I’ve wondered why we haven’t had more in the way of driverless trains in the uk by now.
Surely that’s the place to start.
Union power I guess
truckyboy:
Well said Harry…but i still dont think its gonna happen for many years, thats almost space age technology ? As for the snow chains, many countries insist drivers carry them, and use them where necessary, i had my fair share when i was on middle east work…just cos you never used them, doesnt mean theyre not needed.
Whenever the snow was that bad, I used to pull my snow curtains. 
kr79:
I’ve wondered why we haven’t had more in the way of driverless trains in the uk by now.
Surely that’s the place to start.
Union power I guess
Yes, rail workers have very powerful and organised trades unions who are able to bring the network shuddering to a halt…Really, this is what the current Southern dispute is about, it’s nothing to do with “who closes the doors”, it’s the Train Operating Company testing the water ahead of driverless trains making their arrival.
Harry Monk:
Once all vehicles are autonomous the roads would be far less congested. Vehicles will be able to travel safely at speed keeping far less linear separation. Eventually I imagine traffic lights will become redundant, but imagining we still had them, every vehicle waiting would be able to move off together the moment they turned green.I also think the idea of personal car ownership would die out when an autonomous car could be summoned within minutes removing the need to keep a stationary car outside one’s home unused for 160+ hours a week.
I have a vision of yummy mummies setting their oversized 4x4s to simply circle the town centre looking for parking whilst they enjoy coffee with other yummy mummies, town centres will be completely grid locked with circling empty SUVs.
I also predict a new type of anti social behaviour as half wits take advantage of the fact that autonomous vehicles will never loose their temper and do anything rash. they will walk out in front of them, or wobble along the road on bikes knowing that the car or lorry will just wait.
Never under estimate how utterly bizarrely brits will behave.
Harry Monk:
kr79:
I’ve wondered why we haven’t had more in the way of driverless trains in the uk by now.
Surely that’s the place to start.
Union power I guessYes, rail workers have very powerful and organised trades unions who are able to bring the network shuddering to a halt…Really, this is what the current Southern dispute is about, it’s nothing to do with “who closes the doors”, it’s the Train Operating Company testing the water ahead of driverless trains making their arrival.
Yeah I am of the opinion that’s the real reason of the strike.
I use the DLR regularly and although it’s only small fry even compared to the London Underground it on the whole works well and has been going since the 80s
I remember reading a thing about professions that will become obsolete through technology in the next 50 years and a lot were obviously simple manual labour jobs and things like drivers but I was shocked there was a few jobs that were ones that people had trained for a number of years for and were of a more professional nature such as accountants.
I think the nature of truck driving will change in the medium term a lot of the motorway trunking will be done by platooning vehicles but there will be human controlfor urban driving for longer and certain vehicles will need a human to oversea and control loading unloading securing loads and a few other things.
As Harry says for it to realy work the whole road network would need to be automated vehicles.
Humans and automated vehicles mixing will be where the problems start
An lot of very interesting comments so far.
Maybe there’s two or three different threads running through here?
The technology to drive a truck is here. I would think that a truck is easier to drive than an aircraft is to land, and technology manages that very well. In fog it manages better than Biggles could. Twenty years ago who imagined mobile phones (hand held computers) like ours?
Problems have been pointed out though in that trucks of today mix with city traffic as well as cyclists and pedestrians. Aircraft don’t. Trucks on motorways tomorrow, no problem. Trucks on dedicated routes yesterday. Mixing automated vehicles into the existing system will cause problems but I’ll bet they’ll be shortlived. Existing autonomous vehicles are, (Tesla) already safer than human controlled ones.
Automation taking work? Well, there is a major problem coming here I would say. Many commentators say ‘technology had always created more opportunities than losses’. So far there is some measure of truth in that.
But in the past a growing population was a good thing- our whole UK Welfare State exists because it is a Ponzi scheme, a pyramid. It needs youngsters to support the elderly.
In the past more oil to burn was thought good, now we realise (most of us) that burning carbon is killing the planet for those following us.
So, rules from the past can’t always be carried forward. Technology won’t always mean more work for all of us.
Seems to me that the difference between the haves and have nots is increasing and a loss of some jobs and dumbing - down of others with both cuts on pay and satisfaction will end badly.
It’ll end badly for all of society unless we get some new ideas soon.
Sent from my GT-S7275R using Tapatalk
kr79:
Yeah I am of the opinion that’s the real reason of the strike.
I use the DLR regularly and although it’s only small fry even compared to the London Underground it on the whole works well and has been going since the 80s
The Victoria Line on the London Underground will celebrate its 50th birthday in 2018, and it has used automated train operation since the day it opened. The trains still carry drivers but they don’t control the trains in any way.
There was a time when thousands of people were employed as telephone switchboard operators, lift operators, or to pump petrol into cars. These jobs have disappeared now. In twenty years time, the majority of truck driving jobs will have gone the same way.
wheelnutt:
Captain Caveman 76:
Harry Monk:
gooddriver:
Bollockks, I was hoping for a few ‘it’ll never happen’ replies, im 31 so looks like im [zb] and out of work by 50 will ave to start learning to wipe bumsThey’re not spending billions of pounds on it just to give themselves something to do on a slow Tuesday afternoon.
Because ALL research is worthwhile!
entrepreneur.com/article/275060
“There’s a simple trick to determine liberals from conservatives.
Phew, someone’s figured this out. It seems that it’s all just in the words. Conservatives like to use nouns more than liberals. For example, they would tend to call people “optimists” instead of “optimistic” or an “idealist” instead of “idealistic.” The findings, published in the Journal of Political Psychology, were consistent across the three countries, looking at speeches in three different languages. The study found, for example, that George W. Bush (a conservative) used more nouns in his speech than his liberal counterparts. Of course, most of those nouns only contained three or four letters, but still…”Number 3 is a cracker!!!
Don’t forget, the government dishes out cash to organisations for their studies. Not so long ago, renewable energies were flavour of the month. Now it’s driverless vehicles.
A quick tally on google [other search engines available] and between the manufacturers and the tech companies 16 Billion has been invested so far, we are not talking about government research grants here.
These manufacturers are not investing that kind of money if it is just a pipe dream or if it takes them 10 years to get a return on their investments, their shareholders and the banks would be up in arms.
Are you sure there isn’t at least some government money involved, the last 2 companies I worked at received Governments grants because they could prove they were involved in R&D work and we aren’t talking about small figures but quite sizable amounts for companies that only employed a handful of people.
From what I’ve read they expect platooning to be operating in some placed before the end of the decade, this will involve a group of trucks all with drivers, locking onto the back of a lead truck where the lead driver will continue to drive. On stretches of motorways without slip roads the will run close together, but then open a gap as they approach a slip road. Not quite sure what happens when another vehicle gets between them when they split for slip roads, whether the truck will remain linked to the lead truck or the drivers will have to take over again.
I’ve seen estimates of fully autonomous trucks by 2030, but firstly on motorway only operations, where either a driver will take over as it leaves the motorway or it will go into a reception centre to be collect by a local drivers for local deliveries, but the aim is to end up with a fully autonomous delivery system.
Which I’m sure will happen as a capitalist system will always look for the cheapest operation, with little regard for the workforce.
But if robotics and automation doesn’t create new opportunities for work and makes vast sections of the Worlds workers unemployed I’d predict civil unrest. It’s not only Truck drivers or even workers in the West that are at rick, if you can automate a factory why do you need to to use a factory full of cheap labour in the far east.
Bluey Circles:
gooddriver:
How far away are these? Will we be out of a job in about 20 years?I guess a very different job with only local work - all long distance will be gone in 20 years, lorries will drive themselves up and down the motorway network.
over 155 million autonomous miles covered in the USA with only 1 fatality (1 every 90million miles is the average) so even at the testing stage it is already performing better than humans.
Robotics will take over most things, Employment in the future will revolve around caring, folk will spend their careers wiping old peoples bottoms until they themselves become old and need their own bottoms wiped by the next generation. The future is bleak, we have seen the best of it.
Gulp
Imagine a driverless truck that still has a driver. It detects the driver has gone sleep and takes over the controls and drives the truck to a service station. Pulls up and parks up. Curtains close and the Tacho goes on to break. 45 mins later an alarm goes off waking the driver up who’s wondering why the ■■■■ it’s pitch black in his cab.
The trucks saved lives and given the driver a much needed over due break.
Ground breaking isn’t it.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
“There’s a simple trick to determine liberals from conservatives.
Phew, someone’s figured this out. It seems that it’s all just in the words. Conservatives like to use nouns more than liberals. For example, they would tend to call people “optimists” instead of “optimistic” or an “idealist” instead of “idealistic.” The findings, published in the Journal of Political Psychology, were consistent across the three countries, looking at speeches in three different languages. The study found, for example, that George W. Bush (a conservative) used more nouns in his speech than his liberal counterparts. Of course, most of those nouns only contained three or four letters, but still…”
Number 3 is a cracker!!! 
Don’t forget, the government dishes out cash to organisations for their studies. Not so long ago, renewable energies were flavour of the month. Now it’s driverless vehicles.
[/quote]
A quick tally on google [other search engines available] and between the manufacturers and the tech companies 16 Billion has been invested so far, we are not talking about government research grants here.
These manufacturers are not investing that kind of money if it is just a pipe dream or if it takes them 10 years to get a return on their investments, their shareholders and the banks would be up in arms.
[/quote]
Are you sure there isn’t at least some government money involved, the last 2 companies I worked at received Governments grants because they could prove they were involved in R&D work and we aren’t talking about small figures but quite sizable amounts for companies that only employed a handful of people.
From what I’ve read they expect platooning to be operating in some placed before the end of the decade, this will involve a group of trucks all with drivers, locking onto the back of a lead truck where the lead driver will continue to drive. On stretches of motorways without slip roads the will run close together, but then open a gap as they approach a slip road. Not quite sure what happens when another vehicle gets between them when they split for slip roads, whether the truck will remain linked to the lead truck or the drivers will have to take over again.
I’ve seen estimates of fully autonomous trucks by 2030, but firstly on motorway only operations, where either a driver will take over as it leaves the motorway or it will go into a reception centre to be collect by a local drivers for local deliveries, but the aim is to end up with a fully autonomous delivery system.
Which I’m sure will happen as a capitalist system will always look for the cheapest operation, with little regard for the workforce.
But if robotics and automation doesn’t create new opportunities for work and makes vast sections of the Worlds workers unemployed I’d predict civil unrest. It’s not only Truck drivers or even workers in the West that are at rick, if you can automate a factory why do you need to to use a factory full of cheap labour in the far east.
[/quote]
I remember reading a thing about a top union man been shown round a car factory in America and the manager pointing out some new machinery saying it saves so many jobs it never goes sick never has a holiday etc this is the future.
The union man pointed out It will also never buy a car either.
Yes self drive trucks, trains and cars are here and unfortunately are here to stay. When they become mainstream and are everywhere, everyone will no longer be worrying about nuclear weapons. An emp weapon would kill just about everyone in a vehicle in the blast radius and would be undetectable.
I personally am too set in my ways and am too untrusting of technology to want one get in a driverless vehicle. My phone dies on a regular basis expand that to anything tech and you have trouble.
two decades away hopefully,then I will be retired and not have to worry about it
20 years sounds a bit optimistic from our point of view I’m afraid. Heard a news report that driverless trucks could be coming in in the usa in around three years. Once they’re in there its not going to be long before they’re in here.
It’s going to pose a real problem for the government though. There’s about a million professional drivers in the uk, taxi’s, van’s aswell as hgv’s. Thats a lot of people that are going to need to claim benefits.
Our best hope is that the robot vehicles can’t handle maneuvering around our busy town centres.
Fake news, 3 years my arse.
I still stick by what I have said before in that the day a driverless truck can handle multi drop around Bradford or Blackburn or (insert said tight as ■■■■ crazy town here) is the day that I will be worried.
How is a driverless truck going to cope with mr uninsured driver who doesn’t give a ■■■■ and is belting around like a bat out of hell or the abandoned car parked right at the junction of the terraced street you have a delivery down?
Apart from the most vanilla truck driving imaginable it just isn’t feasible in the UK without a total overhaul of the entire road network.
Aurri:
http://www.recode.net/2017/2/25/14737842/embark-self-driving-trucks-automationAnd is there really a US driver shortage?
How is still having the driver aboard to take over once exiting the freeway, going to help with an alleged shortage?
You still need a driver, so how many journeys in the US are double manned, as this to me appears the only variable it will tackle.
Evil8Beezle:
Aurri:
http://www.recode.net/2017/2/25/14737842/embark-self-driving-trucks-automationAnd is there really a US driver shortage?
How is still having the driver aboard to take over once exiting the freeway, going to help with an alleged shortage?
You still need a driver, so how many journeys in the US are double manned, as this to me appears the only variable it will tackle.
I think what they want to do is to increase the hours the driver can do on the principle that they aren’t working on the Interstate sections of the journey.
Good old capitalism at it’s best, we’ll automate the job and reduce the pay and conditions of the workers, then we’ll get rid of them all together.
Everyone’s a winner,
well everyone that matters that is. 
muckles:
Evil8Beezle:
Aurri:
http://www.recode.net/2017/2/25/14737842/embark-self-driving-trucks-automationAnd is there really a US driver shortage?
How is still having the driver aboard to take over once exiting the freeway, going to help with an alleged shortage?
You still need a driver, so how many journeys in the US are double manned, as this to me appears the only variable it will tackle.I think what they want to do is to increase the hours the driver can do on the principle that they aren’t working on the Interstate sections of the journey.
Good old capitalism at it’s best, we’ll automate the job and reduce the pay and conditions of the workers, then we’ll get rid of them all together.
Everyone’s a winner,
well everyone that matters that is.
Sorry my bad, I wasn’t thinking cynically enough! 
