100% UNION !!!
Just look at the railway. Better pay and T+Cs
Oh and £16 a month is a bargain. I pay £29.50 a month
#Aslef
eagerbeaver:
No, don’t waste your money. You will end up getting the same pay rise anyway. Drag the job out too, that way you make even more dough.
LOL 
Classic im alright Jack. F. everyone else. Class !!!
Reading this thread I’m quite surprised.
We usually get mostly negative views about Unions on here, from the generation that were state anti Union brainwashed in the education system and it’s syllabus,.and other older guys with a biased selective memory.
I remember reading one of my lads history books when he was at school, the bit about exploited workers in poverty fighting as a ‘union’ with a small ‘u’ to get fairness in employment by ruthless mill owners and the like, to form the Labour Party solely for the benefit of the working class to better themselves socially (wtf happened there btw 
) was glossed over, …but surprise surprise, the 70s period where power went to the Union leader’s heads and the country was held to ransom to the point of being on it’s knees, was well concentrated on.
That is why the words ‘Trade Union’ are classed as dirty by many today…to keep ‘US’ in our place.
truckerjimbo:
eagerbeaver:
No, don’t waste your money. You will end up getting the same pay rise anyway. Drag the job out too, that way you make even more dough.LOL
Classic im alright Jack. F. everyone else. Class !!!
That’s the way the mop flops with me now Jim. Sick to death of watching the weak capitulating around me and folding like envelopes.
It’s all about The Beaver now mate, I’m gonna suckle on the sick pay teat next, my back’s playing up 
It must be all that carrying cash I do from selling pallets 
Just ask the firemen,train drivers, tanker drivers… we had transport general workers but haulage was to fragmented some drivers did not join thought it was not very good they did good things but some I think were silly ie objected to cb radio, objected to sleeper cabs even though a lot of the digs in those days were not to good but yea join one
I’m not in a Union affiliated company but am in a Union.
Past 10yrs I’m £25k better off in my bank due to Union backing in pay/indust injury/TUPE disputes with Employers!!!
Any truck driver not in a Union needs head looked@ IMHO!!! 
maga:
interesting point about non union members being first in the firing line should the company need to cut back.
.
TBH that doesnt make sense to me. Redundancy has to be done on a matrix, ie accident records, lateness, any customer complaints. IIRC I had 2 drivers that were in a union, the rest weren’t. If I had had to make a decision on making people redundancy, then if they were or weren’t in a union was not in any way part of the decision making.
Unions have lots of perks, so in monetary terms it probably is worth it.
When I was employed I was never in a union, no idea if any of my colleagues were and I was quite happy dealing with a wage negotiation myself. My only contacts with unions were extremely negative it would not be something I would do. Never worked for a large company though.
albion:
TBH that doesnt make sense to me. Redundancy has to be done on a matrix, ie accident records, lateness, any customer complaints
I think if that was criteria for redundancy then a company would be in a very grey legal area !
Pretty sure it’s based on seniority and then If two are same then it comes down to level of absence etc
You cant make a senior redundant over a junior on absence or complaints ( unfortunately) as they’ll have ■■■■ good case for tribunal
As for non union over union members that’s just a complete load of bollox from a brainwashed moron !
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Just to state the bleeding obvious for a minute.
Just imagine there was something like a 70 to 90% union membership amongst UK drivers, do you reckon we would be on the terms and conditions that most of us are on now?
Would we be expected to do some of the unfair and unreasonable things that some of you are doing now?
Would the job in other words be a lot better now?
You decide, but first have a word with any mates you may have who work in a Union recognised firm.
dcgpx:
albion:
TBH that doesnt make sense to me. Redundancy has to be done on a matrix, ie accident records, lateness, any customer complaints
I think if that was criteria for redundancy then a company would be in a very grey legal area !
Pretty sure it’s based on seniority and then If two are same then it comes down to level of absence etc
You cant make a senior redundant over a junior on absence or complaints ( unfortunately) as they’ll have ■■■■ good case for tribunal
As for non union over union members that’s just a complete load of bollox from a brainwashed moron !
gov.uk/staff-redundant/comp … redundancy
From the gov. Site it specifically says do not rely on length of service.
As part of a matrix you can include length of service.
From an employers pov, if you have redundancy to make and all other things being equal, then the newest drivers would logically go as the costs are less.
However had a senior driver (perhaps he had been good at one point) suddenly started telling customers to F off, had 3 accidents in 6 months, (a responsible employer would have a friendly chat to say what’s up, are you well, hows your home life), then that’s grounds in a redundancy situation to let him go and keep someone with less time under their belt.
I’m not quite sure what you are talking about when you say non members over union members…I was clear that if I was preparing for a redundancy situation it made not a jot of difference if they were or were not union members
And I’m hardly a moron. Not when I ran a successful business for years in a sector notorious for failure.
Seen redundancies at one unionised place, severance money so good it paid the most recent arrivals to volunteer, most of the drivers went voluntarily, pay offs involved ranging from £11k lowest been there 9 months up to around £50k (driver’s packages i can’t recall what office staff received), most were happy to go, i applied to go but they refused which just about sums up my luck, some dead wood was also shifted compulsorily.
I know two chaps from another place who walked away with over £100k severance plus final salary pensions intact.
All proper unionised outfits.
My main issue with drivers who won’t join the union where its recognised, is their inability to work out why the job is so well paid and termed, selfish mean tight or just a bit thick?, its often those who refuse to join who take unfair advantage of the generous terms anyway (ie sickies damage general incompetence) thereby putting the whole job at risk for everyone.
albion:
And I’m hardly a moron. Not when I ran a successful business for years in a sector notorious for failure.
I was referring to the OP statement that non- union were first choice over union members. That was the part that I thought was bollox
In no way was I inferring you were a moron. Sincere apologies if it came across that way!!
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Here’s a quote from an early trade unionist Mary MacArthur. Substitute “driver” for “women” and yes, I do realise some can be both.
“Women are unorganised because they are badly paid, and poorly paid because they are unorganised.”
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If everyone else is in it yes I’d join and it sounds like the Union has worked well at your place…
Now we once tried to get the URTU Union in at a large general haulier I worked at only about 40-50% of drivers joined and the other “yes” men called us all militant but then moaned like hell when they were not happy.
My mate drives for freightliner and I believe there Union is quite beneficial…
My wife is a teacher and there Union has helped her out a few times.
I honestly can’t believe that a massive industry like road transport hasn’t got a powerful union backing it,most of the problems would disappear.
Look at the RMT for railway workers and tell me that’s not successful for workers
Thought I would return to this ancient thread to say that I’m now a fully paid up member of the union.
My previous comment about redundancies wasn’t relating to any official process, more that I’ve been told by the old boys (most of whom are supervisors) that it’s a headache for management to sack union members because they go to the steward and ask for advice and he then goes through all the in and outs and makes sure that the process has been followed to the tee, unlike other instances where the driver usually just moans a bit and then looks for another job.
Apparently the steward was good during the start of the covid situation when our employer tried to put the night workers onto day shifts at short notice due to lack of work and told them that they wouldn’t be getting their £2 an hour shift allowance. Many of the newer drivers didn’t receive their proper t&c’s with their contract (they’re in a separate document) and just got the offer letter and the general company policies document - I had to chase HR for a couple of months to get my proper terms in writing when I started. So these guys didn’t know their exact contractual rights.
However, the union rep knew all the details and told the manager that he couldn’t just stop paying the shift allowance and change the shift at a couple days notice. One guy is now getting his £500 a month bonus (for working with hazardous substances) despite now being on trade waste for the foreseeable future and originally it was taken off him by the manager.
So in summary the union has my full respect and I have the confidence that once covid passes they will get back to ensuring our £2 an hour pay rise is sorted to put us on a level with the other drivers who joined just before us (company had agreed before covid to do this).
Union yes , had to use them once over a Straight to the sack disaplinary the outside union official wiped the floor wae the management over taking a phone call from a member of the public and not checking if I was even in the area or the reg o the wagon o was in!. ,
Tailschwing:
Thought I would return to this ancient thread to say that I’m now a fully paid up member of the union.My previous comment about redundancies wasn’t relating to any official process, more that I’ve been told by the old boys (most of whom are supervisors) that it’s a headache for management to sack union members because they go to the steward and ask for advice and he then goes through all the in and outs and makes sure that the process has been followed to the tee, unlike other instances where the driver usually just moans a bit and then looks for another job.
Apparently the steward was good during the start of the covid situation when our employer tried to put the night workers onto day shifts at short notice due to lack of work and told them that they wouldn’t be getting their £2 an hour shift allowance. Many of the newer drivers didn’t receive their proper t&c’s with their contract (they’re in a separate document) and just got the offer letter and the general company policies document - I had to chase HR for a couple of months to get my proper terms in writing when I started. So these guys didn’t know their exact contractual rights.
However, the union rep knew all the details and told the manager that he couldn’t just stop paying the shift allowance and change the shift at a couple days notice. One guy is now getting his £500 a month bonus (for working with hazardous substances) despite now being on trade waste for the foreseeable future and originally it was taken off him by the manager.
So in summary the union has my full respect and I have the confidence that once covid passes they will get back to ensuring our £2 an hour pay rise is sorted to put us on a level with the other drivers who joined just before us (company had agreed before covid to do this).
Turkeys voting for Christmas.
I understand what a lot of guys and girls are saying here - Unions are good they stick up for your rights and negotiate on your behalf for better terms and conditions . I get that and its a good thing.
In a previous job I was a member of a union (non transport related ) and had what I thought was a great union rep who fought my corner. Problem was I wanted to fight a case against me but was told to accept the outcome of a disiplinary hearing which included a final written warning only to be told after the final meeting that he was now finished with the union and that I was his last case and he was glad to have it "all sorted out "but it wasn’t the proper and right outcome . I cancelled my membership right there in front of him with a phonecall , I walked back into the meeting room and told the panel exactly where they could stick their final warning and the job , walked out and went home . I vowed I’d never work to a shower like them ever again and I haven’t and I’d never depend on a Union to fight for my rights again . If a company has so little regard for their workers and the terms and conditions why are people working to them ■■ Drivers have to realise their own worth , they have reailse that with out them nothing happens , promises can’t be kept , deadlines won’t be met and customers won’t be happy and if an employer can’t realise that then they really aren’t worth working for . That said to many drivers are hiding behing unions and using a union to cover the fact that they aren’t capable of doing the job depending on the union to bail them out everytime they get caught messing it up .
Drivers need to do what they are employed to do . They also need to realise transport dosen’t always go to plan and things go wrong from time to time and you need to be prepared for that and accept it - its not all a great conspiricy against you (unless it is and then you need to walk ).
Find a job you like - good work , good plant , good office staff and good hours
Be good at it - do your job , do it well
Take no nonsence from office staff , customers or suppliers never be so settled that you can’t pick all up and walk
Once others realise your not a pushover you’ll find the job gets a lot easier
Never work for bad money - work out what you need to pay the bills and don’t put yourself in a pile of debt just to keep up with the neighbours , but never turn down the chance of a pay rise either .
beefy4605:
I understand what a lot of guys and girls are saying here - Unions are good they stick up for your rights and negotiate on your behalf for better terms and conditions . I get that and its a good thing.
In a previous job I was a member of a union (non transport related ) and had what I thought was a great union rep who fought my corner. Problem was I wanted to fight a case against me but was told to accept the outcome of a disiplinary hearing which included a final written warning only to be told after the final meeting that he was now finished with the union and that I was his last case and he was glad to have it "all sorted out "but it wasn’t the proper and right outcome . I cancelled my membership right there in front of him with a phonecall , I walked back into the meeting room and told the panel exactly where they could stick their final warning and the job , walked out and went home . I vowed I’d never work to a shower like them ever again and I haven’t and I’d never depend on a Union to fight for my rights again . If a company has so little regard for their workers and the terms and conditions why are people working to them ■■ Drivers have to realise their own worth , they have reailse that with out them nothing happens , promises can’t be kept , deadlines won’t be met and customers won’t be happy and if an employer can’t realise that then they really aren’t worth working for . That said to many drivers are hiding behing unions and using a union to cover the fact that they aren’t capable of doing the job depending on the union to bail them out everytime they get caught messing it up .
Drivers need to do what they are employed to do . They also need to realise transport dosen’t always go to plan and things go wrong from time to time and you need to be prepared for that and accept it - its not all a great conspiricy against you (unless it is and then you need to walk ).Find a job you like - good work , good plant , good office staff and good hours
Be good at it - do your job , do it well
Take no nonsence from office staff , customers or suppliers never be so settled that you can’t pick all up and walk
Once others realise your not a pushover you’ll find the job gets a lot easier
Never work for bad money - work out what you need to pay the bills and don’t put yourself in a pile of debt just to keep up with the neighbours , but never turn down the chance of a pay rise either .
What you say is 100% correct…BUT.
The way things are nowadays, firms prefer those who range from complete yes men arse crawlers, to those who just take whatever is dished out, and those in between.
They don’t want those who can be left to work on their own and use their initiative any more (an absolute crucial qualification to be a driver once over) because 9 times out of 10 that quality is usually backed up by an attitude of standing up for yourself,.and not taking any b/s.
They want men who ring in for instructions for the least little thing, who thrive on their micro management techniques, people like us are a dying breed in transport…we’re dinosaurs 
Prefer to be a dinosaur to something between a weasel and a chicken though.
Just the other day I was pulled up by a young guy in a ‘Compliance’ capacity, for ‘not taking seriously’ an infringement for being 2 mins over my wtd, and 3 mins on another occasion …followed by a comment on my ‘‘attitude’’ after telling him ‘‘I simply couldn’t give a ■■■■’’
Which went along the lines of…‘‘If you think like that, maybe you should think of getting a job that you do give a ■■■■ about, as compliance is what it’s all about today’’
I told him thanks for that, I’ll write it down, or words to that effect.
What I SHOULD have said was ‘‘I actually once did give a ■■■■ about the job,.around the time before you were born’’…but I’m bothered with afterthought.
Unions are a good thing in industry, despite what the brainwashers and the brainwashed tell you.
The state of play now is virtually how it was when unions were first thought of, in the days of oppressive employers and zero rights.