msgyorkie:
Dipper_Dave:
This wouldn’t happen if old hands took noobs under their wing like the old days.This 100%
My “old hand” always told me…“you dont see a plumber abusing his wrench, so why would you abuse your tool of the trade aka your licence!”
I always pass that pearl of wisdom onto newbies.
Mind you Dozy is a tool and he seems to get abused quite a bit 
The trick to companies being able to bully drivers like this is this myth that “If we sack you, and ban you from site - you’ll never get another driving job again!” as if they own VOSA rather than the company that wants to you fall foul of VOSA.
I had a palletliner firm try and get me to carry out similar illegal practices (pop your card whilst fuelling/doing curtains and manually enter a break as had) - all to get back in my case, so they would not have to pay out so many hours on agency.
At the time though, I was not paid my breaks - so I insisted upon taking as long a break as I wanted, because it was in my unpaid time. I’d taken care to park in a place where I was not causing an obstruction, and I eventually ended up taking 15 hours to do what they reckoned was normally a 12-13 hour job. Boo hoo! Their regular guy had to do that 5 nights a week… “Hmm… That’s a minimum 60 hour week, every week - which is bent” I thought.
I suggested to the firm that in future they might like to split the job between two drivers to “keep it clean”. They were having none of it of course, and I got duly banned from site. I reported them to VOSA for running a bent yard, and suggested they might like to pull drivers arriving back at the home depot around 6am saturday morning. Nothing happened though. The police, these days - reckon they want “Intel” from the general public - but it seems that Intel has to be very serious crimes indeed, ideally involving guns - before they’ll put anyone on the case. 
I think you are confusing “Intelligence” with “specific complaint”. The former gets fed into the system and is available to any officer investigating the latter.
Digit369:
It’s not the point of what works for you it’s the law and I’m responceable for what I’m doing And like many other drivers are pressured by the customer to do things that are bent. And they don’t care if I get a infringement and more to the point if I had a accident a fatal one it would me who get the book thrown at me.
I’m going to put this simply so you can understand it -
Grow a pair
Don’t do it
I’ve done 13 years on a large pallet network trunk to Birmingham so feel qualified to answer a few of the OP’s points.
They don’t have the space for drivers to be taking breaks on bays whilst being loaded or tipped. Sometimes it is possible, but if they need the space then you have to go.
The trick is to park up before or after loading and take your break. When they have several hundred trailers to tip and load they aren’t going to wait around for drivers taking breaks; you have to organise yourself and your hours to fit the job. Most hubs have areas where you can park up. I admit sometimes it can take a few laps to find a space and it can test your reversing skills (well that’s my excuse!) but you should be able to stay within the law quite easily, just not on a bay.
Also bear in mind that if you talk nicely to the staff at the hub they are generally far more obliging than if you try to lay down the law. I’ve often asked if I can stay put for 10 minutes to complete a break and if they can do it they will. But this is just stating the bleedin’ obvious!
It’s probably long overdue, but these pallet hubs that are cutting the rates to the bone to get work, should be told to ■■■■ off by the drivers that work for them, and break the law in doing so. No wonder thr job is ■■■■■■, until drivers grow a pair and tell the employers that they will not break the law, it’s going to end in tears and probably a very bad accident that Dvsa will investigate and find out about these illegalities and someone will go to jail for it.
Sapper
nsmith1180:
AndrewG:
What some need to realise in the UK is that DVSA dont own you, theres no need to continually look over your shoulder worrying about being prosecuted for every tiny little misdemeanour…sod doing it to the letter of the law, as long as your card shows no infringements then work the rules to your advantage and as you see fit!Andrew, there are times you talk sense and times you talk out of your arse. This is the latter. DVSA will take action if they are seeing regular questionable behaviour and are now targeting the overnight carriers after successfully prosecuting Tufnells a couple of months back.
The Op did it right first time and wrong the second. If you need a break, take it. If some jobsworth tells you to move, ignore them. You are the one with the keys, it’s your decision.
And before y’all jump on the ‘walk the other walk talk the talk’ thing, I have put my money where my mouth is on this. Fired by UPS supply chain for refusing to work during daily rest, still over £100 owed to me by Rhys Davies because I refused to do a job that the vehicle was not suitable for, (I’d failed the drop previously because the truck was too big to get into the delivery point). Refuse all Stobart Group and ESL work because of continued indirect pressure to break drivers hours Rules. All while on agency.
If you have a good agency they will back you up. If you don’t, ditch em and find one that will.
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If as you say im talking out of my arse how is it ive been in this game for 25+ years and never had a run in ref tacho offences Yes ive had several speeders but nothing otherwise. As for dvsa pulling you for working on break, apart from following a driver and spying on him how exactly are they going to prosecute??
Anyone wanting to work for the company i sub for plays by their rules and theres a big waiting list to get on the books here. They dont want tacho time infringements (over speeds they dont care about) but working on break if needed is expected and no one complains, the pay is exceptional and trucks top spec…very few leave. I work the same as it benefits myself on occasions and have done for years, absolutely no harm done to anyone.
With your attitude you certainly wouldnt work here and refusing work the way you currently are youre very soon going to be running out of options…give and take is what its about NOT work to rule…
AndrewG:
nsmith1180:
AndrewG:
What some need to realise in the UK is that DVSA dont own you, theres no need to continually look over your shoulder worrying about being prosecuted for every tiny little misdemeanour…sod doing it to the letter of the law, as long as your card shows no infringements then work the rules to your advantage and as you see fit!Andrew, there are times you talk sense and times you talk out of your arse. This is the latter. DVSA will take action if they are seeing regular questionable behaviour and are now targeting the overnight carriers after successfully prosecuting Tufnells a couple of months back.
The Op did it right first time and wrong the second. If you need a break, take it. If some jobsworth tells you to move, ignore them. You are the one with the keys, it’s your decision.
And before y’all jump on the ‘walk the other walk talk the talk’ thing, I have put my money where my mouth is on this. Fired by UPS supply chain for refusing to work during daily rest, still over £100 owed to me by Rhys Davies because I refused to do a job that the vehicle was not suitable for, (I’d failed the drop previously because the truck was too big to get into the delivery point). Refuse all Stobart Group and ESL work because of continued indirect pressure to break drivers hours Rules. All while on agency.
If you have a good agency they will back you up. If you don’t, ditch em and find one that will.
Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk
If as you say im talking out of my arse how is it ive been in this game for 25+ years and never had a run in ref tacho offences
Anyone wanting to work for the company i sub for plays by their rules and theres a big waiting list to get on the books here. They dont want tacho time infringements (over speeds they dont care about) but working on break if needed is expected and no one complains, the pay is exceptional and trucks top spec…very few leave. I work the same as it benefits myself on occasions and have done for years, absolutely no harm done to anyone.
With your attitude you certainly wouldnt work here and refusing work the way you currently are youre very soon going to be running out of options…give and take is what its about NOT work to rule…
Wrong. By expecting drivers to work on break the company is gaining an unfair advantage over its competitors. There will be occasions when this practice makes the difference between doing x loads a week and x plus one, two, three or four loads a week. The company which operates within the law cannot hope to compete on price per load if it is quoting for the job running into an additional day or double manning its vehicles . I notice also that elsewhere you claim to be totting up 4000km a week, that is an exceedingly high average speed to achieve in a legal week.
gardun:
I’ve done 13 years on a large pallet network trunk to Birmingham so feel qualified to answer a few of the OP’s points.
They don’t have the space for drivers to be taking breaks on bays whilst being loaded or tipped. Sometimes it is possible, but if they need the space then you have to go.
The trick is to park up before or after loading and take your break. When they have several hundred trailers to tip and load they aren’t going to wait around for drivers taking breaks; you have to organise yourself and your hours to fit the job. Most hubs have areas where you can park up. I admit sometimes it can take a few laps to find a space and it can test your reversing skills (well that’s my excuse!) but you should be able to stay within the law quite easily, just not on a bay.
Also bear in mind that if you talk nicely to the staff at the hub they are generally far more obliging than if you try to lay down the law. I’ve often asked if I can stay put for 10 minutes to complete a break and if they can do it they will. But this is just stating the bleedin’ obvious!
Well said as it sheds serious light on a rather bizarre scenario.
And some of us were here amazed this man has discovered a den of villains correction, a nationwide crime consortium right under our noses. He even informed the traffic cop of the situation but the crimes continue unabated.
Could the scenario go something like this I wonder as it took me at least twice as long as it should to do things when I started out.
Sorry I’m late but took me a long time to swap trailers and drive here…We’ll throw a bunch of forkies at you to get you back on schedule…Mate you gotta get going…Sorry I need a 45 now…You’ve been sat there an hour already…Well I was checking and securing…That only takes 15 minutes… Not the way I learned to do it…Don’t care, move the wagon, there are six others waiting to get done…I need my 45 now…I don’t give a f***, pull the card, put it on break or whatever you want but get it off the bay NOW!!!
A very very naive newbie or a major crime network with traffic cop and agency collusion?
My advice to the OP is it sounds more likely that this gig they have you on needs a level of competence beyond your current experience. Added to the pressure is your commute and it’s night work so you are probably working mostly on adrenaline and are flaked out.
If you are not getting on top of it real soon have the agency put you on something a bit less demanding for a while that will afford you the space to learn. Don’t forget we all started at the beginning got better with time.
If you want to waste your driving lessons money you could tell everyone it’s a complete den of criminals and they are trying to radicalise you too.
Palletways by any chance?
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cav551 says AndrewG must be pushing it to do 4000kms a week.I don’t know Andrew but from his posts he drives Malaga to Reims or CalaisI don’t know his route either but it may be 800kms(500m) daily over 5 of 5.5 days at an average around 80km(50mph) in a high spec truck to keep up a high average speed.His route is probably dual carriageway every inch so seems feasible.Traffic density nowhere near British standards.Wouldn’t mind the job myself if I were younger.I imagine tedium would be his worst problem,apart from naf trailers.