A common weekend driving assumption by some newbies

[ROG]

A common assumption by a lot of those entering the LGV industry is that they can do driving all weekend (or on their days off) to gain experience if they have a Monday to Friday job that does not come under EU regs.

If someone has a Monday to Friday job then they will only, in most circumstances, be able to drive under EU regs for one shift every other weekend in order to conform to the weekly rest periods.

Few rules when doing two jobs and one of them comes under EU regs -
A 'week' is mon 0000 to sun 2400
You must have a 45 hour unbroken rest in every other week
You must have a 24 hour unbroken rest in every week
In any week where you come under EU regs your work in the other job must be recorded
That other work can be recorded on a digi tacho, written on seperate digi printouts or on seperate analogue charts - one for each day worked
Each recorded work day must contain your name, date, start & finish time.
You do not need to record anything if you do not come under EU regs in that week
All this is so that the authorities can check that you have had the correct weekly rest for the EU regs

The WEEKLY REST PERIODS are the key factor in determining whether you can drive on any days off from the regular job.
The DAILY REST PERIODS must also be taken into consideration.

None of the above is included in the present theory and I believe should be to prevent breaches of the EU regs/law.

The forthcoming INITIAL LGV driver CPC does not seem to address this issue either as there does not seem to be a compulsory section on these type of regulations. Perhaps there should be ..........

More information on LGV drivers hours etc can be found by clicking this SAFETY, LAW AND WORKING TIME DIRECTIVE FORUM (INTERACTIVE) link.

[Scarab]

None of the above is included in the present theory and I believe should be to prevent breaches of the EU regs/law.

I believe it is ROG, or it certainly was when I did my theory test mid last-year.
Just looked through the interactive DVD I have "The Official DSA Guide to LGV/PCV Theory" and its on there too.

So it SHOULD really still be covered shouldn't it? I haven't heard of them taking anything out before!


Alex

[ROG]

None of the above is included in the present theory and I believe should be to prevent breaches of the EU regs/law.

I believe it is ROG, or it certainly was when I did my theory test mid last-year.
Just looked through the interactive DVD I have "The Official DSA Guide to LGV/PCV Theory" and its on there too.

So it SHOULD really still be covered shouldn't it? I haven't heard of them taking anything out before!


Alex

I've looked through my copy and cannot find the bit about having 2 jobs - what page is it on

EDIT - i've just checked pages 53 to 79 again in the 'drivers hours & rest periods' section of the 'Official DSA THEORY test book for drivers of large vehicles' and still cannot find it

[mrpj]

None of the above is included in the present theory and I believe should be to prevent breaches of the EU regs/law.

I know this has cropped up quite a few times on here but how common is it really? To be fair the theory syllabus can't cover every scenario

[ROG]

None of the above is included in the present theory and I believe should be to prevent breaches of the EU regs/law.

I know this has cropped up quite a few times on here but how common is it really? To be fair the theory syllabus can't cover every scenario

I know it cannot but it does seem that this question has been answered quite a few times on here.

[Scarab]

ROG,

I don't have the book, its covered in the theory section on the DVD. The one they sell at WH Smith!

Its also covered in the little brown VOSA Tachograph book they give to those who pass the test. Or at least they give it out at my local test station! (Lancing)

Alex

[mrpj]

Its also covered in the little brown VOSA Tachograph book they give to those who pass the test.

Is it just my imagination or did you used to get a video from VOSA about hours when you passed? I'm sure I got one

[Scarab]

When I was there I got a DVD on drivers hours, a brown booklet about hours and how to fill in a paper tacho and use a digi tacho.
I also got a "New drivers" 16 page "paper" a digi tacho application form, a walkround poster and about 10 other leaflets.

Our local VOSA office has them in bundles at the "check in" desk, where you go to wait for a test, or book in a vehicle for its MOT.

I always pick up the latest one when I go past, or in there, the staff are very helpful, unlike their ironically named helpine

Alex

[alexc]

Is it just my imagination or did you used to get a video from VOSA about hours when you passed? I'm sure I got one

I certainly never got one of those! And yes, it is something which I'd imagine (judging from here and my own experience) causes fairly regular confusion.

[Clarky]

All I was given when I passed was my pass paper, pat on the back and 10p for a coffee out of the machine!!!!

Oh and a comprehensive booklet listing all the greasy spoons within 30 miles!!!!!

[Speed Freak]

All I got was my pass certificate!

There is also the fact that in the week (Sunday Midnight to Sunday Midnight) where they did come under EU regs, they must fill in a seperate tacho chart for each of the days worked in their other job and those charts must contain their name, start & finish time for each day.

OK, picked up some tacho's. Do I only have to fill in my name and hours worked for non driving full time work?

Sorry to appear a bit dim no this but I don't recall this being mentioned at all during training.

[ROG]

All I got was my pass certificate!

There is also the fact that in the week (Sunday Midnight to Sunday Midnight) where they did come under EU regs, they must fill in a seperate tacho chart for each of the days worked in their other job and those charts must contain their name, start & finish time for each day.

OK, picked up some tacho's. Do I only have to fill in my name and hours worked for non driving full time work?

Sorry to appear a bit dim no this but I don't recall this being mentioned at all during training.

It is not taught in training.

if you came under EU regs in that week then yes - just name, start & finish times on each one.
If not driving under EU regs in that week - don't bother

[FlyDrive]

I have been filling in a Weekly Record Sheet as described in Annex 3 of GV262 to record weekday work when doing the weekend driving thing.

Does this sound OK or should I be filling in Tacho discs instead?

[ROG]

I have been filling in a Weekly Record Sheet as described in Annex 3 of GV262 to record weekday work when doing the weekend driving thing.

Does this sound OK or should I be filling in Tacho discs instead?

Tacho discs or digi manual entries are. I believe, the only ones allowed.

Remember - you only have to fill them in for the week in which you came under EU driving regs.

If in a Mon to Fri job then you can usually only legally manage to do 1 driving shift every other weekend.

If driving every other weekend, then only every other week needs filling out with a seperate tacho used for each day.

Each daily tacho should just have your name, start & finish times on it.

[Smart Mart]

Recording other work Drivers must record all other work and periods of availability — including work for other employers — on all driving and non-driving days within a week where they have undertaken driving that comes within the scope of the EU rules on drivers’ hours.

For example, a driver who works in a warehouse on Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday and wishes to drive a vehicle within the scope of the EU rules on Thursday of the same week must complete records for Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday.

The record must be either:

- written manually on a chart;
- written manually on a printout from a digital tachograph;
- made by using the manual input facility of a digital tachograph; or
- for days where a driver has been subject to the domestic drivers’ hours rules and a record is legally required (see page 25), recorded in a domestic log book.

For the non-driving days, the record may simply show the driver’s name, the date, and the start and finish of the shift. These records must be carried on the vehicle by the driver to be produced to enforcement officers for the relevant period (see individual sections on how to make manual entries).

[FlyDrive]

Looks like I've been misinterpreting this bit...

- for days where a driver has been subject to the domestic drivers’ hours rules and a record is legally required (see page 25), recorded in a domestic log book.

Best get myself a box of tachos.

Thank you

[madmossy]

What a daft rule that is.

Basically totally ruins any plans I had of bolstering my income by doing a couple agency shifts a week on top of the 25 hours I do currently split over 5 days. Instead I can now only do 1 shift every 2 weeks. And I never get a 45 hour rest period. As I work mon-thurs and sat. Or can that 45 hours rest be split over different days?

[ROG]

What a daft rule that is.

Basically totally ruins any plans I had of bolstering my income by doing a couple agency shifts a week on top of the 25 hours I do currently split over 5 days. Instead I can now only do 1 shift every 2 weeks. And I never get a 45 hour rest period. As I work mon-thurs and sat. Or can that 45 hours rest be split over different days?

Cannot be split

Are those 5 shifts always the same start and finish times and what times would they be ?

[madmossy]

All 5 shifts are 2-10pm occasionally finishing as early as 8pm.

[dar1976]

I have been filling in a Weekly Record Sheet as described in Annex 3 of GV262 to record weekday work when doing the weekend driving thing.

Does this sound OK or should I be filling in Tacho discs instead?

It depends which Vosa officer stops you.

Some will accept a weekly record in a log book / diary.

Others will be anal and only accept tacho charts.

I can't find it now but Jennie's post about it confirms she was ok to keep log book / diary as EU driving was not her primary activity.

[ROG]

All 5 shifts are 2-10pm occasionally finishing as early as 8pm.

Thats 40 hours .... I thought you said you do 25 hours ove 5 shifts ?

[dar1976]

I've just realised. This thread was started 4 and a half years ago.

Still not a record

[madmossy]

All 5 shifts are 2-10pm occasionally finishing as early as 8pm.

Thats 40 hours .... I thought you said you do 25 hours ove 5 shifts ?

I'm only contracted for 25 hours, rest is over time. Either way because of these daft rules I'd have to quit my job to do the LGV stuff which is a risk I cant take without a concrete job offer. The issue comes from never having 2 days off in a row which means I won't even be able to do 1 day a fortnight of LGV work while with my current employer.

[ROG]

All 5 shifts are 2-10pm occasionally finishing as early as 8pm.

Thats 40 hours .... I thought you said you do 25 hours ove 5 shifts ?

I'm only contracted for 25 hours, rest is over time. Either way because of these daft rules I'd have to quit my job to do the LGV stuff which is a risk I cant take without a concrete job offer. The issue comes from never having 2 days off in a row which means I won't even be able to do 1 day a fortnight of LGV work while with my current employer.

Is this regular job driving ?

[madmossy]

All 5 shifts are 2-10pm occasionally finishing as early as 8pm.

Thats 40 hours .... I thought you said you do 25 hours ove 5 shifts ?

I'm only contracted for 25 hours, rest is over time. Either way because of these daft rules I'd have to quit my job to do the LGV stuff which is a risk I cant take without a concrete job offer. The issue comes from never having 2 days off in a row which means I won't even be able to do 1 day a fortnight of LGV work while with my current employer.

Is this regular job driving ?

Yeah, drive a mercedes sprinter although being multi drop work I stop a lot on each route, usually 15-20 times for 5-10 minutes each stop.

Yesterday I did 6 hours 12 minutes for my shift, left depot at 15:40, got back to the depot at 20:56, did 15 deliveries with an average of 7 minutes stop time for each one.

5 hours 14 minutes on the road, 1 hour 45 minutes stationary or "other work" so, driving time was only 3 hours 29 minutes.

[ROG]

Are you required to keep domestic driving record sheets for that job ?

[madmossy]

Nope, no records are kept at all. At least not by me other to ensure I get paid correctly for the work i've done.

[ROG]

Nope, no records are kept at all. At least not by me other to ensure I get paid correctly for the work i've done.

Then you could still do one day of LGV driving every other week because no records will be needed for the week in which you did not EU regs driving

[madmossy]

That's better than nothing at least, just means it will take twice as long to get the money saved for the CAT C&E

[ROG]

That's better than nothing at least, just means it will take twice as long to get the money saved for the CAT C&E

Could do 2 out of 3 ....... viewtopic.php?f=2&t=93127&start=30#p1338099