So where do they park then .
The government is poised to announce new powers to crack down on lorries parking in laybys and residential streets.
Residential streets is one thing, laybys and as pictured in the link industrial estates with no double yellows don’t cause a problem.
Good to see that in the main the comments are favourable and hostility is aimed at the council would seem that even the people of Kent realise that the council is doing nothing, but it is the same throughout the UK, huge distribution centres being built with no thought as to where the drivers are to park.
They could develop manston airfield, instead of just using it for operation stack. Basically the council are taking the easy option as usual, ban all trucks parking and the problem will go to the next county. Extension to airport cafe was rejected!!
There’s money to be made, but they can’t see it,
Yet caravan diesel fairies get left alone when they arrive and park.
biggriffin:
They could develop manston airfield, instead of just using it for operation stack.
Too far a detour from Dover along mostly narrow single-carriageway roads though. There are plenty of fields alongside the M20 which would be far more suitable for lorry parking.
Harry Monk:
biggriffin:
They could develop manston airfield, instead of just using it for operation stack.Too far a detour from Dover along mostly narrow single-carriageway roads though. There are plenty of fields alongside the M20 which would be far more suitable for lorry parking.
Plus i believe the Nimbys at Manston kick off when they thought it would be the parking area for operation stack.
Basically the people of Kent will complain that nothing gets done every time operation stack get implemented or a truck parks near their homes, but they block any plans to build a lorry park.
It’s illegal for anyone to be employed below minimum wage in this country - and yet we put up with our roads crawling with continental drivers earning far less than that. WE should be doing that work, and if that drives up wages due to actual driver shortage - then so be it.
Enough of this pandering to the EU.
Even our own hauliers moving to get us to work more and more hours “off book” to stay legal - needs to stop.
48 hour WTD week? 10 hour WTD Night shift? - What good is THAT if Breaks and POA don’t count towards it?
You can still work 15+15+15+13+13+13 week one with 15+15+15+13+13 on week two for a 155 hour fornight that gets paid as a 96 hour fortnight - all nice and “legal” thanks to the use of Breaks and POA bringing down those totals to legal levels. It bloody well shouldn’t be legal at all pf course! - it’s indentured servitude and now bordering on slavery because rising inflation is moving the cost of living out of reach of all workers on stagnant pay and conditions.
Who actually gets paid “Overtime” for hours worked beyond 48 each week? That’s NOT 48 hours “Paid, on-shift” - but 48 hours AT WORK.
Who gets paid overtime at time and a half among those who DO get paid it?
Who actually has their statutary leave count towards that “qualifying week” towards overtime?
I suggest what used to be the higher payers among transport firms - have crushed their overtime using new “salaried” contracts, and impossible T&Cs to qualify for automatic overtime payments of any decent level.
The lower payers of course - might continue to offer “overtime at single time” to encourage drivers to work 12-15 hours in a shift without getting shirty about it.
It’s about time truckers were paid something approaching what Train drivers get - and for the lot less hours they do as well! 
I’ve often banged on here about “Unpaid POA”. Every time you take a break or book some POA and are salaried - you are extending your working shift - for no extra pay.
Firms avoid “paying” for POA/Break hours - because they fear drivers hanging it out to get automatic overtime on each and every shift.
Maybe it’s time for a driver’s working week to be 3x15 hour shifts then? That would work great for Trampers I’m sure! Home for four days every week! A 45 hour week is quite adequate for all workers, and still represents more hours than what most people have to work in their line of work. If you are on a 15 hour shift, there can be NO hanging it out for extra overtime payments - because the 15 hours represents a limit not a target. Make a driver’s working week for a “Salary” 5x12 hours one week, and 4x9 hours the next week - and you end up with over-runs galore with drivers attempting to cut their own throats by NOT claiming overtime - to stay legal. All of what would be “overtime” hours - now have to be kept off-book. “Forcing the firm to stand you down because of hours” ends up as a disciplinary offence.
FFS Let’s just get on with Brexit already.
muckles:
Harry Monk:
biggriffin:
They could develop manston airfield, instead of just using it for operation stack.Too far a detour from Dover along mostly narrow single-carriageway roads though. There are plenty of fields alongside the M20 which would be far more suitable for lorry parking.
Plus i believe the Nimbys at Manston kick off when they thought it would be the parking area for operation stack.
Basically the people of Kent will complain that nothing gets done every time operation stack get implemented or a truck parks near their homes, but they block any plans to build a lorry park.
That’s what you get when the Nimbys were allowed to beat Farage in the South Thanet election. 
If Kent is planning to shut laybys, Colnbrook Council are planning the same.
They want width restrictions and a new route to access industrial areas.
Local residents are asked to take photos of parked lorries to send to the Council.
toby1234abc:
If Kent is planning to shut laybys, Colnbrook Council are planning the same.
They want width restrictions and a new route to access industrial areas.
Local residents are asked to take photos of parked lorries to send to the Council.
If those trucks have English plates (rather than EU, Scotch, or Irish) then they’ll be busted.
If they are foreigners, a feeble attempt will be made to move them on - just for another foreign truck to take it’s place moments after the “enforcement presence” has left.
A cycle indeed… I wonder just how much time the NIMBYs have to waste on all this?
A hard Brexit could involve:-
(1) Charging foreign trucks £100 at the port of entry.
(2) Banning the carrying of more than 200 litres of fuel in any on-board tanks
(3) Full annual Road Duty payable for any haulier spending more than 30 net truck days per year on British Roads. (so you don’t get around it by swapping around which truck goes to Britain…)
(4) PPE to actually be worn by incoming drivers as the rest of us have to already here. NO more flip flops, no uniform “could be anybody” truckers, and most importantly - truckers must speak a good enough standard of English to understand all road signs, highway code, local bylaws etc. The same would be expected of UK truckers going abroad of course.
(5) Minimum wages to be fully enforced. The clock divisor to start at ferry disembarkation, and stop again when returning to the ferry back to the continent.
(6) No Pseudo “Diplomatic Immunity” when Eurotruckers don’t bother obeying our laws, don’t bother to pay our fines, and the UK authorities get no help whatsoever in recovering amounts payable from defaulting foreign truckers. Where are the huge fines and confiscation orders? - The laws are not being enforced, thanks to EU dictat to “go easy on what’s good for us, but clearly not for the UK”.
Money raised to be spent on Border Guards, Customs Posts, VOSA, Illegal Immigrant Detention Centers, - and of course Lots of shiny new secure parking/truckstop facilities for those few hauliers left who decide to “play it straight” be they British or Foreign in origin.
Winseer:
It’s illegal for anyone to be employed below minimum wage in this country - and yet we put up with our roads crawling with continental drivers earning far less than that. WE should be doing that work, and if that drives up wages due to actual driver shortage - then so be it.Enough of this pandering to the EU.
Even our own hauliers moving to get us to work more and more hours “off book” to stay legal - needs to stop.
48 hour WTD week? 10 hour WTD Night shift? - What good is THAT if Breaks and POA don’t count towards it?
You can still work 15+15+15+13+13+13 week one with 15+15+15+13+13 on week two for a 155 hour fornight that gets paid as a 96 hour fortnight - all nice and “legal” thanks to the use of Breaks and POA bringing down those totals to legal levels. It bloody well shouldn’t be legal at all pf course! - it’s indentured servitude and now bordering on slavery because rising inflation is moving the cost of living out of reach of all workers on stagnant pay and conditions.
Who actually gets paid “Overtime” for hours worked beyond 48 each week? That’s NOT 48 hours “Paid, on-shift” - but 48 hours AT WORK.
Who gets paid overtime at time and a half among those who DO get paid it?
Who actually has their statutary leave count towards that “qualifying week” towards overtime?I suggest what used to be the higher payers among transport firms - have crushed their overtime using new “salaried” contracts, and impossible T&Cs to qualify for automatic overtime payments of any decent level.
The lower payers of course - might continue to offer “overtime at single time” to encourage drivers to work 12-15 hours in a shift without getting shirty about it.It’s about time truckers were paid something approaching what Train drivers get - and for the lot less hours they do as well!
I’ve often banged on here about “Unpaid POA”. Every time you take a break or book some POA and are salaried - you are extending your working shift - for no extra pay.
Firms avoid “paying” for POA/Break hours - because they fear drivers hanging it out to get automatic overtime on each and every shift.
Maybe it’s time for a driver’s working week to be 3x15 hour shifts then? That would work great for Trampers I’m sure! Home for four days every week! A 45 hour week is quite adequate for all workers, and still represents more hours than what most people have to work in their line of work. If you are on a 15 hour shift, there can be NO hanging it out for extra overtime payments - because the 15 hours represents a limit not a target. Make a driver’s working week for a “Salary” 5x12 hours one week, and 4x9 hours the next week - and you end up with over-runs galore with drivers attempting to cut their own throats by NOT claiming overtime - to stay legal. All of what would be “overtime” hours - now have to be kept off-book. “Forcing the firm to stand you down because of hours” ends up as a disciplinary offence.FFS Let’s just get on with Brexit already.
Funny or not but company nothing do illegal.Because in Uk company can absolutely legally pay just national minimum wages for any hours.Plus this nstional minimum wages have reference period whick much longer for two week.
The minimum wage isn’t a salary though, it’s an hourly rate.
If you work 60 hours for £300 per week then - that’s only £5.00ph and that is what I’m saying is bent.
There’s no enforcement on incoming drivers from abroad though.
So much for the happy EU family!
Remainers think we’re going to lose out on workers rights by doing Brexit…
We never had any real rights enforced on our behalf in the first place alas…
In reality, the only workers rights worth having - are the ones the UK put in position FIRST - not the ones we tagged on from the EU.
Brexit won’t mean giving back anything we actually wanted to keep then. It was already ours in the first place, all along! 
There’s a 2 week rolling reference period for salary paid workers regarding the nmw.
An anti thundering menacing juggernaut Nimby must be the saddest humans to roam the Earth.
The image of a Nimby : Has never had ■■■.
Wears a full length Winter coat in the Summer.
Cut cut up by a juggernaut in their Rover on the way to the garden centre .
Has no knowledge of road transport and lorries are a menace to society .
Will ring Jeremy Vine and harp on about noise and emissions .
Their house foundation will collapse when a road is shut and nasty lorries have the audacity to drive by all night to avoid a road closure .
Winseer:
The minimum wage isn’t a salary though, it’s an hourly rate.If you work 60 hours for £300 per week then - that’s only £5.00ph and that is what I’m saying is bent.
There’s no enforcement on incoming drivers from abroad though.
So much for the happy EU family!
Remainers think we’re going to lose out on workers rights by doing Brexit…
We never had any real rights enforced on our behalf in the first place alas…In reality, the only workers rights worth having - are the ones the UK put in position FIRST - not the ones we tagged on from the EU.
Brexit won’t mean giving back anything we actually wanted to keep then. It was already ours in the first place, all along!
0
Pay reference periods
Pay reference periods are usually set by how often someone is paid, for example one week, one month or 10 days. A pay reference period can’t be longer than 31 days.gov.uk/national-minimum-wag … nimum-wage
A worker must be paid the minimum wage, on average, for the time worked in the pay reference period…So if you company use 30 day reference period that you must count you monthly income and divide to you number of hours per month.
Winseer:
The minimum wage isn’t a salary though, it’s an hourly rate.If you work 60 hours for £300 per week then - that’s only £5.00ph and that is what I’m saying is bent.
There’s no enforcement on incoming drivers from abroad though.
So much for the happy EU family!
Remainers think we’re going to lose out on workers rights by doing Brexit…
We never had any real rights enforced on our behalf in the first place alas…In reality, the only workers rights worth having - are the ones the UK put in position FIRST - not the ones we tagged on from the EU.
Brexit won’t mean giving back anything we actually wanted to keep then. It was already ours in the first place, all along!
0
In most country worker have right that in Uk.
Surely it doesn’t matter how long any “reference period” is once a haulier has reached the point of “over-using drivers to work the long hours as cover” because they cannot afford to actually see through the “Correct” way of doing things, such as “Work a driver 60 hours one week, and you should give them a short week of 36 hours the following week”.
No. The average hours 48 thing is over a 17 or 26 week reference period, so that driver ends up being grounded but still at work when they run short of hours.
The average hours for calculating the minimum wage - makes it look even worse if you think about it.
If you spend say, 24 hours between disembarking at Dover and re-boarding having made your round trip to wherever in the UK that driver was tipping…
Bet they are not paid based on the 12-15 hours they’ll actually be running to get the job done! They’ll be paid 10-12 hours. The job cannot be done though, so you work hours 13-15 unpaid - or miss the ferry home!
So you get paid £100 for that day’s pay? - That’s about £6.60 per hour based on the hours you’ve actually been on duty. Around £8.25 per hour if you “off-book” some hours as breaks and POA.
So… If a European incoming driver is getting less than £100 per day - it’s STILL pushing below minimum wages!
Even with the drop in Sterling that has made 110 Euros “Enough”, how many drivers are working 5-6 such shifts per week - and not even getting 2-3 days worth of that money?
Tell me I’m wrong: European drivers coming to the UK to tip earn around 400 Euros per week? What’s the range per the different EU countries of origin?
Who are all these maniacs driving the Dutch-plated Lorries we see a strong rise in the numbers of lately? - Bet they’re not “Dutch”!
The nmw ref period is a rolling two weeks, and works exactly the same as the 90 hrs driving rule. If for example you are paid £375 gross and do 60 hrs in one week, the following week they can only work you for 40 hours, unless they pay more for the extra hours
That’s 100 hours, and as far as I know - you don’t get overtime payments for working illegally over-hours.
…Or all those people working 84 hour weeks would book it as 60, and claim 24 hours overtime that week - right?
In week two, they’d only be able to do 36 hours - but do 84 again (much more POA to take up the slack), and this time book 38 hours overtime! Wow! Nice system if it actually existed anywhere but cloud cuckoo land!
Winseer:
Surely it doesn’t matter how long any “reference period” is once a haulier has reached the point of “over-using drivers to work the long hours as cover” because they cannot afford to actually see through the “Correct” way of doing things, such as “Work a driver 60 hours one week, and you should give them a short week of 36 hours the following week”.No. The average hours 48 thing is over a 17 or 26 week reference period, so that driver ends up being grounded but still at work when they run short of hours.
The average hours for calculating the minimum wage - makes it look even worse if you think about it.If you spend say, 24 hours between disembarking at Dover and re-boarding having made your round trip to wherever in the UK that driver was tipping…
Bet they are not paid based on the 12-15 hours they’ll actually be running to get the job done! They’ll be paid 10-12 hours. The job cannot be done though, so you work hours 13-15 unpaid - or miss the ferry home!So you get paid £100 for that day’s pay? - That’s about £6.60 per hour based on the hours you’ve actually been on duty. Around £8.25 per hour if you “off-book” some hours as breaks and POA.
So… If a European incoming driver is getting less than £100 per day - it’s STILL pushing below minimum wages!
Even with the drop in Sterling that has made 110 Euros “Enough”, how many drivers are working 5-6 such shifts per week - and not even getting 2-3 days worth of that money?
Tell me I’m wrong: European drivers coming to the UK to tip earn around 400 Euros per week? What’s the range per the different EU countries of origin?
Who are all these maniacs driving the Dutch-plated Lorries we see a strong rise in the numbers of lately? - Bet they’re not “Dutch”!
First not one drivers not waut ferry 24 hours.There now no booking time.If you not happy about hours that you must apply to court.And not use POA because POA can be unpaid.But if you not use POA every day that you can work just 3 day per week or 5 day for 9 hours.If drivers do this that we lost to much money.If work just 40 hours that annually can earn 25-30K.If work 60 hours per week that will be 35+.And what most drivers will choise■■?