MOT Failure - Opinions Please

[paulypaul]

Background to the story: I had 2 x steer axle tyres fitted in May 2017 after damaging the existing tyres while up the road. Although I wasn't at my home tyre depot they replaced the tyres and sent the damaged off for major repair to use on the lift axle as spare if needed and I collected them a while later to bring back to the yard.

So, from May 2017. I've had 11 x PMI inspections at my dealer (12 weekly cycle) which included 2 annual MOT preparations and 2 DVLA MOT's, which all passed without any issues. Fast forward to end of October 2019 and I've had an MOT failure issued. I was taking the motor through myself so this is first hand info. The tester told me he was going to fail it cause the o/s front steer tyre had the wrong load rating? Every other tyre was ok but this one was rated at 7100kg when in fact it should have been rated at 7500kg (44t 6x2 unit). Literally after 5 minutes and before I even got into the shed to do any brake tests etc, my local tyre ATS were on site with a part worn, but compliant tyre. The fitter asked if the tester wanted to make sure he was happy with the tyre before fitting it, but the tester said he was going to fail anyway but suggested that if I ask nicely in the office, then they may agree to a retest at which point, if nothing else was found to be wrong, he would then issue a pass certificate...after firstly issuing me with a failure.

I did the rest of the test and no issues. DVLA tester issued a failure. I pulled truck out, tyre fitter replaced the tyre in question, which was in perfect condition apart from the load rating, then I went and told the tester. He came over, looked at the load rating, tapped the wheel nuts, even though he witnessed the fitter torque them up, then gave me a pass. However, a failure is now on my O licence score.

I spoke with the principle of the dealer and she tried to shrug it off by saying it was my responsibility to make sure the tyres were correct? OK, I know ultimately that the oness is on me to remain compliant, but surely the garage doing the 12 weekly PMI and pre MOT's have a duty of care to ensure that the truck does remain compliant, which is what I pay them for, isn't it? Not only have they missed this rogue tyre 11 times when inspecting the truck, but two DVLA testers have previously missed it. As far as ATS or Trucktyres as they are now, are concerned, they admit they have failed and are investigating it. The other tyre they fitted in May 2017 at the same time was correct.

My question is, what recourse do I have over the failure of my dealer to spot this defect 11 seperate times and what should I be expecting to be done by them, and by ATS. I'm just after opinions as I'm an owner driver so don't carry much clout as far as leverage with dealers etc cause its only one motor to them isn't it?

Thanks, Paul

[chaversdad]

You have been very unfortunate but i suppose ultimately your the one who presented it for test so the blame in Dvsa,s eyes will lie with yourself, i have one fail on my 20+ yr history for a seat slider that jumped off the rail, i popped it straight back on and he failed it then passed it without me even leaving the test lane ! Rang Vosa at the time and they werent interested but told me not to worry about it as it was an isolated incident and wouldnt adversely affect my OCRS score

[dieseldog999]

the mot tester is a fanny and should be posting on here pedantically telling us how wrong we all are in our day to day driving habits.
although in real life its something you wouldnt personally pick up on,then you allowed the tyre man to fit an incorrect tyre 2 years ago and the blame will just bounce back to yourself.
yo be fair,its always common/legal/sensible practice to have identical tyres on the same axle though he also could have held the ticket and let the tyre man fit the tyre without failing you.
they probably didnt have 2 correct ones so just bunged that one on to get the sale.

take a chill pill and be thankfull that no kittens were killed.

[Acorn]

By all means speak to t original tyre fitters, but in all honesty with the passage for time, they are unlikely to take any action as it could be open whether the tyre presented at test was the one they fitted
Nothing wrong with the testers approach, the paperwork is true reflection of the true condition in which the vehicle was presented

[paulypaul]

Yeah I get all that. The tester was bang on spotting it when 2 of his colleagues previously failed to on the last 2 tests so my beef isn't with DVSA. I had "allegedly" 2 identical tyres fitted at the same time but alas, one had a different load rating so although the size and brand were the same, they were not identical. Its clear that ATS just slipped up when they fitted them but my real concern is that although I missed it, the dealer has PMI'd the unit 11 times and not one of their fitters spotted it and was able to advise me accordingly.

Ironically, it was pmi'd the very morning of the test too so in effect, they allowed me to present a non compliant motor. What approach should I take with the dealer who is trying to swerve any culpability? They also invoiced for a retest too as its using the lane at their depot!

It can be proved it was the same tyre as I have the original job card which lists the 2 tyres fitted and their serial numbers which confirm what I'm saying about it being the same tyre.

[Trickydick]

Whoever prepped the truck is at fault, they should check the load ratings, it is simple old school stuff.

But and there is always a but, my view is an mot inpsection shoudl take longer than a mpi/inspection etc just so you have the time to check this anal stuff.
Plus add in the fact the incab plate hasnt shown tyre size or ply ratings for many years now, so if the mech has not got the info to check it against how can he check it?
The plate you have in your vehicle files should show the tyre info.

Against the mech he should have spotted they had different load ratings across the axle and known something was up.

[Trucky Mc truckface]

What rating is on the VTG7 And is the tyre dual rated ?. We have recently had the same . But the dual rating caused the confusion.

[hotel magnum]

all that is required is a plan of action to prevent it happening again, just issue a reminder to the tyre company you are with and your vehicle inspection people, put a notice on a wall asking drivers to check when having tyre changes away from base, (after showing then what to look for), keep copies in the file, job done, in the eyes of the traffic commissioner you cannot change what has happened and if you stop it happening again there is nothing more you can do.

[Punchy Dan]

I’ve never seen a tyre rated at 7100kg or 7500kg ,I pressume your on 315s so do you mean the adding up of 2 tyres and that they’re odd on the axle ? and don’t add up to the axle rating ?

[paulypaul]

I’ve never seen a tyre rated at 7100kg or 7500kg ,I pressume your on 315s so do you mean the adding up of 2 tyres and that they’re odd on the axle ? and don’t add up to the axle rating ?

Yeah they're 315's and it was on the front steer axle. 2 x identically branded tyres on the steer axle, just that one of them had a different load rating. Lesson learnt I suppose is to not trust anyone without double checking yourself. Mind you, I've kicked off with the garage who do the inspections cause they have also missed it on 11 separate inspections, even though it states that they have checked the condition and correct type of tyre is fitted.

[Punchy Dan]

Could just be the fact they’re odd more than owt else,my front axle is 8 tonne the tyres are rated at 3750kg each but that is use in North America,my rear lift is 7500kg it’s got the original wheels on from the factory 20 yrs ago but the wheels are rated at 3550kg each which only makes 7100kg no one has noticed (yet ) .

[cav551]

Of course all this could have been prevented if the OP had supplied a copy of the Plating Certificate and the garage had asked for it like used to be standard practice for an MOT preparation. Turn up for MOT without a VTG7 & it was an immediate VTG12 Refusal to Test.

[paulypaul]

Of course all this could have been prevented if the OP had supplied a copy of the Plating Certificate and the garage had asked for it like used to be standard practice for an MOT preparation. Turn up for MOT without a VTG7 & it was an immediate VTG12 Refusal to Test.

The "garage" 's the main dealer who supplied the motor.....you would have thought they would know the trch spec

[Punchy Dan]

Just out of interest what make and model were the tyres and what were the ratings as fitted ?

[Trickydick]

Of course all this could have been prevented if the OP had supplied a copy of the Plating Certificate and the garage had asked for it like used to be standard practice for an MOT preparation. Turn up for MOT without a VTG7 & it was an immediate VTG12 Refusal to Test.

The "garage" 's the main dealer who supplied the motor.....you would have thought they would know the trch spec

Different axles, different weight ratings hence different tyres load ratings.

The mech will say is it black and round and defo not diane abbot? then its good to go

[Punchy Dan]

Most 315s are 156 rated which is 4 tonne ,even such as Baurum and Khumo .so you must be fitting some pretty cheap jack tyres .

[norb]

Load ratings are the in thing at the moment ..We nearly sent a truck for test after it got it's new tyres ,luckily it was noticed the tyre fitter had fitted the wrong rating before it went

Yours is a difficult one as you also mention it had previously passed tests with those tyres..The dealer should have noticed ,but the tyre company should know all about tyres and fit the correct ones to begin with..So the blame is to both dealer and tyre company ..Both have failed ..But that is only my opinion

[paulypaul]

Yeah they were relatively budget tyres but thats no excuse really. I have stopped paying top dollar for branded tyres cause the boat yards and marinas I go into just end up killing them with damage so I have resigned myself o the fact that the tyre is going to get damaged before it wears out. Having said that, the two front tyres fitted in 2017 were holding up really well and have plenty of miles left in them.

I still reckon it was an error that was missed too many times, not only by myself. Currently the tyre company are investigating and the dealer has forwarded my letter to them to their regional director as I intimated that it reflected a lack of compliance across the board with their practice and that they clearly were not achieving the standards expected of them by the DVSA. Yet to have a response though.

[cav551]

A quick look at Continental Tyres' data gives some idea of the different load indices which apply to the single fitment of particular sizes of tyre which could be fitted to either of the front two (steering) axles.

(275/70 R22.5 index 148 150 151 or 152)
295/80 R22.5 index 152 or 154
305/70 R22.5 index 150 152 or 154
315/70 R22.5 index 152 154 or 156
315/80 R22.5 index 154 156 or 158

The load relating to the load index numbers has to be looked up either in the tyre manufacturer's data when refers to one tyre or in the HGV tester's manual when it refers to one axle.

As pointed out the actual plated weight of an axle varies according to manufacturer and to the vehicle specification ordered by the original purchaser. The plated weight can differ between axles one and two as can the actual size of tyre.

The information required for the vehicle to pass MOT is detailed on the VTG7.

[Punchy Dan]

The 295 has the load range that varies the most easy to get caught out ,when I looked at updating continental were the only makers of 315 that was rated beyond 4 tonne to iirc 4250 .

[manski]

A quick look at Continental Tyres' data gives some idea of the different load indices which apply to the single fitment of particular sizes of tyre which could be fitted to either of the front two (steering) axles.

(275/70 R22.5 index 148 150 151 or 152)
295/80 R22.5 index 152 or 154
305/70 R22.5 index 150 152 or 154
315/70 R22.5 index 152 154 or 156
315/80 R22.5 index 154 156 or 158

The load relating to the load index numbers has to be looked up either in the tyre manufacturer's data when refers to one tyre or in the HGV tester's manual when it refers to one axle.

As pointed out the actual plated weight of an axle varies according to manufacturer and to the vehicle specification ordered by the original purchaser. The plated weight can differ between axles one and two as can the actual size of tyre.

The information required for the vehicle to pass MOT is detailed on the VTG7.

So the OP should have had a tyre with, minimum, 154 rating for a single wheel as 154 corresponds to 3750kg ?

You would have thought ATS would have at least queried /advised him when fitting a 152 rating, 3550g on the opposite side ? It is stamped on them after all

[cav551]

According to the initial post the away tyre company fitted two tyres, so either one has been changed since or they were not a matching pair. Without trying to defend the tyre company it is possible that the damaged tyres were rated for 7100kg, they went by what came off and although odd for them not to match the 7500kg tyre presents no problem.

[manski]

Yes, that's possible I guess.

[whelmic]

I had a very similar issue on one of my Actros’ with a 8 ton front axle. I had two new tyres fitted by Trucktyre. The truck passed 2 x annual tests, a roadside inspection and PMIs every 6 weeks at a Mercedes main dealer without a problem then failed the third annual test as the tyres were only rated to 3750kg each.

[Kebabkarlos]

Not quite the same but last year I had a truck fail on a tacho seal.

I had the box out to tighten a clutch pack up so after I sent if to my nearest tacho centre. They sealed it and done a record of minor work.

Two months later it failed the test as the tacho wasn't sealed properly. They sealed it cable to sender where as it should have been sealed sender to gearbox (or something like that).

That's the only thing it failed on but thats on my OCRS.

Can't win sometimes.