The drivers pay will not go up whilst flip flops are happy to do the job for £8 ph.
eddie snax:
I hear what you are saying Harry, but on the other hand, if drivers were to get motivated, then they would add to the profitability of the firm, and that is where a wage increase would come from.
I suppose it’s a case of “six and two threes”. Like many others I am in my mid to late 50s now and am very disillusioned with the whole industry. I couldn’t honestly see myself being prepared to become “more motivated” in the sense of working even longer hours, or getting out of bed even earlier in the morning on the offchance that I might get a small pay rise in five years time.
Young people aren’t interested in doing the job because the pay is poor, the hours are excessive and truck drivers are treated with less respect than an Alabama cotton picker in the 1850s. They are the things that need to be addressed, not just suggesting that the existing workforce should buck its ideas up a bit.
eddie snax:
if drivers were to get motivated, then they would add to the profitability of the firm, and that is where a wage increase would come from.
Define ‘motivated’ and the scope of any lack of ‘motivation’ and where that ‘motivation’ could be supposedly improved. 
As opposed to the situation of deliberate unsustainable productivety limits,in the form of unrealistic gross weight limits,combined with equally unsustainable fuel taxation costs.
What on earth have I just read ■■?
According to Transport Operator, there’s not a shortage of licence-holders, there’s a shortage of people willing to do the job. Over the last decade, there has been an over-supply of drivers into the haulage industry, causing wages and conditions to decline, resulting in an attitude like what Andy_S said; “If you don’t like it, sod-off, it’s the way it is. There are dozens of fellows who would love to take your place!” I think haulage firms took advantage of the low driver pay, and hammered-down their rates for customers. Now, years later, when there aren’t enough drivers wanting to do the job, firms can’t physically afford to pay drivers more, because they’re not making enough on their cheap haulage to cover it. They’ve shot themselves in the foot.
The company I worked for screams and shouts about not being able to get drivers, even resorting to advertising on banners in certain areas. Eight drivers walked-out last week, nine including myself. Then they do stupid things like put driver-facing CCTV in cabs, treat you like dog crap, and make you cab-hop as a tramper. Drivers sod-off to better spoils, and they wonder why. They had their crap conditions, and if you complained, you were always met with a comment of “it’s just the way it is”.
I was told by the owner of a firm that if he could afford to pay his employees more, he would do. Then I put that one to bed, because there’s a firm near me whats a renowned bad payer, and the MD is a young lad who’s constantly posting photos on Facebook of his rich lads’ holidays to Las Vegas, his fast cars, days at the races in a private box, etc, whilst his drivers are slugging-out 60 hours per week on £8.00 an hour. You could say he’s entitled to it, but when you think that he looks at his accounts and thinks,: “Hmm, now I’ve had my £250,000 salary, there isn’t enough to give the drivers a £1 per hour pay rise.”
F-reds:
Exactly Eddie!Every job I’ve ever had I’ve given 100% even if I thought I wasn’t being paid enough, and more often than not, the extra effort gets noticed and more money is forth coming. If its not forth coming a better more prosperous job offer from a competitor usually is.
The fact is more money for either an equivalent increase in work per hour or more hours worked isn’t a pay rise.It can possibly even be a wage reduction in real terms.On that note you don’t go into a shop and ask for more product to justify any price increase so why should the labour market be any different.
Carryfast:
eddie snax:
if drivers were to get motivated, then they would add to the profitability of the firm, and that is where a wage increase would come from.Define ‘motivated’ and the scope of any lack of ‘motivation’ and where that ‘motivation’ could be supposedly improved.
As opposed to the situation of the deliberate unsustainable productivety limits in the form of unrealistic gross weight limits combined with equally unsustainable fuel taxation costs.
Evil8Beezle:
Carryfast:
eddie snax:
if drivers were to get motivated, then they would add to the profitability of the firm, and that is where a wage increase would come from.Define ‘motivated’ and the scope of any lack of ‘motivation’ and where that ‘motivation’ could be supposedly improved.
As opposed to the situation of the deliberate unsustainable productivety limits in the form of unrealistic gross weight limits combined with equally unsustainable fuel taxation costs.
Great then the Tories will obviously have no problem with allowing LHV’s and allowing trucks to use red diesel so there’s enough money then being earned to pay the drivers. 
eagerbeaver:
The drivers pay will not go up whilst flip flops are happy to do the job for £8 ph.
+1
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Rottweiler22:
I was told by the owner of a firm that if he could afford to pay his employees more, he would do. Then I put that one to bed, because there’s a firm near me whats a renowned bad payer, and the MD is a young lad who’s constantly posting photos on Facebook of his rich lads’ holidays to Las Vegas, his fast cars, days at the races in a private box, etc, whilst his drivers are slugging-out 60 hours per week on £8.00 an hour. You could say he’s entitled to it, but when you think that he looks at his accounts and thinks,: “Hmm, now I’ve had my £250,000 salary, there isn’t enough to give the drivers a £1 per hour pay rise.”
Just because operator two can pay himself a good wedge, doesn’t mean operator one can. You’d need to know all the costings and the rates charged to determine if operator one was telling the truth or not. It took me 9 years not to be the lowest paid, a further 5 years before I was paid the most. And by the most, I mean I gave myself a little end of year bonus last year( think hundreds not thousands), so that I wasn’t the second best paid. I run a second hand van, no car, and in 25.5 years had 8 weeks holiday plus about ten long weekends. But I view myself as successful because I don’t owe, drivers stay and we all work together.
Do I think my drivers deserve more, yes I honestly do, I think driver pay is garbage overall, but as said before, if I go to my customer and say I want another £1.00 a mile, the next words out of his mouth will be spoken to a competitor.
Maybe in your example the latter is refinancing, late paying and about to go bump, whilst the other owns all the fleet outright. My point is you cannot look at one firm and surmise anything without having all the info.
Carryfast:
F-reds:
Exactly Eddie!Every job I’ve ever had I’ve given 100% even if I thought I wasn’t being paid enough, and more often than not, the extra effort gets noticed and more money is forth coming. If its not forth coming a better more prosperous job offer from a competitor usually is.
The fact is more money for either an equivalent increase in work per hour or more hours worked isn’t a pay rise.It can possibly even be a wage reduction in real terms.On that note you don’t go into a shop and ask for more product to justify any price increase so why should the labour market be any different.
But if it means more money in my pocket, I couldn’t give a rusty ■■■■ what some lazy leftie thinks about my wage earning ability 
But think of it this way, I’m invariably working smarter and not harder, so I’m just being more efficient. If that’s a “wage reduction in real terms” that’s fine, I’ll never not be unemployed with that attitude…
As others have said there is no shortage of people with an HGV licence, but there are fewer people willing to be lorry drivers, can’t blame them really from some of the things I read on here and have experienced on my more recent forays into agency work.
In the industry I work in we are finding it more and more difficult to get truck drivers, teams are chasing an decreasing pool of drivers and they only really consider those with motorsport experience, but of the people I knew round the circuits 10 years ago many have settled down, they now have families so they don’t want the time away, but nobody seems to want to pay to train new drivers or take on drivers from the haulage industry to replace them they must go after the same old faces.
I’m sure many haulage companies are doing a similar thing, only looking for those with a few years under their belt, but nothing will really change until goods aren’t being shifted and shelves go empty.
muckles:
As others have said there is no shortage of people with an HGV licence, but there are fewer people willing to be lorry drivers, can’t blame them really from some of the things I read on here and have experienced on my more recent forays into agency work.In the industry I work in we are finding it more and more difficult to get truck drivers, teams are chasing an decreasing pool of drivers and they only really consider those with motorsport experience, but of the people I knew round the circuits 10 years ago many have settled down, they now have families so they don’t want the time away, but nobody seems to want to pay to train new drivers or take on drivers from the haulage industry to replace them they must go after the same old faces.
I’m sure many haulage companies are doing a similar thing, only looking for those with a few years under their belt, but nothing will really change until goods aren’t being shifted and shelves go empty.
I don’t work now. Just mess about on my boat. Why would I drive a truck for £10 an hour when I could make more money selling copies of the Big Issue? Tell the road transport industry to give me a call when it’s £25 an hour.
F-reds:
Carryfast:
F-reds:
Exactly Eddie!Every job I’ve ever had I’ve given 100% even if I thought I wasn’t being paid enough, and more often than not, the extra effort gets noticed and more money is forth coming. If its not forth coming a better more prosperous job offer from a competitor usually is.
The fact is more money for either an equivalent increase in work per hour or more hours worked isn’t a pay rise.It can possibly even be a wage reduction in real terms.On that note you don’t go into a shop and ask for more product to justify any price increase so why should the labour market be any different.
But if it means more money in my pocket, I couldn’t give a rusty [zb] what some lazy leftie thinks about my wage earning ability
But think of it this way, I’m invariably working smarter and not harder, so I’m just being more efficient. If that’s a “wage reduction in real terms” that’s fine, I’ll never not be unemployed with that attitude…
As I said you’d be right in the case of allowing LHV’s.But with the given gross weight limit as it stands exactly where is the scope for working ‘smarter’.
While the real world example is more like more hours worked,or more work expected to be done in an hour,so as to employ less workers to do the equivalent amount of work.Without an equivalent increase in wages.IE a wage cut in real terms.
muckles:
As others have said there is no shortage of people with an HGV licence, but there are fewer people willing to be lorry drivers, can’t blame them really from some of the things I read on here and have experienced on my more recent forays into agency work.In the industry I work in we are finding it more and more difficult to get truck drivers, teams are chasing an decreasing pool of drivers and they only really consider those with motorsport experience, but of the people I knew round the circuits 10 years ago many have settled down, they now have families so they don’t want the time away, but nobody seems to want to pay to train new drivers or take on drivers from the haulage industry to replace them they must go after the same old faces.
I’m sure many haulage companies are doing a similar thing, only looking for those with a few years under their belt, but nothing will really change until goods aren’t being shifted and shelves go empty.
I think the problems of the motor sport transport sector regards driver retention are similar to those of the other sectors.IE it’s not just the wage but more the quality of the work.In the case of motor sport it’s long since got a reputation for being a garage labourer’s job with an HGV licence to move the mobile garage between venues.
Have said before,I am earning £7.80 an hour nights
Minger:
Have said before,I am earning £7.80 an hour nights
That’s bad… you’d earn more as a Burglar (I imagine, not speaking from experience)
Carryfast:
muckles:
As others have said there is no shortage of people with an HGV licence, but there are fewer people willing to be lorry drivers, can’t blame them really from some of the things I read on here and have experienced on my more recent forays into agency work.In the industry I work in we are finding it more and more difficult to get truck drivers, teams are chasing an decreasing pool of drivers and they only really consider those with motorsport experience, but of the people I knew round the circuits 10 years ago many have settled down, they now have families so they don’t want the time away, but nobody seems to want to pay to train new drivers or take on drivers from the haulage industry to replace them they must go after the same old faces.
I’m sure many haulage companies are doing a similar thing, only looking for those with a few years under their belt, but nothing will really change until goods aren’t being shifted and shelves go empty.
I think the problems of the motor sport transport sector regards driver retention are similar to those of the other sectors.IE it’s not just the wage but more the quality of the work.In the case of motor sport it’s long since got a reputation for being a garage labourer’s job with an HGV licence to move the mobile garage between venues.
It’s not the lack of people who’d want to give it a go, We have several drivers who regularly deliver to us who ask how to get into the industry, it’s the lack of teams willing to look beyond the decreasing pool of truck drivers they know, those that leave the industry tend to do so, not because of the type of work, but because personal circumstances change.
Harry Monk:
Why would I drive a truck for £10 an hour when I could make more money selling copies of the Big Issue? Tell the road transport industry to give me a call when it’s £25 an hour.
You can add to that why be lumbered with a job which is subject to punitive government political policy of removing it wherever possible.Thereby reducing the scope for wage increases and leaving mostly the choice of the dregs of the job within the distribution and building trade deliveries etc etc sectors.In addition to other impositions like tachos,trackers,and cameras etc.All of which defeats the object of maybe accepting a lower hourly rate for the freedom of having relatively less management than other types of job and the open road.
Carryfast:
Great then the Tories will obviously have no problem with allowing LHV’s and allowing trucks to use red diesel so there’s enough money then being earned to pay the drivers.
You are even less connected to reality than I thought you were if you believe that would ever be the result.
Here is what will happen if and when red diesel and LHVs are permitted: Hauliers will reduce their rates still further and so there will remain insufficient money in the job to pay anything approaching a decent wage. It really is that simple. Modern lorries are more fuel efficient than old ones, but has that saving found its way to drivers’ pay packets?