Crap and/or abusive instructors

Six years ago, I thought that I would have my first crack at becoming a wagon driver. So, with me being young and naive, laid down about £1500 to a well-known Teesside-based training school, without taking an assessment drive at first to see what the instructor was like.

And so, on the first day of my course, the instructor showed me and another lad the motor that we would be taking our training in, a 53-plate MAN with an 8-speed slap-over 'box. He then mentioned that we should have mastered the gearbox within a day or two of training. We then drove the wagon across to the Riverside Stadium and back to the yard a few times so we could get used to it. So far, so good.

However, when we got to the Darlo bypass, things began to go downhill REALLY fast from then on. As I approached the “Reg Vardy” roundabout (where the A66 meets the A167) he said to take the third exit towards the A1. But, somehow, I must have misheard him and took the second exit towards Northallerton instead. He went ballistic, screaming “WHAT ARE YOU DOING?! WHERE ARE YOU [ZB]ING GOING!?!!” We then had to drive through Hurworth and head back to the bypass via a road that was barely wide enough for our 18-tonner. I was really struggling with working the gearbox, especially when “crossing the gate”. He kept shouting “STOP FIGHTING WITH IT!!” each time I tried to change range, his face PURPLE with rage!

At the end of the second day, I was so stressed out with this nutter that I just packed the course in altogether. There was no way that I was going to be ready for my test on the fifth day. In them two days, we did NO reversing practice whatsoever.

Here’s a link to a video of a bloke with a similar personality to my first instructor:

Fast-forward five years, I thought that I would have another go at doing my Cat C. But this time, my second instructor was the polar opposite to the one I had before. We had some really good craic with him, and laughing so hard at his jokes, I thought sooner or later that I was going to crash since I was crying with laughter! I passed first time with him.

Anybody else had a similar experience?

10 years ago decided to do my C+E with the training arm of a very large car dealer in Glasgow…
Paid out similar amount to OP, instructor was so pathetic. Couldn`t stop talking about themself. ( notice how I never said himself) & their skills as an instructor were (zb) poor. Got licenses in TA apparently
Anyway was getting nowhere in jacked it after 2 days despite remonstrating with very large Glasgow car dealer company. Lost money & desire to ever do it again. Been doing class 2 ever since & quite happy

Should`ve hung it out but i have a total intolerance to incompetence.

P.S not …ist in any way. Incompetency comes in all forms.

Many folks still don’t realise that the only qualification legally required to call themselves an instructor is to hold the licence for 3 years. Don’t even need to use it.

This means we have disillusioned lorry drivers, with varying experience, seeking an easier life calling themselves instructors.

So it behoves the candidate to be thorough with the homework. The offerings range from the hypothetical guy above, compete with rusty old lorry that’s been to the moon and back, parked in the corner of someone else’s yard and travelling to goodness knows where to practice reversing. On the other hand, folks like us are fully trained, registered and qualified. We run trucks bought new with training in mind. We have our own reversing area on site which is also part of our own test centre.

O yes, we might be a bit dearer (but not always) but you get what you pay for in this particular case.

Folks should book only on the strongest recommendation. Any queries about us, ask for comments from older forum users.

All the best, Pete

Re garbo’s experience, I wonder if thats the lot who use a lot of ex army instructors as I’ve heard a few stories about them. Think they are still drill sargent rather than teaching a paying recruit.

There are some shocking training sites out there. One uses a corner of our yard with no office or facilities and fairly old trucks but their reversing can be messed up if non of the night drivers get back early enough to shift trailers.

No idea what the instructors are like for the above company which isn’t a million miles from Peter, but cant imagine the costs are much lower than others with even toilet facilities.

trevHCS:
Re garbo’s experience, I wonder if thats the lot who use a lot of ex army instructors as I’ve heard a few stories about them. Think they are still drill sargent rather than teaching a paying recruit.

There are some shocking training sites out there. One uses a corner of our yard with no office or facilities and fairly old trucks but their reversing can be messed up if non of the night drivers get back early enough to shift trailers.

No idea what the instructors are like for the above company which isn’t a million miles from Peter, but cant imagine the costs are much lower than others with even toilet facilities.

He claimed that he was an ex-police response driving instructor. I’ve also heard that he had only one eye, was the dad of the brothers who ran the training firm, and got KO’d during a pub brawl a few years ago!

He claimed that he was an ex-police response driving instructor. I’ve also heard that he had only one eye, was the dad of the brothers who ran the training firm, and got KO’d during a pub brawl a few years ago!

Sounds like the perfect instructor!

Seriously, there are so many horror stories going back over many years, that I would have thought that folks really would do their homework. Part of the issue is brokers who have brilliant sales teams and then farm the work out to the cheapest outfit they can find. So part of the message is to stay clear of brokers. They are easily identified as they claim anywhere between 30 and 60 sites nationwide. NO GENUINE TRAINER HAS THIS COVERAGE. Try to visit your trainer before booking so you can get a “feel” for the outfit and only ever book on rock solid recommendation.

In our case, as forum sponsor, we simply cant afford to get it wrong. It would be all over the net in a heartbeat!

Pete

I’ve had a varying experience with instructors in my quest to acquire all my licences.

I’m in the process of getting the provisional entitlement for lorries and am going through my PCV at the moment (can drive well on lessons but still need to pass a test!) having had the provisional entitlement for 10 years but not done anything with it as have been scheduling buses for most of that time. I am now seeking to change direction completely having mulled over doing so a couple of years back.

I had a number of instructors when getting my car licence - and some of these were shouty/abusive and did nothing to build my confidence - after my first test I ditched one such instructor.

I found a small driving school and had a few lessons with a semi retired lady instructor and then passed on the second go.

I’ve tried three times now to get my PCV - twice with large bus companies and now the third go, self funded with a training school. With both the bus operators I was one of a number of trainees in the bus and my time learning was limited to one/two drives per day and I wasn’t making any progress at all - the barbed comments from the instructors did nothing to build my confidence and in both instances I got nowhere near a test let alone any sort of progress towards taking one.

You begin to have doubts about getting anywhere and that does affect your confidence. I’ve even been told by one such instructor that I’m not a natural driver. The same person then proceeded to tell me how strings were being pulled to keep me there, and that if I was a normal trainee I’d have been sent packing some time ago. With such insight maybe he should consider a career as a motivational speaker?!

So going for a self funded third attempt I was somewhat anxious at what awaited. This anxiety was misplaced. It’s the first time I’ve enjoyed learning to drive and they’ve done a great job of building up my confidence, so much so that I will have no hesitation in going back to them to acquire both my truck licences. I’ve had to travel some distance to go to them, but when I calculate the mileage I’d do crossing the county every day I’d end up covering the same mileage and would be learning in much older vehicles.

It does pay to do homework on where you go before committing - in my case I was coming onto this thread long before I signed up as a member and this informed who I’ve gone with.

Did my cat c about 7 years ago now (at age 44 ish) I’d just got back from new Zealand and was jet lagged after a 24 hour flight ! Yea so that and a shouty instructor and pretty old and tired ERF truck didn’t lead to a pleasant training experience . I did question my own sanity at one point and thought why the hell am I doing this !! . I scraped a pass with 13 minors
After 18 months so about 5 years ago I took Pete smythe up on one of his forum discounts and haven’t looked back . It was actually a pleasure to be trained by Chris at pstt.
Passed with 3 minors

When I took my test, many years ago, I was taught by an ex-raf trained Sgt instructor, He told you once, two hands, then whack across steering wheel, with a wooden ruler, as for using mirrors, a bellowing in the ears “Mirrors boy”, and gawd help you if you clipped a kerb,
Them was different times, today’s modern snowflakes, would be running to mummy, moaning about the bad shouty man . He was a good instructor, had very few fails, he knew how to, curb the enthusiasm of youth,
I passed and he offered me a job, driving one of his own trucks, I declined as I had a job at the time,. Hindsight…

biggriffin I went through wae a fella just like that…a really nice guy outside the cab but he told me before I started the course …“I was spending my hard earned money on him to get me through and he would get me through!!” yup a yardstick for when my hand sat on the stick or a whack on the leg is for feathering the clutch…lol the mirrors boy…ffs takes me back to 81. and a nicey nice instructor wouldny done me as I had a chip on both shoulders them days wae an attitude tae match hehe that lasted about two days after I passed and a machine operator built like a [ZB]house cured that.

biggriffin:
When I took my test, many years ago, I was taught by an ex-raf trained Sgt instructor, He told you once, two hands, then whack across steering wheel, with a wooden ruler, as for using mirrors, a bellowing in the ears “Mirrors boy”, and gawd help you if you clipped a kerb,
Them was different times, today’s modern snowflakes, would be running to mummy, moaning about the bad shouty man . He was a good instructor, had very few fails, he knew how to, curb the enthusiasm of youth,
I passed and he offered me a job, driving one of his own trucks, I declined as I had a job at the time,. Hindsight…

Sounds similar to the old boy who I did my tests with, he had retired a few years before at 65 but kept a truck to earn some extra coin by doing training. He was a real cantankerous grumpy ■■■■■■■ but got me through both tests, and some of his stories about “the old days” used to have me in stitches. He probably wouldn’t last 5 minutes today without being pulled up for some sort of ism or another

I recognise the fella your describing Garbo.Indeed he is the dad of the firms owners.In fact i’m sure he started it up himself.

He trained me on class 2

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He was ok with me as i was a bus driver so was used to the size of the truck but he gave the other lad abit of a hard time

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Garbo2018:
Six years ago, I thought that I would have my first crack at becoming a wagon driver. So, with me being young and naive, laid down about £1500 to a well-known Teesside-based training school, without taking an assessment drive at first to see what the instructor was like.

Being from the area and potentially doing my training next year, can I ask which training school the abusive instructor was from, and which firm you passed with 5 years later?

Or you can PM me if you don’t want to say on a public forum.

Thanks!

biggriffin:
When I took my test, many years ago, I was taught by an ex-raf trained Sgt instructor, He told you once, two hands, then whack across steering wheel, with a wooden ruler, as for using mirrors, a bellowing in the ears “Mirrors boy”, and gawd help you if you clipped a kerb,
Them was different times, today’s modern snowflakes, would be running to mummy, moaning about the bad shouty man . He was a good instructor, had very few fails, he knew how to, curb the enthusiasm of youth,
I passed and he offered me a job, driving one of his own trucks, I declined as I had a job at the time,. Hindsight…

I’m no snowflake but if he can’t teach without yelling or being aggressive I would question how in control he is.

I did both of my tests at PSTT and no shouting or abuse and I passed both so do question why some need to do so

I did both of my tests at PSTT and no shouting or abuse and I passed both so do question why some need to do so

Some so-called instructors shout and yell and that is very much a failing on their part. Our instructors, on the other hand, are carefully selected for their people skills, are fully trained and continually updated in instructional techniques and their skills and ability are regularly monitored and assessed for their ongoing suitability for employment with us. Half of our trainers have done the 15 year mark with us with others following close up behind, so they really have been through the mill many times. All this is for the benefit of our customers and, as a direct result, for the benefit of our reputation. Any instructor employed by us is fully aware that shouting at a candidate or being abusive is a sackable offence.

I get really annoyed that we put all this effort in to produce a first class product but “matey boy” down the road with a tatty old truck, no facilities and no instructor training is able to relieve folks of their hard earned. It’s simply immoral in my book. Booked another person only this morning who has lost just over £2k by choosing to go with the cheaper option. Cheaper haha!

Rant over,

Pete

I didn’t have a shouty instructor just everything I said or suggested to improve learning he dismissed ( 1st instructor on class 1 many years ago ) he is also a bit of know all done everything been everywhere type so take most of what he say with a pinch of salt

Now he has changed jobs has class 1 drivers I do work for him sometimes to cover always ask for me

Am a bit surprised that nowadays you seem not to have to be qualified to instruct.

20 years ago when I became an instructor I took the RTITB course which was pretty stiff - if I remember right it was around six days training which included a driving test for 90 mins (single track country lanes to city centres, I got three minors), a Highway Code test (50 questions) where 79% was a fail but also I had to give a lecture to 30 lads on the rights and wrongs of negotiating roundabouts and T junctions for about 45 mins with the RTITB guy sat at the back. I was also assessed on how I communicated with others, whether I was clear and precise, calm and settling to the nervous.

I passed first shot but only just - I only got just over 80% in the Highway Code questions.

All a bit different now , it seems.

Not that different! RTITB still exists under the name of NRI. I believe their process is pretty much unchanged. I choose to be part of National Vocational Driving Instructor Register.
The qualification process is a theory test comprising 5 papers of 20 questions each. One of these is purely about instructional technique. The others are standard theory test questions. Then we have a 90 minute drive with a maximum of 5 driving faults allowed. The mark goes down quicker than on a standard test. During the drive we have a section of approximately 10 minutes commentary drive. This also takes the place of the hazard perception test.
Then a test of instructional ability. This can be a “live” lesson with a genuine candidate at any stage. Generally, the examiner will act as a stooge, giving the wannabee instructor a minimal amount of prior information. It then relies on the instructor to use effective question and answer to gain the full picture. From there, the instructor has just a few seconds to formulate an effective and totally appropriate lesson plan which is then delivered over 90 minutes.

It’s tough, very tough. But it’s a great feeling when you’re told you’ve passed!

But, as I’ve said hundreds of times, there is zero requirement, legally, for any “instructor” to put themselves through the process. It’s a shame as there are some perfectly sound unregistered instructors. For the customer, how do you find them? And, in the meantime, buyer beware!

Pete