Denied access to toilets

[Rikki-UK]

T&D is getting a large number of reports of RDC/warehouses refusing to let delivery drivers use their toilets quoting Covid-19 as an excuse.

T&D is following up these reports and reporting the companies to the HSE - the HSE have just released this statement-

Statement released this evening from the Health and Safety Executive. More to follow tomorrow. To reiterate: all companies banning drivers from accessing toilet and handwashing facilities are acting illegally.
Statement:

A HSE spokesperson said: “We are concerned about these reports.

“Any prevention of a driver to access welfare facilities is a breach of law, but more importantly is not the decent thing to do.

“Following a review process [in 2018], we updated our approach to say that drivers must have access to welfare facilities in the premises they visit as part of their work.

“This is even more crucial now. The latest advice is for hands to be washed regularly. Failure to allow access to welfare facilities may increase the risk of the COVID-19 infection spreading.

“In our view, the first thing drivers or their employers should do is remind those in control of the premises they visit of the legal requirement. We’ve previously been told the majority of duty holders do already provide reasonable access to toilets. They should still do so.”

Background

The law requires that sufficient toilet and washing facilities are to be provided at readily accessible places.

We re-examined the Workplace (Health, Safety and Welfare) Regulations 1992, in particular Regulations 20 and 21 and our website reflects this

If you are refused access or spot a note stating you as a delivering driver will not be allowed access to toilets take a photo of the note and post in here or e-mail me if you need to ensure your anonymity - T&D will be naming, shaming and reporting.

Also feel free to save this letter from Public Health England or print it off if possible of to show when you have been refused access

[ETS]

Well...maybe they're embarrassed they don't have any toilet paper and soap in the WC?

[CookieMonster]

I was in Hilton Park services this morning for a quick break. Went into he toilets for a slash, signs everywhere about washing your hands and using sanitizer, only for the dispensers to have been stolen off the wall!

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

[gregm171]

I copied this to my phone over a year ago from an Email I received, in readiness for a head butting session with Diageo personnel over a sign put up on a toilet facility entrance denying entry to Drivers on one of their sights.

Drivers facilities rights regs

Gaining access to toilet facilities can pose a daily challenge for HGV drivers, both on the road and when delivering to depots around the country.

After a long-running campaign, spearheaded by Gillian Kemp at Truckers Toilets (UK) and the Unite union, the Health and Safety Executive (HSE) announced last November that it was clarifying the regulations to make clear that duty-holders must provide facilities for visiting drivers.

At the same time it launched a campaign to raise employer awareness of this duty.

Yet HGV drivers are still reporting difficulties in gaining access to toilet facilities on certain sites. As CM’s own coverage has shown, the problem remains widespread, with offenders ranging from blue-chip high street retail giants, international IT companies and major logistics businesses through to family-owned haulage firms.
Driver complaints

Driver complaints include being refused access to any lavatory facilities, being told toilets are out of order or out of bounds to drivers, and being told to use toilets at nearby petrol stations, or even at local pubs.

Other drivers report access being granted begrudgingly, being made to sign for a key to the facilities or being met, once in the toilet facilities, with demeaning notices directed specifically at drivers, which lecture them on how to keep the facilities clean.

Clearly some duty-holders are just not getting the message. So what can drivers do, if they are denied access to toilet facilities?

One way drivers can fight back is to know their rights. The HSE told CM: “When a visiting delivery driver visits non-domestic premises as part of their work, the duty holder/employer at that workplace must –and not should, as it states in ACOP L124 – provide access to welfare facilities.”

An HSE spokesman added: “There is a legal requirement to provide visiting delivery drivers with access to toilets and washing facilities under the Workplace (Health, Safety and Welfare) Regulations 1992.”

Drivers who are denied this right should complain to the HSE, the spokesman said, adding that it “has a legal right to make enquiries about all allegations or complaints made to it” .

Unite is another source of support for drivers. Its campaign has organised pickets such as one at the Port of Liverpool last year, to protest about the lack of driver toilet facilities at the Seaforth container terminal.

Unite’s national officer Adrian Jones urges drivers to report any incidents to the union. “If employers continue to refuse our members access to toilets we will pursue them through all avenues open to us, and that will include naming and shaming companies that deny drivers the right to spend a penny,” he warns.

Michelle Barkley, the architectural representative on the DfT’s working group addressing this issue, advises truck drivers to carry a copy of the HSE clarification.
Lack of awareness

“There really is a low level of awareness among businesses,” she says, “so if a driver can show that announcement, their complaint will carry much more weight”.

She also recommends that drivers complaining to the HSE about being denied access to toilets should refer to the HSE’s recent clarification, since “not everyone at the HSE is necessarily aware of the regulations on this”.

Failure to provide toilet facilities for visiting drivers can create health hazards. Drivers who cannot access toilets are often forced to use the roadside or lay-bys, creating a health hazard for other travellers – not to mention the health hazard posed to consumers, if the drivers are delivering food and drinks.

Drivers denied access to toilet facilities are also in danger of developing a myriad of health problems including stomach pains, cramps, poor concentration, urinary tract infections, stretching of the bladder wall, kidney stones, chronic constipation and, in extreme cases, life-threatening conditions, such as impacted bowels.

[kevmac47]

I don't know if its still the same at Immingham dock, but access to the toilet facilities was forbidden to drivers. The only toilet was a thunderbox tucked away in a corner, it was disgusting! This was a couple of years ago, I don't suppose it's any different now. Regards Kev.

[gregm171]

I have just been denied access to the toilet facilities at William Grant storage in Cumbernauld. I rhymed off the HSE regs 1992. To be fair the woman is only doing as she's told by bosses, she apologised and went on to say they've been waiting for a portaloo since Monday for the drivers. Now, there is a toilet there specifically for Drivers atm but have put a sign up saying it's out of commission. The bastid!
Well I won't be buying any more Glenfiddich project XX from them if they think that drivers are just virus ridden, 3rd rate citizens!

[N0rbert]

T&D is getting a large number of reports of RDC/warehouses (...)

What is T&D ? Google pops up a black guy in the results.

[tachograph]

T&D is getting a large number of reports of RDC/warehouses (...)

What is T&D ? Google pops up a black guy in the results.

Truck & Driver.

The Truck & Driver magazine is published by the same people that this forum belongs to.

Truck & Driver

[Pallal]

Denied access to the whole building at Adelie in Milton Keynes, used to go in and unload it with the guys working in the back, now im forced to sit in the cab for 50 minutes and can't leave for any reason.

[N0rbert]

(...)The Truck & Driver magazine(...)

Thank you for the answer.

[Harry Monk]

If I wasn't allowed to use the toilet, I'd just lay a log in the middle of their yard.

[Colin_scottish]

I have just been denied access to the toilet facilities at William Grant storage in Cumbernauld. I rhymed off the HSE regs 1992. To be fair the woman is only doing as she's told by bosses, she apologised and went on to say they've been waiting for a portaloo since Monday for the drivers. Now, there is a toilet there specifically for Drivers atm but have put a sign up saying it's out of commission. The bastid!
Well I won't be buying any more Glenfiddich project XX from them if they think that drivers are just virus ridden, 3rd rate citizens!

Weird that i was there today and used the bog with no bother.I must have spoke in better manner.

[Washwipe]

And in the super soaraway Sun.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11203797/ ... et-access/

[gregm171]

Weird that i was there today and used the bog with no bother.I must have spoke in better manner.

I was polite to the woman, all I said was that according to HSE regs they can't deny me access to the facilities. She understood, but was only doing her job. The most annoying part is when I went to pick up my paperwork, there was a sign up on the window saying the toilet was out of use and a barrier up to stop you access.
The toilets there are for the drivers, the people who work there have their own facilities.

[edd1974]

I've never had an issues. If I'm someware and.need to go I just ask and they direct me where they are.
Although I don't do large rdcs etc. Delivery more to smaller companies .
One of the good things I guess about smaller companies some even offer you a brew

[biggriffin]

I'll just put this link here, it's a HSE pdf download about toilets, download it,or print it off and show to any jobs-worth who says Non.

https://www.ukhaulier.co.uk/news/road-t ... rns-union/

https://www.ukhaulier.co.uk/wp-content/ ... iation.pdf

[ben karlow]

I would urge anyone refused access to toilets to turn around and drive away. I've refused to deliver to sites that don't allow access to toilets, boss was understanding and said he couldn't understand why they do that but still sent other drivers who were mug enough to accept it. Don't be bullied by peon jobsworths!

[Wheel Nut]

I would urge anyone refused access to toilets to turn around and drive away. I've refused to deliver to sites that don't allow access to toilets, boss was understanding and said he couldn't understand why they do that but still sent other drivers who were mug enough to accept it. Don't be bullied by peon jobsworths!

Another Troll?

[Quinny]

And in the super soaraway Sun.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11203797/ ... et-access/

The article starts with good intent, then goes off on a tangent about queues around supermarkets.

All companies will do, is ignore anything the HSE says, as the fines that get levied are small in comparison. By the time anything is done, all of this will be over, we as drivers will be forgot about.

Ken.

[joeshell]

I don't know if its still the same at Immingham dock, but access to the toilet facilities was forbidden to drivers. The only toilet was a thunderbox tucked away in a corner, it was disgusting! This was a couple of years ago, I don't suppose it's any different now. Regards Kev.

still the same Kev(in the Cobelfret section)a disgusting portaloo in a corner of the trailer park,there are updates etc going on but it appears to be just the entry/exit system

[kevmac47]

I don't know if its still the same at Immingham dock, but access to the toilet facilities was forbidden to drivers. The only toilet was a thunderbox tucked away in a corner, it was disgusting! This was a couple of years ago, I don't suppose it's any different now. Regards Kev.

still the same Kev(in the Cobelfret section)a disgusting portaloo in a corner of the trailer park,there are updates etc going on but it appears to be just the entry/exit system

It was a double whammy Joe, the truck stop on the way from the A180 usually only had one working "netty", but I do know that's been upgraded in the last year or so. Regards Kev.

[LGVStuart]

Can't fault Jack Richardsons... more should do the same...

https://www.ukhaulier.co.uk/news/road-t ... acilities/

[Dave73-UK]

My place has given all drivers instructions to refuse to tip and inform the office if we are not given access to facilities on site. So far not had any issues anywhere.

[robroy]

Can't fault Jack Richardsons... more should do the same...

https://www.ukhaulier.co.uk/news/road-t ... acilities/

Doesn't Jack Richard's do a lot of work for Smith's packaging co ?
I was talking to a driver the other day (not JR's) who said the Livingston branch have notices up banning drivers from ALL facilities, and they have installed a portaloo to get around it.
Don't know about you lot but I hate those [zb] things , I've refused to use them before, telling them 'When I see you use it, I'll use it,.where are the proper facilities''.

Thing is though, if that is a valid way of getting around the h&s rules, I bet more firms will do it, and you can sure as hell bet it will continue to be the thing there on after all this present situation is over.

[Dipper_Dave]

To true but a thunder box without hot water is a no no also a confined space and virus breeding ground is unacceptable especially with warmer weather coming.

If in doubt pull out is my moto...ehhh ok not in every situation obvs..

[rob22888]

Can't fault Jack Richardsons... more should do the same...

https://www.ukhaulier.co.uk/news/road-t ... acilities/

Doesn't Jack Richard's do a lot of work for Smith's packaging co ?
I was talking to a driver the other day (not JR's) who said the Livingston branch have notices up banning drivers from ALL facilities, and they have installed a portaloo to get around it.
Don't know about you lot but I hate those [zb] things , I've refused to use them before, telling them 'When I see you use it, I'll use it,.where are the proper facilities''.

Thing is though, if that is a valid way of getting around the h&s rules, I bet more firms will do it, and you can sure as hell bet it will continue to be the thing there on after all this present situation is over.

Nothing like being pointed in the direction of a portaloo to make you feel like your regarded as a class below.

Alright for a quick slash but the moment someone has a sit down in there & the sun bakes it, they become the pits. Also highly doubt them things hold enough water for every driver to spend 20 seconds thoroughly washing their hands & a trickle of cold water is hardly adequate anyway.

[Sand Fisher]

Hi Rikki,

Just to let you know that on Wed 25th March whilst working for Fed Ex I did a delivery and collection from Wright Dental Supplies in Dundee. https://www.wright-cottrell.co.uk/

I was told we were absolutely barred from entering the premiseses to go to the toilet or use the wash hand basins and that 'Fed Ex know that!". I replied it was against the law, but they wouldn't have it. I decided not to have a row and said I'd report it.

I have decided to complain to HSE.

This is a regular daily collection and they have two deliveries/collections per weekday (cages in, cages+products out).

[Dipper_Dave]

This is a prime example of how lower than low we are thought of, I have emailed company about this but don't hold up much hope of a reply.

Pulling out is the only option as hygeine requirements are to poor, yes there's always some one who will do it but that pool is getting smaller and smaller.

Before tipping I always ask if I can use toilets, if no I pull out company will back me 100%.

[Dipper_Dave]

Course I'm in the minority as most put up with this b ollox.

[Dipper_Dave]

How hard is it to invest in a 12' portacabin for drivers ablutions.
But we only drivers aren't we....