Driver CPC, new guidance

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
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Zac_A:

desypete:
i bet you do driver training ?

Do you think only DCPC trainers are in favour of keeping it? If so, you’re wrong.

I’ve got my class 1, so I can honestly say I’m a driver. But more often these days I’m a DGSA and an external TM, I see drivers getting theirselves infringements (and putting the company at risk) because they haven’t got the sense to plan their breaks properly, or not doing their defects checks properly.

My time is limited, so the easiest thing for me to do is send them for a days DCPC with a trainer of known quality to be reminded of what they claim they already know. That way the next time they have two defective tyres or don’t take a 45minute break before the 4.5 hours has passed, they can’t say they didn’t know it was important, because I’ve had someone else spend a whole day telling them what is must-know information, while I’m busy doing all the other stuff to make sure the company stays out of trouble with DVSA and the TC.

Haven’t had any infringements yet but yesterday had 15 mins during day and 30 mins at 16:30 due to a multitude of issues which I won’t bore you on

I’m not against CPC as just completed first time as been exempt since 96 - however now I know the rules and content I can see will be a waste of time and one’s own money on subjects I won’t gain anything from so more choice required

My new experience to this logistics world has seriously opened my eyes and I can see where it’s falling short and they drivers change careers

Not having the sense to plan breaks is a generic statement and offensive especially when the areas on the A31 for lorries are coned off so they can’t stop - no where in towns for suitable stops - double yellows in industrial estates and permit holders only - I’m not suggesting this is everywhere but jeez you can’t just park anywhere [emoji2369] added to that a tightly planned delivery schedule with too many drops

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82

I’m just describing the lay of the land, if you find that offensive then don’t blame the messenger.

You’ve said you’re new to this side of things; the bottom line is it doesn’t matter where you are or how many drops you’ve got on, it’s the driver’s responsibility to make sure they take their breaks in accordance with the rules.

If there are exceptional circumstances you can protect yourself with a printout, but that can’t be used as an excuse for not planning and it can’t be used regularly.

Your TM will analyse your card downloads and if you aren’t planning your breaks properly you can be expect to be invited into the office for the first of what could potentially be a series of increasingly formal conversations.

One of the most fundamental ingredients in all of these conversations will be that: drivers who aren’t legally compliant are putting the company’s O-licence at risk. Nothing is more important to a haulage company than it’s O-licence, and as one of my drivers was told very recently, if you can’t get it right then we aren’t going to risk the jobs of 10 other drivers for your sake.

83

As for “more choice”, that depends where you go: these things aren’t set in stone. The place I send my drivers to has 11 approved courses and are planning to add more. I can think of other courses that other providers offer which will also gain you DCPC hours if the providers have taken the time to apply for them, eg First Aid, Hiab, OLAT for would-be owner drivers, or for tipper drivers the MPQC (formerly known as the Epic card). I’m sure other people could add to that list.

84

Zac_A:
As for “more choice”, that depends where you go: these things aren’t set in stone. The place I send my drivers to has 11 approved courses and are planning to add more. I can think of other courses that other providers offer which will also gain you DCPC hours if the providers have taken the time to apply for them, eg First Aid, Hiab, OLAT for would-be owner drivers, or for tipper drivers the MPQC (formerly known as the Epic card). I’m sure other people could add to that list.

Already emergency responding qualified
Paid for a 2 day Hiab course myself as Allumi would
Recognise my ITSAR Hiab instructor qualification 2006 but yeah ok was a while back but still experienced - no CpC provided on that because at time booking wasn’t asked for - not an owner driver - don’t do tip work at moment - taking my ADR soon so that will be 21 hours - it’s the long term I’m thinking with availability of different courses

So yes maybe look around for more opportunity that’s if CPC is still around in next 5 years

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85

Zac_A:
I’m just describing the lay of the land, if you find that offensive then don’t blame the messenger.

You’ve said you’re new to this side of things; the bottom line is it doesn’t matter where you are or how many drops you’ve got on, it’s the driver’s responsibility to make sure they take their breaks in accordance with the rules.

If there are exceptional circumstances you can protect yourself with a printout, but that can’t be used as an excuse for not planning and it can’t be used regularly.

Your TM will analyse your card downloads and if you aren’t planning your breaks properly you can be expect to be invited into the office for the first of what could potentially be a series of increasingly formal conversations.

One of the most fundamental ingredients in all of these conversations will be that: drivers who aren’t legally compliant are putting the company’s O-licence at risk. Nothing is more important to a haulage company than it’s O-licence, and as one of my drivers was told very recently, if you can’t get it right then we aren’t going to risk the jobs of 10 other drivers for your sake.

I did take my break in accordance with the law so didn’t get any infringement however I guess the point is 15 mins during day and 30 at end isn’t good and was unavoidable

You say don’t blame the messenger but say drivers don’t use their common sense mmmmmmm

I’m in a lucky position to dismiss firms that don’t help drivers with their obligations

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86

Common sense is a very rare commodity, plenty of evidence available to support that.

Here’s a freebie you might not have had had on your DCPC courses: If you’re going to do 15’ plus 30’, then you really ought to be aiming for 17’ and 32’. The readout on the tacho is not necessarily the same as what is recorded on the chip inside the tacho, eg readout says 45’ of rest, but it might mean you’ve just begun your 45th minute and have only completed 44 minutes. It might not seem like much but in the event of an incident where someone is injured or even killed, the court will hear that “on the day of the crash the driver had taken insufficient rest.”

87

Zac_A:
Common sense is a very rare commodity, plenty of evidence available to support that.

Here’s a freebie you might not have had had on your DCPC courses: If you’re going to do 15’ plus 30’, then you really ought to be aiming for 17’ and 32’. The readout on the tacho is not necessarily the same as what is recorded on the chip inside the tacho, eg readout says 45’ of rest, but it might mean you’ve just begun your 45th minute and have only completed 44 minutes. It might not seem like much but in the event of an incident where someone is injured or even killed, the court will hear that “on the day of the crash the driver had taken insufficient rest.”

I go for 16 and 31 for a correct entry [emoji6]

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88

Zac_A:
Common sense is a very rare commodity, plenty of evidence available to support that.

Here’s a freebie you might not have had had on your DCPC courses: If you’re going to do 15’ plus 30’, then you really ought to be aiming for 17’ and 32’. The readout on the tacho is not necessarily the same as what is recorded on the chip inside the tacho, eg readout says 45’ of rest, but it might mean you’ve just begun your 45th minute and have only completed 44 minutes. It might not seem like much but in the event of an incident where someone is injured or even killed, the court will hear that “on the day of the crash the driver had taken insufficient rest.”

That’s what we all do at work, but only 16 and 31. Because it’s rounded to the nearest whole minute. How can 16 and 31 ever be rounded down to 14 or 29?
So is 17 and 32 needlessly cautious?

89

Two extra minutes of rest in a working day “needlessly cautious”? Is your work so precise that every single minute needs to be accounted for?

I don’t know how long you’ve been in the industry, but I’m confident that all the experienced drivers here will tend to agree that no decent TM or gaffer is going to give you grief for that, and if things are so tightly controlled every minute counts, you might want to be looking for alternative work with the freedom to cover your ■■■■ as you feel is required, because IME if you’re that much under pressure, it is only going to get much, much worse over time, not better.

Going back a few years, I recall my first experience with a new gaffer, he was giving me grief for doing my walkaround check, claiming ten minutes was too long and I should have been out on the road within less than five minutes. I knew then & there that was the beginning of the end for my time with that company and I told him bluntly “It’s my licence, not yours”.

Things went downhill at a steady pace, pressure continued to be piled on, people left and were not replaced, machinery broke and was not properly repaired, leaving more work for those who remained with fewer machines to do the job.

During the first nine months of “new guy” being in charge, 60% of the other drivers left the company one by one, their work getting piled onto the remaining drivers, I left not long afterwards, at that point there was only one driver left who had been there before the new manager had started.

Within the next nine months someone died at one of their sites because safety had been compromised in pursuit of profit. Within the next year the company had gone into administration owing £13 million. The HSE investigation into the fatality is still in process; I’m always on the look out for an update; in my opinion this “manager” should be going to jail.

I’m totally opposed to idea everyone should be working flat-out all the time. The “maximizing working time and minimizing rest time” view that is endemic to the industry is one of the several reasons fewer and fewer people are attracted to the job, especially younger people.

Drivers should be aiming for better working conditions as well as better pay. Doing the bare minimum of rest is not improved working conditions.

90

Zac_A:
I’m totally opposed to idea everyone should be working flat-out all the time. The “maximizing working time and minimizing rest time” view that is endemic to the industry is one of the several reasons fewer and fewer people are attracted to the job, especially younger people.

Drivers should be aiming for better working conditions as well as better pay. Doing the bare minimum of rest is not improved working conditions.

+1 breaks are minimum not maximum