have some arterial sickness that he can will sleep 16 hours per day but he will still asleep asap.
Since developing this stinking cancer I have reached a stage where I often have to stop for just 10 or 15 minutes, it’s not just being tired, it’s a lot to do with the pain I get in my legs from the treatment, I find that just a 10 minute nap will refresh me enough to carry on. I seem to be ok when driving during a normal day which would start after 7.00am but some deliveries involve me starting at any time from midnight to 5.00am, those are the days that hit me hard. Luckily I work for a company that support me very well and if on some occasions I collect a trailer from just south of Trenton NJ for Ben & Jerry’s in VT during the afternoon I tell my dispatcher that I will take at least an 8 hour sleeper break en-route, he agrees to this no matter how urgent the load is, I did so a couple of weeks back and when I got to B&J they had been out of sugar for 6 hours. I never get questioned on why I have stopped, they know my condition and give me full backing, actually so does Ben & Jerry’s.
The story goes…
One of Ralph’s fell asleep at two in the morning on the way down to Dover with a load of cheps for Belgium.
When the police arrived and made their way across the field he’d ploughed into, they asked him what happened.
‘Dunno’ he said ‘I was asleep at the time’.
jbaz73:
Tm: hello, x logisticsMe: hello it’s ■■■, I know I was due to start at 5 this morning, but I’m tired, so I won’t be in till 11
Tm: #%^% #%%# #^^*%## and don’t come back
Can you see a problem here?
Yeah…drivers who aren’t prepared to fight their corner and not taking advantage of the fact that there’s enough of a shortage of decent ones that those of us any good at the job can.
I’ve been on earlies all week. Thursday I started at 5pm with a shift finishing at 3am, roughly what I’ve been doing all week. Got a text in the middle of the afternoon saying “Your run for tomorrow night is 2145 Lockerbie is that OK?” It’d be a 8am finish at the earliest.
My reply “No it isn’t after doing earlies all week. If there’s nothing else I’ll have a night off rather than do that.”
10 minutes later…“Your run for tomorrow night is 1730 start.”
So yes it can be done.
The TM can’t tell you to eff off because they’ve got a load they’ve got to get out. If they do tell you to eff off and don’t come back you might want to take a look at yourself because they quite clearly didn’t think you were that great at the job and you gave them the opportunity to get shut of you.
Conor:
jbaz73:
Tm: hello, x logisticsMe: hello it’s ■■■, I know I was due to start at 5 this morning, but I’m tired, so I won’t be in till 11
Tm: #%^% #%%# #^^*%## and don’t come back
Can you see a problem here?
Yeah…drivers who aren’t prepared to fight their corner and not taking advantage of the fact that there’s enough of a shortage of decent ones that those of us any good at the job can.
I’ve been on earlies all week. Thursday I started at 5pm with a shift finishing at 3am, roughly what I’ve been doing all week. Got a text in the middle of the afternoon saying “Your run for tomorrow night is 2145 Lockerbie is that OK?” It’d be a 8am finish at the earliest.
My reply “No it isn’t after doing earlies all week. If there’s nothing else I’ll have a night off rather than do that.”
10 minutes later…“Your run for tomorrow night is 1730 start.”
So yes it can be done.
The TM can’t tell you to eff off because they’ve got a load they’ve got to get out. If they do tell you to eff off and don’t come back you might want to take a look at yourself because they quite clearly didn’t think you were that great at the job and you gave them the opportunity to get shut of you.
Exactly.
When I started with my firm I told them I don’t start before 6, or 5 30 at a pinch.
They tried it on at first but soon got the message.
We have idiots who start at midnight Sunday, (rather than run Sun lunchtime premium rate with a night out paid ) or 1 and 2am through the week…and they moan about it (to each other not the boss )
I still just get 6am starts, and still get the job done, as far as I’m concerned they don’t pay me enough to start earlier,…if they did I gladly would.
I’m the same robroy, I don’t do early starts, well I don’t now that I have a choice anyway. Being from London starting later than 5am meant losing so much time due to traffic that it really effected how much you could get done in a shift. Now I don’t have to deal with that, I work to my circadian rhythm and I feel much better for it, I still do stupid middle of the night deliveries, but I now do them at the end of my day, rather than the beginning.
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Although each and every drivers primary responsibility is road safety, yes getting to your job on time is secondary, honest. This thread reminds me of a conversation with one of me planners this week:
Planner: “Hi dip your gorgeous ■■■ on legs, what time can you work till today”.
Me: " Hi Hun I need to be parked up by 6.30"
Planner: “6.30 but we need you to do another job, what time did you start”.
Me: “My start time is irrelevant, I’ve given you a time I feel comfortable working till”.
Planner: “I’ve asked a reasonable question what’s the problem”
Me: “No problem 6.30 is more than 13 hours and that’s enough”.
Planner: "FFS I’ll ask someone else "
Parked up for 6 with a 5am start, that will do nicely.
I worked a fortnight about,2 weeks days 2 weeks nights for 35 years,starting at various times week to week.I remember coming back down the M6 in the early hours fighting to stay awake,every services I pulled into was crammed with nowhere to park even the out slips had lorries parked on them.Anyway I nodded off and woke up hitting the kerb on the hard shoulder,if any poor soul had been broken down I would have driven right over them,i pulled off at the next junction and parked up on the bridge and shut my eyes,the next thing the police pulled up and asked me if I was ok,i nodded and they just pulled away and left me there,night work is no good for anybody.[keep your elbows in]
